Another school shooting

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

DNR

are guns illegal yet?

Pretty much in NY.  Find out tomorrow about everywhere else.  I don't have any guns but this is a bit concerning.  Also, if he is really going to announce these proposals surrounded by kids..... I mean, I don't even.

I find it ironic that the dem's are so adamant to 'protect da' children'. Yet Abortion is no biggie cause that involves CHOICES!
 

Death row inmates deserve to live too though.

Yep, I bet all of the criminals that use guns for criminal things are pissed now that they can do less criminal things with their guns.

Are felons going to be forced to give up their guns?!?!??? I bet all of them that voted for Obama are doubly pissed.

[puniraptor]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/14/1178971/-Don-t-Ban-Assault-Weapons

An article that I saw on facebook that I thought would be birther-style, but was actually a decent gun control proposal that I would agree with.

Forget about any attempt banning the "assault weapons" themselves and focus on limiting magazine capacity. 5 rounds max for rifles and 10 rounds max for handguns.

Offer a amnesty/buyback period for high cap mags after which any remaining high capacity mags are in violation and subject to fine and confiscation.

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

[Stupid Fitz]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/14/1178971/-Don-t-Ban-Assault-Weapons

An article that I saw on facebook that I thought would be birther-style, but was actually a decent gun control proposal that I would agree with.

Forget about any attempt banning the "assault weapons" themselves and focus on limiting magazine capacity. 5 rounds max for rifles and 10 rounds max for handguns.

Offer a amnesty/buyback period for high cap mags after which any remaining high capacity mags are in violation and subject to fine and confiscation.

I think they should just ban doing illegal things with guns. 

[Stupid Fitz]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

Like a real assault rifle or what the media says is an "assault rifle"???

I don't know the answer to either

[puniraptor]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

Like a real assault rifle or what the media says is an "assault rifle"???

I don't know the answer to either

Play a video game and then you will know.

[Unruly]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

about 1.5-2 seconds.

[Emo EMAW]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

So it looks like the magazine limitation thing is just to look like something is being done and won't affect anything. A wacko killer will just need to carry more magazines.

[Emo EMAW]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

So it looks like the magazine limitation thing is just to look like something is being done and won't affect anything. A wacko killer will just need to carry more magazines.

Pretty much.  Or:

1.  There's already a ton of 20 or 30 round mags on the street, not hard to get them.
2.  Manufacturers will come out with a kit to piece together your own high cap magazine from smaller 10 round magazine.  This will happen, no doubt.  They always find a way.

[Stupid Fitz]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

So it looks like the magazine limitation thing is just to look like something is being done and won't affect anything. A wacko killer will just need to carry more magazines.

Pretty much.  Or:

1.  There's already a ton of 20 or 30 round mags on the street, not hard to get them.
2.  Manufacturers will come out with a kit to piece together your own high cap magazine from smaller 10 round magazine.  This will happen, no doubt.  They always find a way.

Or they will just keep using the same things since they are criminals or crazy people that don't follow the laws anyway.

[Emo EMAW]

I've never shot an assault rifle, but how long does it take to change a magazine, maybe a half second?

So it looks like the magazine limitation thing is just to look like something is being done and won't affect anything. A wacko killer will just need to carry more magazines.

Pretty much.  Or:

1.  There's already a ton of 20 or 30 round mags on the street, not hard to get them.
2.  Manufacturers will come out with a kit to piece together your own high cap magazine from smaller 10 round magazine.  This will happen, no doubt.  They always find a way.

Or they will just keep using the same things since they are criminals or crazy people that don't follow the laws anyway.

Ya that's what I meant by point 1. 

[michigancat]

The logic that "large clips are already out there so making future sales illegal will do nothing" is baffling to me.

[Institutional Control]

The logic that "large clips are already out there so making future sales illegal will do nothing" is baffling to me.

+
Hey, nothing can be done so let's do nothing.

[Emo EMAW]

The logic that "large clips are already out there so making future sales illegal will do nothing" is baffling to me.

I can see that.  These nut jobs are usually anti-social so branching out to get them might be a risk and tough for them to do.  Certainly easier to buy online.  But believe you me, whatever the spec is on what is illegal, the manufacturers will find a way around it.  They just will. 

[puniraptor]

Each magazine change is an opportunity for error especially in a chaotic situation. and its not like these people are trained soldiers either.

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

Each magazine change is an opportunity for error especially in a chaotic situation. and its not like these people are trained soldiers either.

It's not a chaotic situation to an insane person, which they all are.

[michigancat]

Very reasonable IMO:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/01/09/a-gun-control-debate-with-matt-springer/

[Emo EMAW]

Very reasonable IMO:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/01/09/a-gun-control-debate-with-matt-springer/

Not very reasonable.  Maybe somewhat reasonable, somewhat unreasonable.

