Author Topic: Kids  (Read 273009 times)

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Offline Dr Rick Daris

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Re: Kids
« Reply #75 on: May 17, 2010, 09:59:03 AM »
it really all just boils down to this....if you are happy without kids then you will be happy if you have them. if you are unhappy without kids then you will be unhappy if you have them. happy people with good lives will continue to be happy people with good lives and unhappy people w/ miserable lives would continue to be unhappy and miserable. the kids aren't going to really change your overall level of enjoyment, etc.  whatever you are is what you will be.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: Kids
« Reply #76 on: May 17, 2010, 10:04:17 AM »
it really all just boils down to this....if you are happy without kids then you will be happy if you have them. if you are unhappy without kids then you will be unhappy if you have them. happy people with good lives will continue to be happy people with good lives and unhappy people w/ miserable lives would continue to be unhappy and miserable. the kids aren't going to really change your overall level of enjoyment, etc.  whatever you are is what you will be.

daris is killing it in this thread. 

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Re: Kids
« Reply #77 on: May 17, 2010, 10:06:10 AM »
Depends on what is making you happy pre-kid.

If you are happy because you can drink away from home, work late, and the wife has no need for you to be home except when you want to be home, than RD is wrong because most of that will change.




Offline chum1

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Re: Kids
« Reply #78 on: May 17, 2010, 10:28:59 AM »
I don't think it's only about preferences or dispositions.  It seems like people who have kids can lead more fulfilling lives than people who don't.  A lifetime of drinking and BBS-ing going to away games and whatever else you like to do when you're young isn't going to mean jack crap to you when you're in your 40s and 50s without anything else to look forward to for the remainder of your life. 

Offline Pete

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Re: Kids
« Reply #79 on: May 17, 2010, 10:47:18 AM »
SD, my advice is to ask "why do I want kids"? It's a tough answer because they don't really serve a tangible purpose (we're not passing down kingdoms or supplying help for the family farm anymore and haven't for a long time).  Much like marriage, they are socially acceptable events in a life cylce (if not social "requirements").  Doesn't mean they aren't fun or aren't great, they just really don't serve a "tangible" purpose.  They can provide "meaning" as chum puts it, but so can a lot of other things.  And as RD suggests, you can ship them off to the grandparents for a week and take a vacation with your spouse...but that's just one week, what about the other 51 weeks? 

IMO, people that have kids are afraid to say that kids aren't the greatest thing ever because it somehow diminishes "life", when in fact it merely acknowledges that humans aren't super awesome every day of their lives. In my limited experience, kids are fun, tremendous fun, but they're also terrible, just fracking terrible sometimes.  You do begin to enjoy different things, but you're kind of forced to.  You can still have fun with your spouse or have time for yourself, just not as much as before.   Your experience, your perspective, your focus changes.  Not necessarily a bad thing, just a reality. A different reality than before. 

The "TRUTH" is in Catzacker's post.

For many, having kids is simply a  preferred means of "finding meaning and purpose," of reaching "fulfillment." 

Chum's anecdotes about not having anything to look forward to when you are old are relevant to many people in those situations, but not to all people.

It doesn't have to be kids.  Your life isn't more meaningful instantly because you have kids.....for many people, it's just the particular vehicle that they chose to provide those "meaningful" and "fulfilling" experiences.  Volunteer at a goddamn orphanage or something when you are old....whatever.    You think Mother Theresa looked back and said, "eff, I should have had kids!" 

There are a lot of "I love my kids" snobs out there, who think that's the only reason to exist on this planet....they cannot fathom how you would not want kids, and worse, they look down (or worse) on those who choose not to as some sort of lower moral being. 


Besides the world is over crowded.  If you don't have kids, you are doing the planet a rough ridin' favor. 

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Re: Kids
« Reply #80 on: May 17, 2010, 10:48:47 AM »
I think living a full life can be done no matter what.  You just have to figure out what kind of life you want to live and if that involves having someone then do it, if it involved having kids, then do it, if not don't.  Marriage and kids are not requirements for a full life, living the life you want to is, imo.  The problem/issue is figuring out if marriage, kids, etc. is what you want because they are not the easiest to get out of if you find that they aren't what you wanted, especially kids.  Those things aren't wedding gifts you can return for store credit.  

And if someone (in this case SD) is asking for advice about kids (whether to have them) imo it's important to paint the entire picture and in doing so, you're not a terrible person for admitting that kids aren't super awesome all the time.  This point seems obvious, because what is super awesome all the time?  but the things we might hold dear as parents or hold meaningful as parents or are fun as parents may not be things that we (a) held as meaningful or dear before we had kids and (b) may not be things that others find value or fun in or could eventually find value or fun in.  It's important to lay it all out there as the expereinces we have had, and then let SD decide (not that he's going to decide based on us jackasses).  Or we could just say "it's awesome".  

