Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....

[TheHamburglar]

Old BigEast adding Tulsa as #12.  I'm pretty excited about that.

[Skipper44]

Old BigEast adding Tulsa as #12.  I'm pretty excited about that.

I think this makes Danny Manning the second most successful coach from the Self tree, behind BCG and tied with Norm Roberts

[Katpappy]

Old BigEast adding Tulsa as #12.  I'm pretty excited about that.

They're now called the American 12. 

[Skipper44]

Old BigEast adding Tulsa as #12.  I'm pretty excited about that.

They're now called the American 12. 

With all the former members of Conference USA I would of gone in another direction

[Rage Against the McKee]

SunBelt adding 2 full members and 2 FB only members. Big12 now the only conference without plans to go to atleast 12 and add a conference championship game.

If anyone cares, the 2 full members are Appy State and Georgia Southern, and football-only for NMSU and Idaho. Sun Belt's the new WAC, but at least they didn't take Sam Houston State (guaranteed 42 meltdown generator fwiw)

I was very surprised to read that App St. and GA Southern are going FBS and then I looked at the Equity in Athletics for the Sun Belt

Some of those schools are getting hammered. None of them report losses but its obvious they have them when some of the schools have revenues in the $3 million range. Florida Atlantic had $10 million in revenue! Anyway there is greater earning potential than I initially thought but they are going to get hammered for a few years with start up costs incurred with the transition.

With the plans by the Big 10 to stop playing non FBS schools they don't have much choice, especially if the playoff committee makes it some sort of rule that hurts the teams that still play FCS teams (like KSU  )

That kind of a rule would only help KSU, assuming we go ahead and continue to schedule those games anyway. KSU is going to have to go undefeated to make a 4 team playoff. SOS will not matter at all, but if we can convince everyone else that it does matter, maybe some of those schools will end up with an extra loss.

[Panjandrum]

SunBelt adding 2 full members and 2 FB only members. Big12 now the only conference without plans to go to atleast 12 and add a conference championship game.

If anyone cares, the 2 full members are Appy State and Georgia Southern, and football-only for NMSU and Idaho. Sun Belt's the new WAC, but at least they didn't take Sam Houston State (guaranteed 42 meltdown generator fwiw)

I was very surprised to read that App St. and GA Southern are going FBS and then I looked at the Equity in Athletics for the Sun Belt

Some of those schools are getting hammered. None of them report losses but its obvious they have them when some of the schools have revenues in the $3 million range. Florida Atlantic had $10 million in revenue! Anyway there is greater earning potential than I initially thought but they are going to get hammered for a few years with start up costs incurred with the transition.

With the plans by the Big 10 to stop playing non FBS schools they don't have much choice, especially if the playoff committee makes it some sort of rule that hurts the teams that still play FCS teams (like KSU  )

I think we're eventually going to get there because the number of conference games are going to go up for the purposes of pleasing TV partners, and the smaller conferences are going to need to generate revenue because the TV deal disparity is getting to be horrendous.

The Big 4 schools are going to bring in $20+ million per year in media rights.  The America 12 is going to make $1.67M.  The Mountain West is somewhere in that ballpark.  They need non-con games against Big 4 schools to make up that gap as much as possible.

To preserve the illusion of FBS, and make sure that these schools can keep tax exempt status and not screw up a great deal, they're going to have to pay off the 60+ schools in the Other 5.  They'll do this by kicking playoff money their way and ensuring that we schedule them in the non-con so they can take their beating and get their payday.

[TheHamburglar]

Just for fun, that TuxedoYoda guy is now saying UNC to the SEC and Miami to the Big12 are done deals.  Don't know who is going with UNC or Miami. If FSU comes with Miami we stay at 12. If not, we go to 14 with UCF, USF, and another ACC team.

I don't trust any of that dude/tuxedo twitter group, but in the spirit of the thread I'd thought I'd share.

[Pete]

Just for fun, that TuxedoYoda guy is now saying UNC to the SEC and Miami to the Big12 are done deals.  Don't know who is going with UNC or Miami. If FSU comes with Miami we stay at 12. If not, we go to 14 with UCF, USF, and another ACC team.