[Stevesie60]

How hilarious would it be if someone shot all the main NRA activists with completely legal guns? Like, what would the rest of the NRA say about it?

[michigancat]

Very reasonable IMO:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/01/09/a-gun-control-debate-with-matt-springer/

Not very reasonable.  Maybe somewhat reasonable, somewhat unreasonable.

Which of his proposals were particularly unreasonable, and why?

[Emo EMAW]

How hilarious would it be if someone shot all the main NRA activists with completely legal guns? Like, what would the rest of the NRA say about it?

It would only prove their point I guess.

[Emo EMAW]

Very reasonable IMO:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/01/09/a-gun-control-debate-with-matt-springer/

Not very reasonable.  Maybe somewhat reasonable, somewhat unreasonable.

Which of his proposals were particularly unreasonable, and why?

3. The 2nd amendment protects us from tyranny.

Again, total fantasy. This is the big lie. There are any number of countries that don’t have our gun craziness that are not run by dictators. Tyranny is yelled so soon, and so often in these discussions that it’s meaningless. On my gun control thread the same person said that guns prevent tyranny and a minute later was talking about how Obama was a tyrant. Anyone see a problem with this? The idea that the US is anywhere near a tyrannical dictatorship is a joke. You people who think this are unreasonable and not worth arguing with, and should really consider looking at countries that actually have tyranny before getting on your free internet, in your free society, where you are free to buy hand cannons, monster trucks, and everyone has the right to vote, and you can chose any job you want, and go anywhere you want or even leave when you want, and start crying tyranny (and guess what – real tyrants don’t let you call them tyrants).

Also, the idea we can stand up to the US military? This is a legitimate threat to the military in the year 2013? Our military so far outclasses us that there is no chance some 10, or 100, or even 1000 person militia armed with AR-15s will be anything but a passing inconvenience. If a truly immoral tyrant came to power, in charge of a nuclear arsenal, sky robots, tanks and aircraft carriers, you aren’t going to stop them with your rifle. Red Dawn was not a documentary people, and you’re again in a fantasy world.

[michigancat]

Very reasonable IMO:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/01/09/a-gun-control-debate-with-matt-springer/

Not very reasonable.  Maybe somewhat reasonable, somewhat unreasonable.

Which of his proposals were particularly unreasonable, and why?

3. The 2nd amendment protects us from tyranny.

Again, total fantasy. This is the big lie. There are any number of countries that don’t have our gun craziness that are not run by dictators. Tyranny is yelled so soon, and so often in these discussions that it’s meaningless. On my gun control thread the same person said that guns prevent tyranny and a minute later was talking about how Obama was a tyrant. Anyone see a problem with this? The idea that the US is anywhere near a tyrannical dictatorship is a joke. You people who think this are unreasonable and not worth arguing with, and should really consider looking at countries that actually have tyranny before getting on your free internet, in your free society, where you are free to buy hand cannons, monster trucks, and everyone has the right to vote, and you can chose any job you want, and go anywhere you want or even leave when you want, and start crying tyranny (and guess what – real tyrants don’t let you call them tyrants).

Also, the idea we can stand up to the US military? This is a legitimate threat to the military in the year 2013? Our military so far outclasses us that there is no chance some 10, or 100, or even 1000 person militia armed with AR-15s will be anything but a passing inconvenience. If a truly immoral tyrant came to power, in charge of a nuclear arsenal, sky robots, tanks and aircraft carriers, you aren’t going to stop them with your rifle. Red Dawn was not a documentary people, and you’re again in a fantasy world.

That's not one of his proposals.

[eastcat]

To say there are a "ton" of 20 and 30 round mags already in existence would be an understatement. We are talking over 100 million, probably more.

We already had an 'assault' weapons ban from 1994 till 2004 IT DIDN'T WORK.


Violent crime and mental health is the problem. People are always going to get guns, it's a genie that can't be put back in the bottle. Look at Mexico, total ban on guns for private citizens. Most gun violence in the western hemisphere.

Dropping a mag and throwing another into the well takes literally a second, it won't stop a damn thing. The people making these laws have no firearms experience at all and haven't the slightest rough ridin' idea as to what they are talking about or doing.

Also, the idea we can stand up to the US military? This is a legitimate threat to the military in the year 2013? Our military so far outclasses us that there is no chance some 10, or 100, or even 1000 person militia armed with AR-15s will be anything but a passing inconvenience. If a truly immoral tyrant came to power, in charge of a nuclear arsenal, sky robots, tanks and aircraft carriers, you aren’t going to stop them with your rifle. Red Dawn was not a documentary people, and you’re again in a fantasy world.

Really? Some guys in Afghanistan who can't even read would disagree with you, Along with every other invasion force that has tried to take it over.

Alexander The GReat
Genghis Khan
Timur
Mughal Empire
Russian Tsars
Royal Army
Soviet Army
U.S. Army

An insurgency is the best defense in the history of man kind.