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Kids
« Reply #81 on: May 17, 2010, 10:54:26 AM »
I don't think it's only about preferences or dispositions.  It seems like people who have kids can lead more fulfilling lives than people who don't.  A lifetime of drinking and BBS-ing going to away games and whatever else you like to do when you're young isn't going to mean jack crap to you when you're in your 40s and 50s without anything else to look forward to for the remainder of your life. 

jfc, thinking about making some "tough" choices based on your recommends. 

Offline steve dave

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Re: Kids
« Reply #82 on: May 17, 2010, 10:55:08 AM »
(not that he's going to decide based on us jackasses)

haha, yeah.....obviously haha....  :frown:  I should have made this thread a poll

Offline chum1

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Re: Kids
« Reply #83 on: May 17, 2010, 11:09:31 AM »
Of the things that you might actually do in your lifetime, there’s nothing that you can name that can compete with raising kids in terms of fulfillment.  Go ahead and try it.  The fact that the world is full of crazy bastards that place waaaaaay too much emphasis on the value that kids add to their lives does not change that. 

Offline steve dave

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Re: Kids
« Reply #84 on: May 17, 2010, 11:19:40 AM »
I guess I don't understand the fulfillment line of thinking.  Do you just feel completely fine with sitting at home with your passle of kids after you have them?  Seems like a pretty nice perk if that's the case. 

Offline michigancat

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Re: Kids
« Reply #85 on: May 17, 2010, 11:20:55 AM »
the bottom line is you and your significant other better be attractive, because I imagine it's really hard to love ugly kids.

Offline steve dave

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Re: Kids
« Reply #86 on: May 17, 2010, 11:22:43 AM »
the bottom line is you and your significant other better be attractive, because I imagine it's really hard to love ugly kids.

Yeah, I'm pretty much nails here.  In my limited looking at peoples kids experience mixed race babys/kids are the most attractive.   

Offline Dr Rick Daris

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Re: Kids
« Reply #87 on: May 17, 2010, 11:33:59 AM »
I guess I don't understand the fulfillment line of thinking.  Do you just feel completely fine with sitting at home with your passle of kids after you have them?  Seems like a pretty nice perk if that's the case. 

i don't really get it either. kids really didn't change things all that much for me in terms of fulfillment or anything. maybe that comes later in life and sixty yr old daris will be high fiving young daris telling him g'job and stuff.


kids are basically like bbs'ing if you had to hire someone to bbs for you whenever you wanted to go out for dinner and drinks or something. not really that much of a life changing event, but overall pretty enjoyable a decent amount of the time. mostly fun, but def sometimes frustrating. think of a bad kid day like a day of bbs'ing w/ nothing but jthutch and cnscasey posts. good kid days are like ksucats just beat #1 texas at home and fitz did something really creepy again. most days are not either though. most days are just like today. pretty uneventful. sys updates the '11 recruiting thread, bmw posts about a ku bball recruit, dax responds w/ something about how ku finances aren't as good as they say they are, clams talks about what he's going to eat for dinner and then we wake up tomorrow and do it all over again...

Offline HeinBallz

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Re: Kids
« Reply #88 on: May 17, 2010, 11:42:14 AM »
...because what is super awesome all the time? ...

orgasms?  
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Offline nicname

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Re: Kids
« Reply #89 on: May 17, 2010, 11:45:19 AM »
the bottom line is you and your significant other better be attractive, because I imagine it's really hard to love ugly kids.

Yeah, I'm pretty much nails here.  In my limited looking at peoples kids experience mixed race babys/kids are the most attractive.   



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Offline Ghost of Stan Parrish

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Re: Kids
« Reply #90 on: May 17, 2010, 11:50:10 AM »
Jesus, deep thread.  I agree RD is killing it here.

BTW at some point around your mid-30s, you start to put less value on going out (etc.) than you used to, whether you have kids or not.  Sounds like you might be a candidate to wait just a few more years to have kids -- until this stage kicks in.  Best of both worlds that way?

(I'll disclose that my particular POV is wondering whether there's enough of an upside for me to even be in a long-term relationship, so I know mentally I'm pretty freaking far away from being ready for kids.)
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Offline chum1

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Re: Kids
« Reply #91 on: May 17, 2010, 11:53:06 AM »
Kids are essentially just projects.  You invest a whole lot of your life into them and you're rewarded for it.  You know how people who've spent their lives building a business from the ground up are psychotically attached to it?  Like, the ones who wouldn't sell their corner ice cream shop for a billion dollars?  Well, with kids the return on the investment is far, far greater.  Not everyone appreciates this, recognizes it, or even makes any investment in their kids in the first place.  But the opportunity is there for them regardless of whether or not they take advantage of it.  People are not hedonists.  They're all about projects.

BTW at some point around your mid-30s, you start to put less value on going out (etc.) than you used to

This is what I'm talking about.  Enjoy it when you're young.  It's fun.  But you won't give a crap about it when you get older.

Offline nicname

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Re: Kids
« Reply #92 on: May 17, 2010, 11:57:44 AM »
Kids are hard work.

You don't get paid for them.

When they are babies sometimes they cry really loud for a long time and you feel helpless as to how to make them feel better.

They are a true restriction on your freedom.

They cost a lot of money.

