Zimmerman gets a stand-your-ground hearing

[HeinBallz]

I'm done with this.   You're clearly trying to paint me as something I'm not.   FTR, you've revealed yourself as someone that is no different than TM or GZ as you've illustrated your ability to cast judgements and assertions based off of your vague and unclear perceptions.  I'll maintain that you shouldn't judge a person based off misconstrued sinister actions when they could be completely innocent in nature - something each party was guilty of.  Maybe GZ was running up to ask him what TM was doing - you don't know - there has been no trial.   At the end of the day, an innocent kid is dead. - It's sad - but innocent people die all the time.  Where is the heartfelt sorrow & bickering/anger/outrage at the thousands of people that die every day?  Why has this one become such a big deal?

What do you think I'm trying to paint you as?  I'm not trying to paint you as anything.  What I am doing is attacking you for calling TM a douchebag for defending himself because he was being chased in the dark by someone who didn't identify themself and trying to put him in the same boat as the guy who had a 60+pound advantage and still felt the need to shoot him in the chest, eventhough there was enough separation between the two he got off a clean shot to the chest.  I have no idea how you can say "I'm no different than TM" and mean that as an insult. 


You keep defending GZ by saying we don't have the facts because their hasn't been a trial, but you keep damning TM...but hey, keep attacking me for passing judgement GZ, you clearly haven't on TM

Well damn... I know I'd said I was done - but you sucked me back in.   I suggest you're painting me as something because you won't let my opinion go and you're twisting what I say into crap no one would agree with.  I have no clue what you're agenda is - but you've taken offense to my opinion that you're condemning someone before knowing any facts at all.  FTR, you were attacking me long before I called TM a douchebag.  Also, I'm not defending GZ - I'm just failing to persecute him -There is a tremendous difference.  I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   But seriously - you're taking the term douchebag too seriously...  it's not a condemnation of their souls or painting them as evil.   It's merely an observation; perhaps bonehead would be a better word?

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and may you live the rest of your life without reason to mistrust anyone.

[TheHamburglar]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

[Emo EMAW]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

The kid was 6'3", more like 180 pounds.  He wasn't the little boy the media makes him out to be.

[TheHamburglar]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

The kid was 6'3", more like 180 pounds.  He wasn't the little boy the media makes him out to be.

Sorry, my 140-pound comment was wrong, he was 5'11", 158-pounds according to his autopsy...that changes everything, since he was 158 lbs 17-year old, not 140 lbs a 17-year old, then they are both equally responsible for the miscommunication that resulted in him being shot in the chest.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/a-review-of-the-evidence-released-in-the-trayvon-martin-case/1230750

[HeinBallz]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

Forgive me for not making myself clear.  Equal footing in that they both resorted to violence out of mistrust - not equal in physical stature.  But if you do want to go down that path, the "140 pound 17 year old" kid seemed to be holding his own until the gun came out.

FWIW, My son knows it is wrong to racially profile and chase someone that appears to be minding their own business - just as he knows it is wrong to physically attack someone that has not physically attacked him. I have witnessed him engage in conversation with people attempting to bully him - and watched as he deflates their ignorance.   He's also really good at pointing out hypocrites... something I'm trying to become better at myself.

[HeinBallz]

And btw - the "you're just like TM" is not an insult... just an observation at how you jump to conclusions and immediately condemn someone without any understanding or perspective. 

[Emo EMAW]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

The kid was 6'3", more like 180 pounds.  He wasn't the little boy the media makes him out to be.

Sorry, my 140-pound comment was wrong, he was 5'11", 158-pounds according to his autopsy...that changes everything, since he was 158 lbs 17-year old, not 140 lbs a 17-year old, then they are both equally responsible for the miscommunication that resulted in him being shot in the chest.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/a-review-of-the-evidence-released-in-the-trayvon-martin-case/1230750

I had heard differently, thanks for the correction.  Pretty impressive if he was able to beat up GZ at that size.

[TheHamburglar]

I've put them on equal footing in douchebag status because they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way to prevent someone from getting shot or their "ass kicked".   

My point is that I keep attacking you because you continue to make comments like this.  They are not on equal footing.  One was a 200+ pound, 28-year old man who was carrying a gun, knew he was carrying a gun and started the confrontation.  The other was a 17-year old, 140 pound, unarmed kid being followed in the dark by an adult who failed to identify who he was.  Yet you make comments that they are on equal footing that they were two adults that failed to communicate in an effective way.  I can't help but respond because you make such stupid comments like this one and "you're just like TM" and mean that as an insult. 

I hope you have a wonderful weekend and no one ever chases your 17-year old son around the neighboorhood in the dark.

The kid was 6'3", more like 180 pounds.  He wasn't the little boy the media makes him out to be.

Sorry, my 140-pound comment was wrong, he was 5'11", 158-pounds according to his autopsy...that changes everything, since he was 158 lbs 17-year old, not 140 lbs a 17-year old, then they are both equally responsible for the miscommunication that resulted in him being shot in the chest.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/a-review-of-the-evidence-released-in-the-trayvon-martin-case/1230750

I had heard differently, thanks for the correction.  Pretty impressive if he was able to beat up GZ at that size.

If funny what adrenaline will do to a 17 year old kid when they are being chased in the dark by an unidentified adult.  Of course, he must not have been kicking GZ's ass that bad if GZ was able to get his gun between the two of them and get off a shot to the heart.

[TheHamburglar]

And btw - the "you're just like TM" is not an insult... just an observation at how you jump to conclusions and immediately condemn someone without any understanding or perspective.

How dare that 17-year old not have any understanding or perspective while being chased in the dark by an unidentified adult. 

BTW, we aren't that far off on alot of this, our only difference is the line at which you have the right to physically defend yourself from a percieved physical threat.  I content that line is cross when being chased in the dark by someone who fails to identify themself or their purpose in chasing you.  At that point, there is no burden on the individual being chased to make sure there isn't a lack of communication. 

[HeinBallz]

And btw - the "you're just like TM" is not an insult... just an observation at how you jump to conclusions and immediately condemn someone without any understanding or perspective.

How dare that 17-year old not have any understanding or perspective while being chased in the dark by an unidentified adult. 

BTW, we aren't that far off on alot of this, our only difference is the line at which you have the right to physically defend yourself from a percieved physical threat.  I content that line is cross when being chased in the dark by someone who fails to identify themself or their purpose in chasing you.  At that point, there is no burden on the individual being chased to make sure there isn't a lack of communication.

You're right, we're not that far off.  But here's the difference from where I see it.  You're asserting that only 1 person is to blame in this - I'm stating they're both to blame for this.  You can make the argument of how dare this kid not be able to defend himself just as easily as I can say how dare that man not be able to defend himself when he's getting his ass kicked. 


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

[EMAWesome]

All I know is the NRA thinks this would never have happened if both people had guns. 

[michigancat]

I don't think I'll ever try to kick someone's ass. I could probably talk my way out of most situations .

[michigancat]

Also I don't think I would be very good at kicking someone's ass.

[Cire]

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

Maybe not a trial, but at least a hearing in front of a judge.

[Cire]

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

Maybe not a trial, but at least a hearing in front of a judge.

yeah, but I don't trust activist judges.

[Rage Against the McKee]

And btw - the "you're just like TM" is not an insult... just an observation at how you jump to conclusions and immediately condemn someone without any understanding or perspective.

How dare that 17-year old not have any understanding or perspective while being chased in the dark by an unidentified adult. 

BTW, we aren't that far off on alot of this, our only difference is the line at which you have the right to physically defend yourself from a percieved physical threat.  I content that line is cross when being chased in the dark by someone who fails to identify themself or their purpose in chasing you.  At that point, there is no burden on the individual being chased to make sure there isn't a lack of communication.

You're right, we're not that far off.  But here's the difference from where I see it.  You're asserting that only 1 person is to blame in this - I'm stating they're both to blame for this.  You can make the argument of how dare this kid not be able to defend himself just as easily as I can say how dare that man not be able to defend himself when he's getting his ass kicked. 


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

So you are saying that you think both are to blame but only TM deserves any punishment?

[Rage Against the McKee]

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

I agree. Nobody would know about or care about this case if the police had just done their job in the first place.

[HeinBallz]

So you are saying that you think both are to blame but only TM deserves any punishment?

Punishment?  How will punishment prevent something like this from happening in the future?  How will it bring TM back?  I'm saying, it's irritating that events like this turn into a witch hunt trial - when it's a clear reflection of the illness within society and anger & fear were to blame - something each person was guilty of.  Understand when I say fear, I mean mistrust.

FTR, I think GZ deserves jail-time... but focusing solely on GZ & what he did wrong will not solve anything.

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

I agree. Nobody would know about or care about this case if the police had just done their job in the first place.

This should be the biggest issue - but it's not.

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

So you are saying that you think both are to blame but only TM deserves any punishment?

Punishment?  How will punishment prevent something like this from happening in the future?  How will it bring TM back?  I'm saying, it's irritating that events like this turn into a witch hunt trial - when it's a clear reflection of the illness within society and anger & fear were to blame - something each person was guilty of.  Understand when I say fear, I mean mistrust.

FTR, I think GZ deserves jail-time... but focusing solely on GZ & what he did wrong will not solve anything.

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

I agree. Nobody would know about or care about this case if the police had just done their job in the first place.

This should be the biggest issue - but it's not.

Again, I'm not defending GZ or the police, but the police may have done their job if he is found to have legally "stood his ground".

[Rage Against the McKee]

So you are saying that you think both are to blame but only TM deserves any punishment?

Punishment?  How will punishment prevent something like this from happening in the future?  How will it bring TM back?  I'm saying, it's irritating that events like this turn into a witch hunt trial - when it's a clear reflection of the illness within society and anger & fear were to blame - something each person was guilty of.  Understand when I say fear, I mean mistrust.

FTR, I think GZ deserves jail-time... but focusing solely on GZ & what he did wrong will not solve anything.

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

I agree. Nobody would know about or care about this case if the police had just done their job in the first place.

This should be the biggest issue - but it's not.

Again, I'm not defending GZ or the police, but the police may have done their job if he is found to have legally "stood his ground".

Do you really want the police making that determination?

[Cire]

So you are saying that you think both are to blame but only TM deserves any punishment?

Punishment?  How will punishment prevent something like this from happening in the future?  How will it bring TM back?  I'm saying, it's irritating that events like this turn into a witch hunt trial - when it's a clear reflection of the illness within society and anger & fear were to blame - something each person was guilty of.  Understand when I say fear, I mean mistrust.

FTR, I think GZ deserves jail-time... but focusing solely on GZ & what he did wrong will not solve anything.

If one person shoots and kills another person with a gun it should always go to trial.  IMO

I agree. Nobody would know about or care about this case if the police had just done their job in the first place.

This should be the biggest issue - but it's not.

Again, I'm not defending GZ or the police, but the police may have done their job if he is found to have legally "stood his ground".

Do you really want the police making that determination?

yeah, maybe not trial but at least grand jury.

[8manpick]

So if we give that GZ had the right to use his gun to defend himself, do we really think it was okay to shoot him in the chest for a killshot?  I'm sure it all happened fast and all, but I would imagine that if he had told TM that he was going to shoot him, then TM would have stopped, or GZ could have at least shot him in the leg or arm or anywhere that he would have a chance of surviving.  I dunno. I think its all pretty mumped up. If GZ didn't have a gun, then neither of them are dead today.  I don't think that is really debatable.

[HeinBallz]

If GZ didn't have a gun, then neither of them are dead today.  I don't think that is really debatable.

Do you really want to go down that rabbit hole?

[michigancat]

If GZ didn't have a gun, then neither of them are dead today.  I don't think that is really debatable.

Do you really want to go down that rabbit hole?

he would have just 3d printed a gun. can't control people.