Author Topic: The Royals  (Read 4691534 times)

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Offline joda

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2150 on: November 01, 2012, 11:15:42 AM »
I liked the deal until I saw how much money he was owed.

Take it away Fangraphs!

Quote
The Royals are now on the hook for about $20 million in 2013 to Ervin Santana and Jeff Francoeur. Optimistically, you might think those two can give you +3 wins, maybe +4. The Royals total payroll in 2012 was $64 million. You just can’t spend 1/3 of your payroll on less than five wins and compete unless your payroll is enormous. And even if it is enormous, there are almost certainly better ways to spend $20 million.

Honestly I'm really not concerned about the money. IF they non-tender Hoch combined with declining Soria's option that pretty much covers Santana's salary so the total payroll would be about the same. Since no one else is in line for a significant raise through arbitration as it stands right now the Royal's payroll for next year is still probably well under $70 mil. If Glass and Moore stay true to their words about a willingness to increase payroll there should still be plenty of cash to bring back Guthrie as well as make a play for some of the other FA's who have been talked about as possibilities.

I was pretty  :sdeek: about the deal when I first heard about it because ESPN radio was being dicks on my way home from work and kept saying "for a minor leaguer". Once I found out it was some scrub whose upside is a loogy I liked it. At worst he's still a slight improvement over last years rotation. At best he could be the best pitcher to wear a Royals uniform since Meche's pre-injury season.

P.S. I know this is the Royals so what will actually happen is they keep Hoch, keep Volstad, overspend for somebody bad, let Guthrie walk (even though he'll end up signing a reasonable contract) and Santana will pull a Sanchez.

Offline Winters

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2151 on: November 01, 2012, 11:17:13 AM »
I love his attitude
Best #heel and/or #babyface on this blogsite



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Online Kat Kid

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2152 on: November 01, 2012, 12:42:41 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Offline 'taterblast

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2153 on: November 01, 2012, 12:44:59 PM »

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2154 on: November 01, 2012, 12:46:38 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list. 

Offline j-dub

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2155 on: November 01, 2012, 01:18:31 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list.

Right now:

Santana
Mendoza
Hoch
Chen
Volstad/W. Smith/Odorizzi

Guthrie is a FA. I hope we resign him. If we bring him back, he's the number 2 behind Santana. I really wish we would send Hoch packing - don't care how, just say goodbye once and for all.
"I started calling him John during the game, cause he was rocking it like No. 7 -- like Elway," Harper said."

Offline ben ji

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2156 on: November 01, 2012, 01:26:28 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list.

hmmmm, dont see them taking a lifelong closer(in the bigs) and turning him into a starter less than 1 year after having elbow surgery.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2157 on: November 01, 2012, 02:58:27 PM »
Who are the Royals going to find who would take Hoch with his current salary? I'd kind of like to see what he looks like out of the pen if they can't trade him.

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2158 on: November 01, 2012, 03:50:09 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list.

hmmmm, dont see them taking a lifelong closer(in the bigs) and turning him into a starter less than 1 year after having elbow surgery.

Didn't say I liked Soria in the rotation, but they've hinted all along about bullpen guys moving to the rotation.  They'll try someone out there.  Maybe Crow, but I bet in March Soria makes at least a couple spring training starts if we sign him.


Who are the Royals going to find who would take Hoch with his current salary? I'd kind of like to see what he looks like out of the pen if they can't trade him.

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field. 

Offline jtksu

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2159 on: November 01, 2012, 03:57:27 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list.

hmmmm, dont see them taking a lifelong closer(in the bigs) and turning him into a starter less than 1 year after having elbow surgery.

Didn't say I liked Soria in the rotation, but they've hinted all along about bullpen guys moving to the rotation.  They'll try someone out there.  Maybe Crow, but I bet in March Soria makes at least a couple spring training starts if we sign him.


Who are the Royals going to find who would take Hoch with his current salary? I'd kind of like to see what he looks like out of the pen if they can't trade him.

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

I kinda figured Myers would be the RF next season.

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2160 on: November 01, 2012, 04:02:25 PM »
Let's talk rotation:

Hoch?  Hoch.
Santana
Duffy?
Latin guy?
Chen?
Guthrie?

Today its:
Santana
Guthrie (50/50)
Mendoza
Chen
Hoch  :sdeek:

Paulino and Duffy maybe sometime around late June.  Don't count out them trying to resign Soria and turn him into a starter.  Also I'm still hopeful we'll sign or trade for one more starter who is better than anyone on the list.

hmmmm, dont see them taking a lifelong closer(in the bigs) and turning him into a starter less than 1 year after having elbow surgery.

Didn't say I liked Soria in the rotation, but they've hinted all along about bullpen guys moving to the rotation.  They'll try someone out there.  Maybe Crow, but I bet in March Soria makes at least a couple spring training starts if we sign him.


Who are the Royals going to find who would take Hoch with his current salary? I'd kind of like to see what he looks like out of the pen if they can't trade him.

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

I kinda figured Myers would be the RF next season.

One would hope, yet its the Royals.  You can't count on them making even the most obvious of good decisions. 

Offline kitten_mittons

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Re: Re: The Royals
« Reply #2161 on: November 01, 2012, 05:43:39 PM »
At best he could be the best pitcher to wear a Royals uniform since Meche's pre-injury season.
:dubious:

Offline j-dub

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Re: Re: The Royals
« Reply #2162 on: November 01, 2012, 08:36:40 PM »
At best he could be the best pitcher to wear a Royals uniform since Meche's pre-injury season.
:dubious:

yeah. forgot to call him on this. greinke - cy..
"I started calling him John during the game, cause he was rocking it like No. 7 -- like Elway," Harper said."

Offline joda

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Re: Re: The Royals
« Reply #2163 on: November 01, 2012, 09:45:33 PM »
 :facepalm:
At best he could be the best pitcher to wear a Royals uniform since Meche's pre-injury season.
:dubious:

yeah. forgot to call him on this. greinke - cy..

 :facepalm: sorry really meant to say 2nd best, but I had a dumbass moment

Offline Diamond Dave

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2164 on: November 02, 2012, 02:51:09 AM »
Guthrie will be exploring free agency. DM has expressed interest, but also said they both needed to explore their options. I certainly wouldn't mind having Guthrie in the rotation, but the price needs to be right. He made $8 mil this year and I don't think I'd give him much more for that next year. Also, Guthrie is looking for a 3 year deal and DM doesn't want anything over 2.

Another item of note is Soria's $8 mil option for next year being declined. Soria has expressed high interest in staying in KC and DM would like to work out a new, incentive-ridden deal. I could go either way with him. It'd be nice to have the bullpen depth, but we did great without him this year. I really don't think we need him. Definitely not $8 mil need him. But then again, we will most likely be paying Luke Hochevar a ridiculous amount of money next year and we certainly don't need him.

Whoa whoa whoa whoa...........lol wut???

Royals were 44/64 in save opportunities. That is completely unacceptable. I hope you're joking.

"Great" was indeed a poor choice of words (I'm so used to losing that anything above average to me is now great). And I was referring to the bullpen as a whole. 561 innings and a 3.17 ERA collectively is pretty solid, especially considering our youth. Holland converted on 80% of his  this year, matching Soria's percentage for 2011. Plus he's coming of TJ which is always makes me a bit uneasy. My point is not to say Soria sucks and he doesn't have a place on this team. I like him and I do hope we resign him. What I am hoping for is a little relief in his contract as we need to free up as much money as we can for starting pitching. Obviously the first step would be getting rid of Francoeur and Hochevar but I'm past believing any of that will happen.

Offline Diamond Dave

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2165 on: November 02, 2012, 03:07:21 AM »
Rotation with guys we currently have at this moment:

Santana
Guthrie
Mendoza
Chen
Smith

(Paulino and Duffy in the mix when rehabbed. And eff Hoch. He will never be on any of my lists.)

