Author Topic: How much are we going to pay our players?  (Read 33606 times)

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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #75 on: July 09, 2021, 07:24:35 PM »
K-State nor any other athletic department are doing that though. Why would they incentivize either current partners or potential partners to give money to 19 year old kids instead of to the department?

It would be smart to encourage both, but even just giving money to players naturally and eventually boosts money going to the school.  If fans/donors were paying players in a way that made it much more attractive to recruits to go to a team, that team would be good and popular and make it where fans/donors pay the school more for sponsorship, tickets, etc.

In what scenario in your head could this happen? Who is the school that is going to become appreciably better simply by finding a way to get their players excessive NIL payments? How does this even work? Corvallis gonna become the place to be by offering marketing contracts to student athletes that no one else are offering money to?

Whoever does it first/most.  Miami?  I certainly don’t have a cost analysis at my desk here; my point is that it’s not illogical for a school to want money going from supporters to players, whether that’s to get ahead or keep pace.

I’m the one who said we should’ve hired Saban or Dabo at $30m/year and make money off of whipping ass at football.

Yeah and no one has or will do that because it's illogical.

Athletic departments don't want their money going to athletes. I feel like maybe I'm missing a point or something because this is obvious. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes, they wouldn't have been forced by politicians to offer NIL. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes to open up the free market, they would just make athletes employees then the rich schools could actually and above the table pay their athletes more than everyone else, instead of doing some weird end around the same rules they themselves created.

I know I've made this point before but if you're Shamrock Trading or Carl and Mary Ice, is your money better spent on slapping your name on the stadium and in doing so get all of the access to the facilities, players, and coaches you want, or do you want to give that to a four star freshman who does nothing for your business and very well may leave at the end of the year because they're behind a junior on the depth chart?

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #76 on: July 09, 2021, 07:27:34 PM »
One more point. The people who least want the athletes to be paid are generally the one with the most money. I really don't think large conservative donors in the south and midwest are all of a sudden going to start throwing their cash around for little to no return, maybe I'll be proven wrong though.

Offline Trim

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #77 on: July 09, 2021, 08:16:21 PM »
Yeah and no one has or will do that because it's illogical.

Athletic departments don't want their money going to athletes. I feel like maybe I'm missing a point or something because this is obvious. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes, they wouldn't have been forced by politicians to offer NIL. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes to open up the free market, they would just make athletes employees then the rich schools could actually and above the table pay their athletes more than everyone else, instead of doing some weird end around the same rules they themselves created.

I know I've made this point before but if you're Shamrock Trading or Carl and Mary Ice, is your money better spent on slapping your name on the stadium and in doing so get all of the access to the facilities, players, and coaches you want, or do you want to give that to a four star freshman who does nothing for your business and very well may leave at the end of the year because they're behind a junior on the depth chart?

Miami's done it, and by Miami doing it I mean that Miami players are getting paid by a fan/supporter, and so other schools will want it happening at their schools too in order to not be competitively disadvantaged.  And it will snowball.

Athletic departments don't want to share their money with athletes.  But now this has happened and they'll have to adapt.  It's not going to bust their budget if a donor shifts $500 of a large donation to an athlete, or better yet, gives an additional $500 to an athlete.  But if that $500 to an athlete gets an athlete to a school or gets them to stay at a school or inspires them to play better and that school wins, that school will ultimately make money off that donor having given $500 to an athlete.

If Shamrock Trading and the Ices are sponsoring the stuff they do for ROI, then yeah, they're not the people who will pay the whole football team to tweet.  I suspect they're doing it for some combination of wanting to support KSU, tax deductions, prestige and perks, more so than ROI but whatever.  On the other hand, there's people who are diehard fans that will, now that it's allowed, just want to do whatever absurd deal is required to fit in these rules to entice the best players to come and stay at KSU so that KSU wins more games.

I'd much rather have given money to Daniel Sams than to KSU.  We could've had him tweet to promote an online art installation by renowned painter steve dave.

Offline steve dave

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #78 on: July 09, 2021, 08:44:52 PM »
the ncaa has lost the steering wheel (because they suck bigtime and steering it) and won't get it back. agree with trim here.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #79 on: July 09, 2021, 09:29:12 PM »
Yeah and no one has or will do that because it's illogical.

Athletic departments don't want their money going to athletes. I feel like maybe I'm missing a point or something because this is obvious. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes, they wouldn't have been forced by politicians to offer NIL. If athletic departments wanted to share their money with athletes to open up the free market, they would just make athletes employees then the rich schools could actually and above the table pay their athletes more than everyone else, instead of doing some weird end around the same rules they themselves created.