My son is only 6.5 months old so I don't really know a lot about what goes on in raising older kids.

Chum is right that you kinda just quit worrying about some of the stuff you used to think was important.  

If there was a gif of nicname thwarting the attempted-flag-taker and then gesturing him to suck it, followed by motioning for all of Hilton Shelter to boo him louder, it'd be better than that auburn gif.

Offline nicname

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Re: Kids
« Reply #93 on: May 17, 2010, 12:09:35 PM »

BTW at some point around your mid-30s, you start to put less value on going out (etc.) than you used to

This is what I'm talking about.  Enjoy it when you're young.  It's fun.  But you won't give a crap about it when you get older.

Yep.  I know a couple who have two kids.  She is 20 and he is 22 or 23.  They have two daughters aged 2.5 and 8 months.  They have a lot of problems mostly because they both are still young and their peers are doing what most of us were doing when we were that age.  Our family doesn't have any of those problems, probably because we've already had that type of fun. 

SD seems to be a pretty mature dude with a good relationship/marriage, I think you will be happy with or without kids.  If you don't think you are ready to slow down a bit then wait.  When jet-setting and complete freedom becomes mundane then maybe it's time to start your family.  It is a completely different lifestyle.

I think that if you are happy and love your life you will love having kids.  If you aren't happy especially with your relationship/marriage then kids will really wreck havoc on your life, and their lives will suffer because of it.
If there was a gif of nicname thwarting the attempted-flag-taker and then gesturing him to suck it, followed by motioning for all of Hilton Shelter to boo him louder, it'd be better than that auburn gif.

Offline Pete

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Re: Kids
« Reply #94 on: May 17, 2010, 12:30:15 PM »
Of the things that you might actually do in your lifetime, there’s nothing that you can name that can compete with raising kids in terms of fulfillment.  Go ahead and try it.  The fact that the world is full of crazy bastards that place waaaaaay too much emphasis on the value that kids add to their lives does not change that. 

Building a giant, sustainable public service organization that will last generations past your demise, for rough ridin' starters.  GMAFB about kids being the only way to reach fulfillment.   :jerk:

Offline Pete

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Re: Kids
« Reply #95 on: May 17, 2010, 12:35:55 PM »
Of the things that you might actually do in your lifetime, there’s nothing that you can name that can compete with raising kids in terms of fulfillment.  Go ahead and try it.  The fact that the world is full of crazy bastards that place waaaaaay too much emphasis on the value that kids add to their lives does not change that. 

Building a giant, sustainable public service organization that will last generations past your demise, for fracking starters.  GMAFB about kids being the only way to reach fulfillment.   :jerk:

Or, amassing as much wealth as you possibly can.  Not important to me, but I do know people who are admittedly and observably of that nature.   

Again, what Chum is describing is merely a norm, not an absolute, IMO

Offline Pete

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Re: Kids
« Reply #96 on: May 17, 2010, 12:43:54 PM »
I was of a similar mind as SD when I was facing this decision....very similar process.

I asked Mrs Pete if she could name one thing in her life, that if this one thing did NOT happen, she would most regret.  She said having kids.  I performed the same exercise and couldn't really come up with answer of my own...nothing that I felt THAT strong about, I guess.  So, I decided to side with her.  I haven't regretted it, but like Catzacker says, it's not always blissful.

Offline chum1

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Re: Kids
« Reply #97 on: May 17, 2010, 12:51:45 PM »
Of the things that you might actually do in your lifetime, there’s nothing that you can name that can compete with raising kids in terms of fulfillment.  Go ahead and try it.  The fact that the world is full of crazy bastards that place waaaaaay too much emphasis on the value that kids add to their lives does not change that. 

Building a giant, sustainable public service organization that will last generations past your demise, for fracking starters.  GMAFB about kids being the only way to reach fulfillment.   :jerk:

Or, amassing as much wealth as you possibly can.  Not important to me, but I do know people who are admittedly and observably of that nature.   

Again, what Chum is describing is merely a norm, not an absolute, IMO

What don't you understand about "Of the things that you might actually do in your lifetime?"

Offline Trim

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Re: Kids
« Reply #98 on: May 17, 2010, 01:16:42 PM »
the bottom line is you and your significant other better be attractive, because I imagine it's really hard to love ugly kids.

Yeah, I'm pretty much nails here.  In my limited looking at peoples kids experience mixed race babys/kids are the most attractive.  

I know a couple (you may have met them too) of the same racial and where-you-grew-up breakdown as you and mrs. dave who recently had a girl.  
« Last Edit: May 17, 2010, 01:18:55 PM by Trim »

Offline steve dave

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Re: Kids
« Reply #99 on: May 17, 2010, 01:29:36 PM »
the bottom line is you and your significant other better be attractive, because I imagine it's really hard to love ugly kids.

Yeah, I'm pretty much nails here.  In my limited looking at peoples kids experience mixed race babys/kids are the most attractive.  

I know a couple (you may have met them too) of the same racial and where-you-grew-up breakdown as you and mrs. dave who recently had a girl.  

:dunno: