Leach.... (not sure if this is good or bad)

[CNS]

watch bill step down nowthat our guy is gone he was probably waiting for exactly this to do so tip limit the negative reaction to handing the reigns to Cosh.

[wabash909]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

[Rams]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

[CNS]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

[turns_cats_trashy]

Want defense and wins. Not one shared division title since 2000 with a lot of offense.

you effing deserve snyder.  loser.

Most underrated post I've ever seen.

[ednksu]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

the problem is you are wrong about the FSU/BB situation.  FSU was stagnating and wasn't competing against their rivals.  We are doing better since BS came back and are doing better against our rivals. 

[CHONGS]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

the problem is you are wrong about the FSU/BB situation.  FSU was stagnating and wasn't competing against their rivals.  We are doing better since BS came back and are doing better against our rivals. 

who other than KU?

[ednksu]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

the problem is you are wrong about the FSU/BB situation.  FSU was stagnating and wasn't competing against their rivals.  We are doing better since BS came back and are doing better against our rivals. 

who other than KU?

we almost won the Mizzou game, we almost won at Lincoln last year.  My issue with people bringing up the FSU argument is that they don't know what the series with UF and ACC teams is like.  I hate to bring up moral victories, but if we have a Jim leavitt instead of Cosh we win Lincoln last year and Mizzou, CU this year.

[CNS]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

the problem is you are wrong about the FSU/BB situation.  FSU was stagnating and wasn't competing against their rivals.  We are doing better since BS came back and are doing better against our rivals. 

who other than KU?

we almost won the Mizzou game, we almost won at Lincoln last year.  My issue with people bringing up the FSU argument is that they don't know what the series with UF and ACC teams is like.  I hate to bring up moral victories, but if we have a Jim leavitt instead of Cosh we win Lincoln last year and Mizzou, CU this year.

JFC

[ednksu]

The waters will be calm after the bottom completely falls out of the program and there is absolutely no succession plan.

Don't fool yourself into believing OB will do it any differently than the last time around.

It won't be his decision this time.  He can't control Currie like he controlled the last administration.

I think we could see a Bowden situation where he is kindly told that it's time to think about bowing out gracefully and then kindly forced to do so even if it's not what he wants at the time.  Hiring and managing coaches is 50% of how AD's are judged (raising funds being the other 50%).  If he lets this drag on and/or lets OB choose his successor he's gambling with his own career.  This will be Currie's legacy and he knows it.  This could literally make or break his career.

Bowden hung around too long too.  If we are going to go this route, we need to pull the trigger earlier and go after the next guy very aggressively.  I don't like the HCIW idea that FSU did either.  Too many mixed signals in that. 

the problem is you are wrong about the FSU/BB situation.  FSU was stagnating and wasn't competing against their rivals.  We are doing better since BS came back and are doing better against our rivals. 

who other than KU?

we almost won the Mizzou game, we almost won at Lincoln last year.  My issue with people bringing up the FSU argument is that they don't know what the series with UF and ACC teams is like.  I hate to bring up moral victories, but if we have a Jim leavitt instead of Cosh we win Lincoln last year and Mizzou, CU this year.

JFC

I said up front and throughout my post how I was constructing the moral win straw man.  If you don't want to contribute to the thread then gtfo. 

[ednksu]

another thing I don't understand about the Leach love on this board.  We have issues with recruiting (qb biggest issue) and defense.  Why would we want a coach who's philosophy is based around out shooting a team rather then containing them.  Well he really haven't had that many issues scoring with a shitty qb, but stopping the other team has always been the issue. 

[CHONGS]

I am not in with Leach, but he would be a step up from the current state of the program.

[ednksu]

I am not in with Leach, but he would be a step up from the current state of the program.

I'm not trying to be a dick.  I would really like some HFBIQ talk.


Why would Leach, an offensive minded coach be an improvement to a team who has had relatively easy time scoring.  I agree that He would bring it for recruiting and QB development. 

[CNS]

Why would any WR, QB, or OL  recruits ever want to play for Leach.  It's not like his teams continually break offensive records for yards, TDs, score, etc.  That's the kind of stuff offensive recruits like. 