I don't trust any of that dude/tuxedo twitter group, but in the spirit of the thread I'd thought I'd share.

I'm banned by the Yoga guy, which is weird because the Dude loves me/us.

This bothers me, because I need to balance out wild speculation from one with the other's wild speculation. I am out of balance.

[steve dave]

pete, you should self ban yourself from the dude and the yoda guy and all their running crew.

[Pete]

pete, you should self ban yourself from the dude and the yoda guy and all their running crew.

I can't quit.

[Katpappy]

pete, you should self ban yourself from the dude and the yoda guy and all their running crew.

I can't quit.

Don't quit, keep the updates coming.  If not informative, then damn right entertaining. 

[wabash909]

pete, you should self ban yourself from the dude and the yoda guy and all their running crew.

I can't quit.

It's hard to walk away from something you love.

[Pete]

pete, you should self ban yourself from the dude and the yoda guy and all their running crew.

I can't quit.

It's hard to walk away from something you love.

Conference realignment gossip whores are to me as snakes are to Sys.  Loads of people think conference realignment whores  / snakes are gross, but I still love them (not snakes, I think they are gross).

[Super PurpleCat]

Old BigEast adding Tulsa as #12.  I'm pretty excited about that.

They're now called the American 12. 

With all the former members of Conference USA I would of gone in another direction

Louisiana Purchase 12   

[CyberToothCat]

Does anyone remember when there was speculation that the Big 12 would attempt to lure the Arizona schools away from the Pac 12? With the story out that the Pac 12 head of officials targeted Arizona's basketball coach and Larry Scott essentially condoned it, I wonder if Ariz would be open to having a discussion?

I mean, the allegation is that the head of officials said that the Arizona coach needed to be T-ed up. After it happened, the coach was fined $25 thousand for arguing against the tech. Now we find out that the Technical probably was not legitimate and the Pac 12 still won't refund the fine? I would be PISSED. Indon't know that the Big 12 officials are much better, but at least our cheating goes on behind closed doors...

[Panjandrum]

Does anyone remember when there was speculation that the Big 12 would attempt to lure the Arizona schools away from the Pac 12? With the story out that the Pac 12 head of officials targeted Arizona's basketball coach and Larry Scott essentially condoned it, I wonder if Ariz would be open to having a discussion?

I mean, the allegation is that the head of officials said that the Arizona coach needed to be T-ed up. After it happened, the coach was fined $25 thousand for arguing against the tech. Now we find out that the Technical probably was not legitimate and the Pac 12 still won't refund the fine? I would be PISSED. Indon't know that the Big 12 officials are much better, but at least our cheating goes on behind closed doors...

Grant of Rights.

[Pete]

Does anyone remember when there was speculation that the Big 12 would attempt to lure the Arizona schools away from the Pac 12? With the story out that the Pac 12 head of officials targeted Arizona's basketball coach and Larry Scott essentially condoned it, I wonder if Ariz would be open to having a discussion?

I mean, the allegation is that the head of officials said that the Arizona coach needed to be T-ed up. After it happened, the coach was fined $25 thousand for arguing against the tech. Now we find out that the Technical probably was not legitimate and the Pac 12 still won't refund the fine? I would be PISSED. Indon't know that the Big 12 officials are much better, but at least our cheating goes on behind closed doors...

Grant of Rights.

Theirs, or ours?

[ChiComCat]

Does anyone remember when there was speculation that the Big 12 would attempt to lure the Arizona schools away from the Pac 12? With the story out that the Pac 12 head of officials targeted Arizona's basketball coach and Larry Scott essentially condoned it, I wonder if Ariz would be open to having a discussion?

I mean, the allegation is that the head of officials said that the Arizona coach needed to be T-ed up. After it happened, the coach was fined $25 thousand for arguing against the tech. Now we find out that the Technical probably was not legitimate and the Pac 12 still won't refund the fine? I would be PISSED. Indon't know that the Big 12 officials are much better, but at least our cheating goes on behind closed doors...

Grant of Rights.

I'd imagine you could make a pretty decent argument that the Pac 12 is breaching a contract by targeting Arizona.  Possibly get GoR whittled down or taken away.

That said, couldn't imagine an official giving your coach and a 25k fine is worth blowing up a conference over.  Inferiority complexes blow up conferences.

[Skipper44]

Does anyone remember when there was speculation that the Big 12 would attempt to lure the Arizona schools away from the Pac 12? With the story out that the Pac 12 head of officials targeted Arizona's basketball coach and Larry Scott essentially condoned it, I wonder if Ariz would be open to having a discussion?

I mean, the allegation is that the head of officials said that the Arizona coach needed to be T-ed up. After it happened, the coach was fined $25 thousand for arguing against the tech. Now we find out that the Technical probably was not legitimate and the Pac 12 still won't refund the fine? I would be PISSED. Indon't know that the Big 12 officials are much better, but at least our cheating goes on behind closed doors...

Grant of Rights.

I'd imagine you could make a pretty decent argument that the Pac 12 is breaching a contract by targeting Arizona.  Possibly get GoR whittled down or taken away.

That said, couldn't imagine an official giving your coach and a 25k fine is worth blowing up a conference over.  Inferiority complexes blow up conferences.

Yes, not every school is as insecure as Mizzou. 

Also, the "luring the Arizona schools" is never going to happen, they depend on Cali kids for recruits and enrollment and would take something huge to get them to leave. 

Additionally, FOX already has the West covered and will pay $$$ to get us to go East.

[steve dave]

the GoR is the most over relied upon talking point in conference realignment. it's no different than a buyout other than it doesn't contain a concrete buyout figure. it also wouldn't be fully paid any more than any buyout figure has been in the history of conference realignment. It would make negotiating the ultimate lump sum figure a bigger pain in the ass when someone leaves though.

[Pete]

the GoR is the most over relied upon talking point in conference realignment. it's no different than a buyout other than it doesn't contain a concrete buyout figure. it also wouldn't be fully paid any more than any buyout figure has been in the history of conference realignment. It would make negotiating the ultimate lump sum figure a bigger pain in the ass when someone leaves though.

True.  In simple terms, all the GoR means is that the original conference's media partners would get to broadcast the game and not the new conference's media partners.....An advertiser's check for their ads on games at the offending school's campus go to the prior conference's media partner,  and not to the new conference's media partner, for the length of the contract.

I got a kick out of Kevin Keitzman's ridiculous overestimation of the impact of GoR as an obstacle to KU going to the Big 10.  He was really bent out of shape about it, laying into Kevin Harlan (who claimed that the Big 10 has spoken with Kansas) claiming it would be way too big of hit to the Big 10.  The Whataburger check for the ad at halftime for games in Lawrence would continue to be mailed to the Fox office and not to the Big 10 Network office for the length of the GoR.

In truth, all a GoR would do to KU, for example, would be to deprive their future conference of the revenue of playing games in Lawrence.   The real money is in football, and the opportunity cost of Lawrence football games in 16 team league (loads of crap matchups) is minimal, and arguably worth the investment to get Kansas' 10+ road conference basketball games a year (with conference tournament games).

Now, if you are football power, the media partners might get a bit more jumpy about giving up home game broadcast rights/revenue.

[steve dave]

the GoR is the most over relied upon talking point in conference realignment. it's no different than a buyout other than it doesn't contain a concrete buyout figure. it also wouldn't be fully paid any more than any buyout figure has been in the history of conference realignment. It would make negotiating the ultimate lump sum figure a bigger pain in the ass when someone leaves though.

True.  In simple terms, all the GoR means is that the original conference's media partners would get to broadcast the game and not the new conference's media partners.....An advertiser's check for their ads on games at the offending school's campus go to the prior conference's media partner,  and not to the new conference's media partner, for the length of the contract.

I got a kick out of Kevin Keitzman's ridiculous overestimation of the impact of GoR as an obstacle to KU going to the Big 10.  He was really bent out of shape about it, laying into Kevin Harlan (who claimed that the Big 10 has spoken with Kansas) claiming it would be way too big of hit to the Big 10.  The Whataburger check for the ad at halftime for games in Lawrence would continue to be mailed to the Fox office and not to the Big 10 Network office for the length of the GoR.