Kind of realistic but not really wishlist rotation:

Dan Haren
David Price
Santana
Guthrie
Mendoza/Chen/Paulino/Duffy

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2166 on: November 02, 2012, 11:48:35 AM »

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

Don't the Royals have to pay them whether they release them or not? If so, I just don't see the benefit of releasing either player at this point.

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2167 on: November 02, 2012, 12:09:02 PM »

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

Don't the Royals have to pay them whether they release them or not? If so, I just don't see the benefit of releasing either player at this point.

The benefit would be the Royals would suck less at baseball

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2168 on: November 02, 2012, 02:06:34 PM »

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

Don't the Royals have to pay them whether they release them or not? If so, I just don't see the benefit of releasing either player at this point.

The benefit would be the Royals would suck less at baseball

Why not pick up free agents to replace them, then cut them? It is possible to do even worse. I actually think Frenchy wouldn't be all that horrible as a pinch hitter to use in late game situations with RISP, when you aren't really looking for a walk, anyway. Hoch sucks ass, but he wasn't even the worst pitcher on the roster for most of last season.

You are probably correct though, that the only way to get those losers out of the starting lineup is to just cut them and part ways. :frown:

Offline j-dub

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2169 on: November 02, 2012, 02:08:26 PM »
you guys keep putting guthrie on our current rotation lists. he's a FA.

also, the odds that soria isn't finished are very small. i don't think anyone has ever made a successful comeback from two TJ's.

"I started calling him John during the game, cause he was rocking it like No. 7 -- like Elway," Harper said."

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2170 on: November 02, 2012, 02:12:19 PM »
you guys keep putting guthrie on our current rotation lists. he's a FA.

also, the odds that soria isn't finished are very small. i don't think anyone has ever made a successful comeback from two TJ's.

Yeah, the pitching is just so shallow that there is no way in hell the Royals will have the luxury of getting rid of Hoch this offseason, even if they could afford to pay him to just go away.

Offline j-dub

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2171 on: November 02, 2012, 02:12:50 PM »

who cares.  release him.  release frenchy.  we're better off with Will Smith and hell, anyone else in right field.

Don't the Royals have to pay them whether they release them or not? If so, I just don't see the benefit of releasing either player at this point.

The benefit would be the Royals would suck less at baseball

Why not pick up free agents to replace them, then cut them? It is possible to do even worse. I actually think Frenchy wouldn't be all that horrible as a pinch hitter to use in late game situations with RISP, when you aren't really looking for a walk, anyway. Hoch sucks ass, but he wasn't even the worst pitcher on the roster for most of last season.

You are probably correct though, that the only way to get those losers out of the starting lineup is to just cut them and part ways. :frown:

i think, bottom line, that's what it will take. in order for dayton and co. to not run them out there everyday, they have to be on somebody else's roster or unemployed.
"I started calling him John during the game, cause he was rocking it like No. 7 -- like Elway," Harper said."

Offline j-dub

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2172 on: November 02, 2012, 02:15:57 PM »
you guys keep putting guthrie on our current rotation lists. he's a FA.

also, the odds that soria isn't finished are very small. i don't think anyone has ever made a successful comeback from two TJ's.

Yeah, the pitching is just so shallow that there is no way in hell the Royals will have the luxury of getting rid of Hoch this offseason, even if they could afford to pay him to just go away.

maybe. certainly doesn't help that we won't get duffy and paulino back before the AS break..
"I started calling him John during the game, cause he was rocking it like No. 7 -- like Elway," Harper said."

Offline jtksu

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2173 on: November 08, 2012, 03:26:05 PM »
Cleveland claimed Blake Wood and Texas claimed Hottovy.  Supposedly, Seattle has a bunch of young pitching and are interested in trading for Wil Myers.

Offline bones129

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Re: The Royals
« Reply #2174 on: November 08, 2012, 06:16:05 PM »
Cleveland claimed Blake Wood and Texas claimed Hottovy.  Supposedly, Seattle has a bunch of young pitching and are interested in trading for Wil Myers.

I don't think Myers will be traded. The Royals have high hopes for him. I suspect they'll look for one more established starter.