Oh, wait....

[ednksu]

Why would any WR, QB, or OL  recruits ever want to play for Leach.  It's not like his teams continually break offensive records for yards, TDs, score, etc.  That's the kind of stuff offensive recruits like. 

Oh, wait....

well here is your first problem.  As far as college players go we aren't hurting in 2/3 areas you listed.  Yes QB is an issue that can't be over stated.  But Leach hasn't produced an NFL qb either.  He has 1 good WR and I honestly don't know of any OL players at the next level.


here is the underlying problem.  Yes recruiting is a massive issue.  Winning will go a lot to solve that.  The biggest issue this year, last year and tomorrow is defense.  So how does hiring an offensive minded coach fix that?  Leach has no track record of success on the defensive side of the ball that I recall.

[CNS]

This year's D is no longer an issue if we put up 45pts a game.

Also, I couldn't care less how many NFL'ers Leach has produced.  His system wins.  It speaks for it's self. 

The argument of him being an outstanding coach is actually strengthened by you noting that he does this without NFL talent.

BTW his D was getting much better under McNeil toward the end.

If we are going to speak in recent "almosts", Leach had Tech as one of the 4 or 5 teams being looked at as possibly playing for the NC with only two games left in his season a couple years ago.

[GetVocalwithCurt]

Maryland wants to be in the Big Ten though... idk how that system works in the Big Ten.

worked for purdue for quite some time.

[ednksu]

This year's D is no longer an issue if we put up 45pts a game.

Also, I couldn't care less how many NFL'ers Leach has produced.  His system wins.  It speaks for it's self. 

The argument of him being an outstanding coach is actually strengthened by you noting that he does this without NFL talent.

BTW his D was getting much better under McNeil toward the end.

If we are going to speak in recent "almosts", Leach had Tech as one of the 4 or 5 teams being looked at as possibly playing for the NC with only two games left in his season a couple years ago.

I really have to disagree with you about your points
I take it you didn't go to the North Texas game.  45 points didn't seem like enough.  We shouldn't have to score 45+ to win.  35 average should be enough. 

College players are vastly different then nfl players.  size, play speed, scheme makes one player incomparable to others.  El was a decent college qb  and failed in a pro system. 

What has he won by the way?  At the very least its a KU/Mangino style of argument.  At a certain point you have to 'win the north!' or the south in order to really be taken seriously.  Even with vastly superior offensive talent he couldn't do it.  It came down to the cliche of defense winning champs or at the very least divisions.

[Katpappy]

gee, i wonder what their head to head record against each other as head coaches (while they were in the same conference) would be. seems like that would be a pretty good way to settle who the better coach is once and for all.

Rick, weren't some of the largest beat downs from Leach's teams since the start of the Big XII?  Made me shudder when we had to face the Pirate; and U don't fack with players with fat little girl friends...har, har!

[CNS]

This year's D is no longer an issue if we put up 45pts a game.

Also, I couldn't care less how many NFL'ers Leach has produced.  His system wins.  It speaks for it's self. 

The argument of him being an outstanding coach is actually strengthened by you noting that he does this without NFL talent.

BTW his D was getting much better under McNeil toward the end.

If we are going to speak in recent "almosts", Leach had Tech as one of the 4 or 5 teams being looked at as possibly playing for the NC with only two games left in his season a couple years ago.

I really have to disagree with you about your points
I take it you didn't go to the North Texas game.  45 points didn't seem like enough.  We shouldn't have to score 45+ to win.  35 average should be enough. 

College players are vastly different then nfl players.  size, play speed, scheme makes one player incomparable to others.  El was a decent college qb  and failed in a pro system. 

What has he won by the way?  At the very least its a KU/Mangino style of argument.  At a certain point you have to 'win the north!' or the south in order to really be taken seriously.  Even with vastly superior offensive talent he couldn't do it.  It came down to the cliche of defense winning champs or at the very least divisions.

Pretty much every Leach team ever would have hung 60 on that N TX team.

I understand the diff btwn college and NFL.  That is actually my point.  Weird that you don't get that.

Leach was up against some of the best teams in recent college history in TX and OU for the majority of his career.   Doesn't matter anyway.  Winning the N or the S is done as of 2011 since the divisions will no longer exist. 

[Katpappy]

This year's D is no longer an issue if we put up 45pts a game.

Also, I couldn't care less how many NFL'ers Leach has produced.  His system wins.  It speaks for it's self. 

The argument of him being an outstanding coach is actually strengthened by you noting that he does this without NFL talent.

BTW his D was getting much better under McNeil toward the end.

If we are going to speak in recent "almosts", Leach had Tech as one of the 4 or 5 teams being looked at as possibly playing for the NC with only two games left in his season a couple years ago.

I really have to disagree with you about your points
I take it you didn't go to the North Texas game.  45 points didn't seem like enough.  We shouldn't have to score 45+ to win.  35 average should be enough. 

College players are vastly different then nfl players.  size, play speed, scheme makes one player incomparable to others.  El was a decent college qb  and failed in a pro system. 

What has he won by the way?  At the very least its a KU/Mangino style of argument.  At a certain point you have to 'win the north!' or the south in order to really be taken seriously.  Even with vastly superior offensive talent he couldn't do it.  It came down to the cliche of defense winning champs or at the very least divisions.

Pretty much every Leach team ever would have hung 60 on that N TX team.

I understand the diff btwn college and NFL.  That is actually my point.  Weird that you don't get that.

Leach was up against some of the best teams in recent college history in TX and OU for the majority of his career.   Doesn't matter anyway.  Winning the N or the S is done as of 2011 since the divisions will no longer exist. 

One thing for sure, OB was right when he said this round robin thing will not help KSU get to a BCS bowl.  Now it's just too hard with this competition.

[swish1]

This year's D is no longer an issue if we put up 45pts a game.

Also, I couldn't care less how many NFL'ers Leach has produced.  His system wins.  It speaks for it's self. 

The argument of him being an outstanding coach is actually strengthened by you noting that he does this without NFL talent.

BTW his D was getting much better under McNeil toward the end.

If we are going to speak in recent "almosts", Leach had Tech as one of the 4 or 5 teams being looked at as possibly playing for the NC with only two games left in his season a couple years ago.

I really have to disagree with you about your points
I take it you didn't go to the North Texas game.  45 points didn't seem like enough.  We shouldn't have to score 45+ to win.  35 average should be enough. 

College players are vastly different then nfl players.  size, play speed, scheme makes one player incomparable to others.  El was a decent college qb  and failed in a pro system. 

What has he won by the way?  At the very least its a KU/Mangino style of argument.  At a certain point you have to 'win the north!' or the south in order to really be taken seriously.  Even with vastly superior offensive talent he couldn't do it.  It came down to the cliche of defense winning champs or at the very least divisions.

quit embarrassing yourself and just admit that leach would be a step up from what we have now.  its not even close to a mangino argument.  tech had been good for years under leach, uk had only 1 good year under mangino. 

and now the north/south talking point is out  the window.  what is not to like about leach?

[Rage Against the McKee]

I have been sold on Mike Leach since he fired Lyle Setencich. LHC Bill Snyder would never have the balls to do that. Also, Texas Tech has had a better defense than K-State every year since 2003, so  at thinking Mike Leach wouldn't be an upgrade.

[Katpappy]

I have been sold on Mike Leach since he fired Lyle Setencich. LHC Bill Snyder would never have the balls to do that. Also, Texas Tech has had a better defense than K-State every year since 2003, so  at thinking Mike Leach wouldn't be an upgrade.

I can't believe we are even have fans on this site that would think the Pirate wouldn't be a big get for us.  The old man has seen his better days. 

[CNS]

I have been sold on Mike Leach since he fired Lyle Setencich. LHC Bill Snyder would never have the balls to do that. Also, Texas Tech has had a better defense than K-State every year since 2003, so  at thinking Mike Leach wouldn't be an upgrade.

I can't believe we are even have fans on this site that would think the Pirate wouldn't be a big get for us.  The old man has seen his better days. 

Exactly.  Pretty Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!).