I know I've made this point before but if you're Shamrock Trading or Carl and Mary Ice, is your money better spent on slapping your name on the stadium and in doing so get all of the access to the facilities, players, and coaches you want, or do you want to give that to a four star freshman who does nothing for your business and very well may leave at the end of the year because they're behind a junior on the depth chart?

Miami's done it, and by Miami doing it I mean that Miami players are getting paid by a fan/supporter, and so other schools will want it happening at their schools too in order to not be competitively disadvantaged.  And it will snowball.

Athletic departments don't want to share their money with athletes.  But now this has happened and they'll have to adapt.  It's not going to bust their budget if a donor shifts $500 of a large donation to an athlete, or better yet, gives an additional $500 to an athlete.  But if that $500 to an athlete gets an athlete to a school or gets them to stay at a school or inspires them to play better and that school wins, that school will ultimately make money off that donor having given $500 to an athlete.

If Shamrock Trading and the Ices are sponsoring the stuff they do for ROI, then yeah, they're not the people who will pay the whole football team to tweet.  I suspect they're doing it for some combination of wanting to support KSU, tax deductions, prestige and perks, more so than ROI but whatever.  On the other hand, there's people who are diehard fans that will, now that it's allowed, just want to do whatever absurd deal is required to fit in these rules to entice the best players to come and stay at KSU so that KSU wins more games.

I'd much rather have given money to Daniel Sams than to KSU.  We could've had him tweet to promote an online art installation by renowned painter steve dave.

This conversation has taken a different turn and you're bringing up stuff I haven't argued against. I said that schools won't collaborate with donors to pull money out of their own pockets and break their own rules to give athletes money instead of themselves. If they thought making players up for the highest bidder was the way to make more money for themselves they would have done that long ago.

Of course there are people more willing to give players money than athletic departments but there aren't nearly enough of them to make even the smallest dent, and you can bet your ass that if you did give Daniel Sams an endorsement deal instead of donating to the Ahearn Fund that you and or your business would be immediately put on a call list and they wouldn't try to get their hands in your pockets even if that meant taking money from Sams.

I'd certainly pay for an athlete to come to my kid's birthday party and I'd pay an athlete to give my kids some private lessons but I sure in the hell wouldn't pay an athlete to tweet some bullshit and you wouldn't either. You certainly could prove me wrong and find an athlete anywhere you're willing to blow some money on.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #80 on: July 09, 2021, 09:30:01 PM »
the ncaa has lost the steering wheel (because they suck bigtime and steering it) and won't get it back. agree with trim here.

Agree with what? That what may happen with that donor at Miami is going to be something that isn't an extreme exception to the rule? I absolutely will not agree with that. Of course every school will want a donor like the mma guy at Miami, but hardly any of the schools will find someone willing to do that. I don't even think he will do what he's doing beyond this year. He's not even putting up all of the money, he's seeking other business partners and donations from people.

The NCAA definitely lost the steering wheel when it comes to NIL, there's no doubt there but I don't know how that's relevant in this context.

Offline steve dave

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #81 on: July 09, 2021, 09:57:14 PM »



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Offline steve dave

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #82 on: July 09, 2021, 09:57:50 PM »
I don’t have strong feelings and didn’t consider those things


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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #83 on: July 10, 2021, 12:59:11 PM »



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This belongs in the best memes thread, I love it.

Offline Pete

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #84 on: July 11, 2021, 08:26:19 AM »


https://247sports.com/Article/scott-frost-nebraska-football-coach-hot-seat-contract-buyout-bill-moos-athletic-director-2021-season-167626122/

Quote
"Dennis, I think it's a really interesting one," 247Sports origination editor and national recruiting analyst Bud Elliott said of Frost and Nebraska. "I think Nebraska is more likely than not to make a game. But they're a school, I think, will benefit greatly on the recruiting trail from NIL (name, image and likeness). Right? Like, they have people who want to support the program. I don't know that they always are pedal to the metal with how they do it currently ... and there's not very many other things to endorse in the state of Nebraska.

"Whereas, if you're at Miami ... there has been players getting endorsements. But the influencer market in Miami, it's pretty crowded, right? There's a lot of folks that go to Miami that are influencers. In Nebraska, you kind of could really corner that market. I'm interested to see if that job is more attractive now because of the influencer potential."



Offline hatingfrancisco

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #85 on: July 12, 2021, 11:15:25 AM »
Can someone explain to me why I haven't seen a Jax Dineen tweet promoting gE.com yet?

Mods?

Offline 'taterblast

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #86 on: July 14, 2021, 01:08:53 PM »
i'm glad he at least has this talking point developed

https://twitter.com/HaroldRKuntz3/status/1415372118343225348?s=20

Offline 420seriouscat69

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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #88 on: July 14, 2021, 11:47:35 PM »
https://twitter.com/SXMCollege/status/1415379051095760903?s=20

WTF is he doing? I don't understand why he feels the need to put a negative voice to this. What does he think he has to gain by speaking this way? I know who won't hear this and be pumped up about it, student athletes certainly won't.

Offline PurpleOil

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #89 on: July 15, 2021, 06:59:08 AM »
You didn't honestly believe K-State would be a pioneer on the NIL frontier now did you?

Most of our alumni believe that we should only recruit kids who want to play football and get a degree the old fashion way. Then, maybe their senior year we'll give them a jersey deal, you know, if the season is going well. Gene and his stance is nothing more than a reflection of this.

We'll get smoked for a few years on this front, and then when the mouth breathers have finally realized that college football is just a minor league for the NFL, we'll finally start trying to compete.

Offline Pete

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #90 on: July 15, 2021, 07:14:51 AM »
You didn't honestly believe K-State would be a pioneer on the NIL frontier now did you?

Most of our alumni believe that we should only recruit kids who want to play football and get a degree the old fashion way. Then, maybe their senior year we'll give them a jersey deal, you know, if the season is going well. Gene and his stance is nothing more than a reflection of this.

We'll get smoked for a few years on this front, and then when the mouth breathers have finally realized that college football is just a minor league for the NFL, we'll finally start trying to compete.

This.

Offline 420seriouscat69

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #91 on: July 15, 2021, 08:08:54 AM »
https://twitter.com/SXMCollege/status/1415379051095760903?s=20

WTF is he doing? I don't understand why he feels the need to put a negative voice to this. What does he think he has to gain by speaking this way? I know who won't hear this and be pumped up about it, student athletes certainly won't.
I've always tried to back him, because people irrationally hate him for no reason, but he's really showing his ass here.

Offline chum1

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #92 on: July 15, 2021, 08:17:37 AM »
What's the point of having a fancy stadium if it's not going to be half empty on game day?

Offline Spracne

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #93 on: July 15, 2021, 08:43:40 AM »
Haven't listened to it, but that quote says it all. Complains about the talent wanting to get paid and then turns around and calls it a business in the same breath.

Offline pissclams

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #94 on: July 15, 2021, 08:47:07 AM »
https://twitter.com/SXMCollege/status/1415379051095760903?s=20

WTF is he doing? I don't understand why he feels the need to put a negative voice to this. What does he think he has to gain by speaking this way? I know who won't hear this and be pumped up about it, student athletes certainly won't.
I've always tried to back him, because people irrationally hate him for no reason, but he's really showing his ass here.

have you ever thought that maybe people rationally hate him for a lot of reasons?


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Offline 420seriouscat69

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #95 on: July 15, 2021, 09:03:06 AM »
No. Not at all. Especially 'stone who hates every leader who's been apart of K-state since he attended the University back in the 1950's.

Offline Pete

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #96 on: July 15, 2021, 09:05:35 AM »
I am advocating for gE to use our future enormous internet blog advertising profits (previous piles of gE cash used to outfit a study hall in the gorgeous new KSU library) to pay players to endorse gE.  If Gene says no, then my vote is that we endorse KU players instead.

Offline Pete

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #97 on: July 15, 2021, 09:12:36 AM »
Also I am not really hoping that KU just destroys KSU in NIL $, and that KU pushes the envelope to the damn moon on this.  I will enjoy watching the tide turn against Gene.

Offline pissclams

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #98 on: July 15, 2021, 09:52:51 AM »
No. Not at all. Especially 'stone who hates every leader who's been apart of K-state since he attended the University back in the 1950's.

at least he's consistent.  nothing much has changed within k-state's leadership culture since that time.  wefald set the stage and cued up the ball, only for the next group to grab it hit a slow liner to 2nd base.  a lot of people want more for the university than good enough.  gene is just the latest in a long line of good enoughers. 


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Offline 420seriouscat69

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Re: How much are we going to pay our players?
« Reply #99 on: July 15, 2021, 10:02:46 AM »
No. Not at all. Especially 'stone who hates every leader who's been apart of K-state since he attended the University back in the 1950's.

at least he's consistent.  nothing much has changed within k-state's leadership culture since that time.  wefald set the stage and cued up the ball, only for the next group to grab it hit a slow liner to 2nd base.  a lot of people want more for the university than good enough.  gene is just the latest in a long line of good enoughers.
I think it's important, for sanity purposes, to tune out people who want everyone fired other than Frank Martin. Back dated since the 1980's, there's many who think that the only acceptable leader that's been hired, to walk through those doors since they've been in college, is Frank and that guy has missed the tourney 7 out of his last 8 years. Sometimes it's important to mix reality with expectations.