StL County Cops Shoot Teen

[SkinnyBenny]

I'd complain about a double-standard in the media when it comes to allegations of racism, but why bother? There's a lot of libtards out there that don't believe black against white prejudice meets the definition of "racism." Whatever, arguing that point is futile.

This whole thread has become a nauseating bitchfest about perceived racism. I think it's a pretty safe assumption that sometimes black people are unfairly targeted/treated by cops. I also think a legitimate argument can be made that whites and black alike place less value on black lives. But in this particular case, none of this results in a dead teenager if that teenage doesn't behave like a thug and attack a cop. That's the part Brown had control over - his own conduct.

K-S-U when you heard about the Michael Brown shooting and anticipated this thread did your boner touch the moon?

[MakeItRain]

Do you idiots have any idea just how many times cops shoot unarmed citizens of any race and it doesn't become national news? I put a link in this thread like 10 days ago of LAPD shooting and killing an unarmed black man who was mentally handicapped, no one batted an eye. I really don't understand the stupid strawman that the libtard media will only talk about this when it happens to a black person and every time it happens it is national news, cut the crap. This Michael Brown story didn't become news when it happened, it became news when the citizens started to protest, some started to riot, the media got wind of the history of Ferguson PD and its citizens, and the FPD and STL Sheriff's started arresting media members. Cops shooting people has absolutely become "Dog Bites Man." The Brown/Ferguson story has several elements that are "Man Bites Dog."

I'm going to get all foxnews-y for a second.....are we going to talk about stuff like this?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2734860/Ex-Marine-left-brain-injury-pal-told-Waffle-House-wasn-t-safe-following-Ferguson-case-attacked-mob-20-people-parking-lot.html

I can't believe I'm engaging you again, this won't end well. Anyway, two questions;
1. What is there for "we" to talk about? I don't think anyone is going to make excuses for this man being beaten. No one made excuses for looting in Ferguson, no one will make excuses for me driving 20 MPH over the speed limit earlier today. Plenty of excuses given though for a cop shooting an unarmed citizen though.
2. Why are you posting that in here, it has nothing to do what we're talking about. Is this now a catch-all-thread for crime? Is this a plea for whites who are victim of crime to get equal billing? I'm reading you placing this link here like you did, with whatever getting all foxnews-y means, essentially the same thing as saying this

I'd complain about a double-standard in the media when it comes to allegations of racism, but why bother? There's a lot of libtards out there that don't believe black against white prejudice meets the definition of "racism." Whatever, arguing that point is futile.

This whole thread has become a nauseating bitchfest about perceived racism. I think it's a pretty safe assumption that sometimes black people are unfairly targeted/treated by cops. I also think a legitimate argument can be made that whites and black alike place less value on black lives. But in this particular case, none of this results in a dead teenager if that teenage doesn't behave like a thug and attack a cop. That's the part Brown had control over - his own conduct.

The bolded portion of this post is just utterly hilarious bullshit and you know it. I have never in my life heard anyone worth listening to, that black people can't be racist against white people. That is comically dumb, and an unnecessary diversion to the conversation you are attempting to have. I've heard that once in my life and it was Kevin telling Julie that on the first season of the real world, since then he's said he was wrong about that.

Why, when talking about race, can't you just say that racism exists, it's prevalent, and white privilege is real? Your second paragraph starts to address it but then it is parsed and suddenly jumps back into Brown being a thug. Your post reads like, "yeah there's racism and it isn't right, but racism won't stop until they can stop being thugs."

[Emo EMAW]

Guys, people are free to be racists. 

[michigancat]

Do you idiots have any idea just how many times cops shoot unarmed citizens of any race and it doesn't become national news? I put a link in this thread like 10 days ago of LAPD shooting and killing an unarmed black man who was mentally handicapped, no one batted an eye. I really don't understand the stupid strawman that the libtard media will only talk about this when it happens to a black person and every time it happens it is national news, cut the crap. This Michael Brown story didn't become news when it happened, it became news when the citizens started to protest, some started to riot, the media got wind of the history of Ferguson PD and its citizens, and the FPD and STL Sheriff's started arresting media members. Cops shooting people has absolutely become "Dog Bites Man." The Brown/Ferguson story has several elements that are "Man Bites Dog."

This is a great point. I've mentioned a couple times how there is no one officially tracking cops killing people. There's this unofficial site that started last May that has found almost 1500 (which averages to about 1100/year).

https://www.facebook.com/KilledByPolice

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/another-much-higher-count-of-police-homicides/

good for the people of Ferguson for drawing attention to this.

[sonofdaxjones]

I am glad that the militarization of the police in this country is being discussed at the highest levels now.   I fully agree that police should have powerful weapons but those weapons need only be brought out when facing the most dangerous of criminals and only operated by the most highly trained and competently led personnel . . . which includes psychological stability.   Just to many Baney Fife's with a bullet chomping at the bit to play with their new toys.

[steve dave]

off duty cop walks up to kid in car with his gun drawn, kid takes off, he guns him down, no charges.

http://abc13.com/news/navasota-officer-wont-face-charges-for-fatally-shooting-teen/281936/

[michigancat]

off duty cop walks up to kid in car with his gun drawn, kid takes off, he guns him down, no charges.

http://abc13.com/news/navasota-officer-wont-face-charges-for-fatally-shooting-teen/281936/

I was going to say that getting off is much easier when you kill the witness but nope, there was someone in the car with him.

[Dugout DickStone]

I am glad that the militarization of the police in this country is being discussed at the highest levels now.   I fully agree that police should have powerful weapons but those weapons need only be brought out when facing the most dangerous of criminals and only operated by the most highly trained and competently led personnel . . . which includes psychological stability.   Just to many Baney Fife's with a bullet chomping at the bit to play with their new toys.

100% truth.

[CNS]

off duty cop walks up to kid in car with his gun drawn, kid takes off, he guns him down, no charges.

http://abc13.com/news/navasota-officer-wont-face-charges-for-fatally-shooting-teen/281936/

Off Duty Cop, with a premise similar to what sounds like happened here, would be a very popular video game.

[CNS]

I mean, it could basically be like the Grand Theft Auto games but without ever being chased by the police.

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

I am glad that the militarization of the police in this country is being discussed at the highest levels now.   I fully agree that police should have powerful weapons but those weapons need only be brought out when facing the most dangerous of criminals and only operated by the most highly trained and competently led personnel . . . which includes psychological stability.   Just to many Baney Fife's with a bullet chomping at the bit to play with their new toys.

Yeah, SWAT used to be a special unit with highly trained, best of the best, officers. Now they just throw the stuff to any local beat cop and call it good.

[Tobias]

I mean, it could basically be like the Grand Theft Auto games but without ever being chased by the police.

no negative consequences

[Emo EMAW]

I'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...

The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997.  LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers.  After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit.  If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed.  I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure.  But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry. 

[Kat Kid]

I'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...

The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997.  LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers.  After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit.  If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed.  I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure.  But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry.

I think people were referencing the fact that the Ferguson police rolled a moron perched atop a bearcat with a sniper rifle.

[Emo EMAW]

I'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...

The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997.  LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers.  After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit.  If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed.  I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure.  But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry.

I think people were referencing the fact that the Ferguson police rolled a moron perched atop a bearcat with a sniper rifle.

Did he kill anyone?  I missed it if he did.

[Kat Kid]

I'm going to make a point I hate to make, but many of you are (perhaps) overlooking...

The impetus for police forces arming themselves was that North Hollywood shootout back in 1997.  LAPD had to "loot" local gun shops to access firearms powerful enough to confront two heavily armed and armored bank robbers.  After that incident every LAPD cruiser was fitted with M-16's in the trunk, and other police forces followed suit.  If police are going to be asked to confront dangerous people armed with military style weapons, then they must also be similarly armed.  I agree that they should be trained to use them, for sure.  But, also, in all of the links posted (that I looked at) officers killed someone using their service pistol, not military style weaponry.

I think people were referencing the fact that the Ferguson police rolled a moron perched atop a bearcat with a sniper rifle.

Did he kill anyone?  I missed it if he did.

No.

[Emo EMAW]

Well, okay then.  I'm fine with sniper rifles or whatever, they're basically the same as hunting rifles.  I'll admit I don't like the big armored vehicles, but mostly because they seem like a waste of money.  And obviously if a police force is putting it's officers on the streets with deadly weapons everyday it would behoove them to mitigate risk by regularly verifying their mental state (they probably do?), and mandating frequent training (I'm sure they do).

[Cartierfor3]

The problem EMO is the the Swat teams are used now to conduct search warrants for drugs, not go up against guys with body armor and machine guns. They are conducting no knock raids daily. And the idea that small town cops need a swat is laughable.

[Kat Kid]

Well, okay then.  I'm fine with sniper rifles or whatever, they're basically the same as hunting rifles.  I'll admit I don't like the big armored vehicles, but mostly because they seem like a waste of money.  And obviously if a police force is putting it's officers on the streets with deadly weapons everyday it would behoove them to mitigate risk by regularly verifying their mental state (they probably do?), and mandating frequent training (I'm sure they do).

This is actually one of the biggest complaints with the military grade equipment.  There is not currently any requirement by the grants that are providing this gear that the local police provide any training, just that they use the equipment within a year.

[CNS]

I am fine with them having said sniper rifle.  not ok with it being pointed at a non violent demonstration.  I mean, if a cop walked up to my car with his pistol out and aimed at me to initiate a traffic stop, it would it matter even if I didn't end up getting shot. 

[Cartierfor3]

Load up on guns, bring your friends. Cops know they won't face any consequences for shooting people.

[Kat Kid]

The problem EMO is the the Swat teams are used now to conduct search warrants for drugs, not go up against guys with body armor and machine guns. They are conducting no knock raids daily. And the idea that small town cops need a swat is laughable.

The danger of no knock raids for both police and drug dealers seems to clearly outweigh any possible advantage to serving the warrant with a knock.

[Emo EMAW]

The problem EMO is the the Swat teams are used now to conduct search warrants for drugs

That's risk mitigation, so what? 

They are conducting no knock raids daily.

Well ya that's not cool.

And the idea that small town cops need a swat is laughable.

Generally speaking I agree. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

Do you guys think the NASA SWAT team has laser beams?

[Emo EMAW]

Well, okay then.  I'm fine with sniper rifles or whatever, they're basically the same as hunting rifles.  I'll admit I don't like the big armored vehicles, but mostly because they seem like a waste of money.  And obviously if a police force is putting it's officers on the streets with deadly weapons everyday it would behoove them to mitigate risk by regularly verifying their mental state (they probably do?), and mandating frequent training (I'm sure they do).

This is actually one of the biggest complaints with the military grade equipment.  There is not currently any requirement by the grants that are providing this gear that the local police provide any training, just that they use the equipment within a year.

That is concerning. 

At least in Joco I witness local cops training with military style equipment all the time.  Of course I can't say if it's adequate or not, but they go through a crap ton of ammo.