In truth, all a GoR would do to KU, for example, would be to deprive their future conference of the revenue of playing games in Lawrence.   The real money is in football, and the opportunity cost of Lawrence football games in 16 team league (loads of crap matchups) is minimal, and arguably worth the investment to get Kansas' 10+ road conference basketball games a year (with conference tournament games).

Now, if you are football power, the media partners might get a bit more jumpy about giving up home game broadcast rights/revenue.

no, it means there would be a buyout paid to the conference at a figure negotiated by both sides

[wazucat]

LOL That any team would voluntarily leave the PAC 12 for the Big 12.  Get a clue.

[Pete]

the GoR is the most over relied upon talking point in conference realignment. it's no different than a buyout other than it doesn't contain a concrete buyout figure. it also wouldn't be fully paid any more than any buyout figure has been in the history of conference realignment. It would make negotiating the ultimate lump sum figure a bigger pain in the ass when someone leaves though.

True.  In simple terms, all the GoR means is that the original conference's media partners would get to broadcast the game and not the new conference's media partners.....An advertiser's check for their ads on games at the offending school's campus go to the prior conference's media partner,  and not to the new conference's media partner, for the length of the contract.

I got a kick out of Kevin Keitzman's ridiculous overestimation of the impact of GoR as an obstacle to KU going to the Big 10.  He was really bent out of shape about it, laying into Kevin Harlan (who claimed that the Big 10 has spoken with Kansas) claiming it would be way too big of hit to the Big 10.  The Whataburger check for the ad at halftime for games in Lawrence would continue to be mailed to the Fox office and not to the Big 10 Network office for the length of the GoR.

In truth, all a GoR would do to KU, for example, would be to deprive their future conference of the revenue of playing games in Lawrence.   The real money is in football, and the opportunity cost of Lawrence football games in 16 team league (loads of crap matchups) is minimal, and arguably worth the investment to get Kansas' 10+ road conference basketball games a year (with conference tournament games).

Now, if you are football power, the media partners might get a bit more jumpy about giving up home game broadcast rights/revenue.

no, it means there would be a buyout paid to the conference at a figure negotiated by both sides

I was outlining the worst possible scenario for the new conference/school, which isn't too bad.  I read your point to be that it's likely easier for the new conference/school than the worst possible scenario....that the worst possible scenario wouldn't be realized.  However, if you are the old conference, what's there to negotiate about?  If I were the Big 12, and the Big 10 took KU, for example, why would the Big 12 even return the Big 10's phone call?  Just cash the mother rough ridin' checks from your media partner, right?  But, that's really beside the point, because the fight would be between media partners, and not between schools/conferences.

Regardless of litigation outcomes, it would seem that it's probably fairly pud to get out of Big 12, if you are KU.  If Kevin Harlan isn't lying on 810am when he says that the Big 10 is talking to KU, and/or Kevin Harlan isn't being lied TO, then KU could merely be waiting for the Big 10 to say the word.    Again, maybe Kevin Harlan is a big fat liar...probably more likely that Delany is playing games with KU, as a super-super-super-safety net option.

Either way, it seems we agree that BITB is full of crap, with regard to the GoR being any sort of obstacle to KU leaving.   

[Skipper44]

Regardless of litigation outcomes, it would seem that it's probably fairly pud to get out of Big 12, if you are KU.  If Kevin Harlan isn't lying on 810am when he says that the Big 10 is talking to KU, and/or Kevin Harlan isn't being lied TO, then KU could merely be waiting for the Big 10 to say the word.    Again, maybe Kevin Harlan is a big fat liar...probably more likely that Delany is playing games with KU, as a super-super-super-safety net option.

I could see a scenario where Fox brokers a deal with KU to the Big 10 that allows better divisional split and/or pods in the Big 12 that make Texas, OU and FSU happy.  If Kevin has spent the last decade working for Fox I would be more inclined to believe him.