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Quote from: Emo EMAW on August 27, 2014, 04:27:02 PMI mean if cops show up in my neighborhood with riot gear on, I don't rock/bottle their asses, I call mayor and complain. I might even move and pay property taxes elsewhere.What if their guns are pointed at you while you are peacefully assembled with a group of like-minded people?
I mean if cops show up in my neighborhood with riot gear on, I don't rock/bottle their asses, I call mayor and complain. I might even move and pay property taxes elsewhere.
I'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997. LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers. After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit. If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed. I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure. But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry.
Quote from: Emo EMAW on August 27, 2014, 03:12:12 PMI'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997. LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers. After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit. If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed. I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure. But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry. Also, I looked this up and 2 people died. (the shooters). So what a dumb rough ridin' reason to militarize cops.
Long gone are the days of your friendly neighborhood cop showing up to talk a person down who has hit a low point in life. Now the mentally ill are seemingly serving as target practice for these heavily militarized police forces across the country.Read more at http://thefreethoughtproject.com/ottawa-police-shoot-unarmed-teen-16-times-family-begs/#GVsTWPy3xQ61OK6V.99
I agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/toddler-critically-burned-during-swat-raid/nf9SJ/How's this example. Swat/No Knock Raids have no reason to be used in drug searches.
Quote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.
Quote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 05:22:16 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.I agree it's related. I think we ought to look more at statistics though (so I need to go back and look at that graphic posted earlier). We live in a big populous country, and bad crap is going to happen pretty much err day even in a perfect world. I hate these knee-jerky reactions people have whenever something newsworthy happens.
Quote from: Emo EMAW on August 27, 2014, 05:26:45 PMQuote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 05:22:16 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.I agree it's related. I think we ought to look more at statistics though (so I need to go back and look at that graphic posted earlier). We live in a big populous country, and bad crap is going to happen pretty much err day even in a perfect world. I hate these knee-jerky reactions people have whenever something newsworthy happens.like when you tried to justify nationwide militarization of police based on a shooting that ended with only the criminals being killed?
Were the guns and armor and stuff that LA guy(s) used legal to own?
Quote from: steve dave on August 27, 2014, 05:36:21 PMWere the guns and armor and stuff that LA guy(s) used legal to own?I think some yes and some no. Obviously they weren't hard to get, anyway.
It was speculated that Phillips had legally purchased two of the AK-47s and then illegally converted them to full automatic. However, as Phillips was a convicted felon it was not possible for him to legally purchase firearms.[15][30][31]
Quote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 05:22:16 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.They're two different problems with two different solutions. Focusing on the latter, more tangible, easier to fix problem takes attention away from the former, which seems like a much worse problem to me.
Quote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:57:34 PMQuote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 05:22:16 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.They're two different problems with two different solutions. Focusing on the latter, more tangible, easier to fix problem takes attention away from the former, which seems like a much worse problem to me.I feel my attention is adequately focused on both. Or more accurately, I'll treat them equally, (as in do nothing but talk about it). But I agree that the use of excessive force is a bigger problem.
Quote from: 8manpick on August 27, 2014, 04:29:42 PMQuote from: Emo EMAW on August 27, 2014, 04:27:02 PMI mean if cops show up in my neighborhood with riot gear on, I don't rock/bottle their asses, I call mayor and complain. I might even move and pay property taxes elsewhere.What if their guns are pointed at you while you are peacefully assembled with a group of like-minded people?I'd go home. Not worth getting shot over. I mean I'd probably take some cell phone pics or whatever and try to get them distributed. Again call mayor, complain, and move if I have to.
lol
Quote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 06:18:09 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:57:34 PMQuote from: michigancat on August 27, 2014, 05:22:16 PMQuote from: chum1 on August 27, 2014, 05:03:48 PMI agree with EMO that the subject largely got changed from police using excessive force and shooting people to police equipment, which don't seem all that closely related.It was closely related in Ferguson. And I think it's closely related overall because it deals with two big problems with law enforcement in the country that probably need widespread change.They're two different problems with two different solutions. Focusing on the latter, more tangible, easier to fix problem takes attention away from the former, which seems like a much worse problem to me.I feel my attention is adequately focused on both. Or more accurately, I'll treat them equally, (as in do nothing but talk about it). But I agree that the use of excessive force is a bigger problem.There would't be investgations and such without the attention.