Author Topic: Athletes Forcing Change  (Read 94659 times)

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Offline catastrophe

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #75 on: June 28, 2020, 04:47:20 PM »
Yeah the dude is def wanting to come with a list of other offenders.

Offline BIG APPLE CAT

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #76 on: June 28, 2020, 04:59:31 PM »
Spracs I'm not a "law guy" but for the cases you've cited were those people accused of crimes or jailed? I don't think anyone is suggesting to take away his liberty. I, for one, would encourage him to enjoy educational opportunities somewhere else.

Is it bc KSU is a public institution?

Offline Spracne

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #77 on: June 28, 2020, 05:04:21 PM »
Spracs I'm not a "law guy" but for the cases you've cited were those people accused of crimes or jailed? I don't think anyone is suggesting to take away his liberty. I, for one, would encourage him to enjoy educational opportunities somewhere else.

Is it bc KSU is a public institution?
Yes, KSU is a "state actor" for Constitutional purposes. Bear in mind that Constitutional rights only protect individuals from state action.

Offline 8manpick

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #78 on: June 28, 2020, 05:25:00 PM »
Pretty rough ridin' stupid.  They want a policy put in place to be able to dismiss a person from the university for being disrespectful. What a clown show.

Just go beat up this individual piece of crap person who attends the university and said stuff on Twitter and move on.

easy for you to dismiss this guy as just being "disrespectful".

oddly enough, beating up this guy would CLEARLY be grounds for dismissal
No, I’m talking specifically about the statement from the athletes. “We are demanding that Kansas State University put a policy in place that allows a student to be dismissed for displaying racist, threatening or disrespectful actions toward a student or groups of students.”

You can get expelled for sexual harassment, how is a policy.banning race based harassment any different? Like with Gundy and the OAN shirt, why are we making the assumption that their knowledge of this crap head is limited to the one tweet?
I think a policy banning race based harassment could be a good one. I don’t think a policy banning disrespect, with penalty of expulsion, would be good in any circumstance.
:adios:

Offline steve dave

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #79 on: June 28, 2020, 05:46:04 PM »
My guess would be that what ends up happening is the University has some strong words against this student but concludes that they can't justly expel him based on current campus policies, but they are in the process of rewriting those policies to address issues like this in the future.

Which happens to be what the players asked for
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Offline Spracne

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #80 on: June 28, 2020, 06:08:47 PM »
My guess would be that what ends up happening is the University has some strong words against this student but concludes that they can't justly expel him based on current campus policies, but they are in the process of rewriting those policies to address issues like this in the future.

Which happens to be what the players asked for

Depending on how that new policy is written and enforced, and I'm guessing this is out of Spracs wheelhouse, how would the new policy also not be subject to a 1st amendment challenge?

 Just be in a better position to hold up by having some precedent on campus for making students abide by it? I mean KSU would still be a state school and the constitution would still be there...

Policies that "discriminate on the basis of race" (e.g., affirmative action) are subject to the same standard of review ("strict scrutiny"), and yet several such policies have been found in the university context to be "narrowly tailored" to further a "compelling government interest," namely, diversity in higher education.

Affirmative action policies, just like campus speech codes, implicate constitutional rights, and thus have to be very carefully drafted and applied. But just because they affect constitutional rights does not mean that they are per se unconstitutional (Sometimes they are. For example, racial quotas are per se unconstitutional). It remains theoretically possible to narrowly tailor speech codes to advance a compelling government interest. And if there is one administrator who could narrowly tailor such a policy, who better than Gene Tailor?

While there hasn't been a case construing campus speech codes that has made it all the way to SCOTUS, a policy that was evenly applied would stand a better chance of passing constitutional muster. I would envision a system with progressively more severe sanctions based on clear criteria. First offense? Warning. Second offense? Notation on your permanent record. Third offense? Show cause hearing before student government body to demonstrate why you should not be publicly sanctioned. .... X offense? Possible expulsion. And then you would have to investigate every report of threatening or harrassing communications, and apply clear standards in an even-handed manner. No Constitutional right is absolute. Even First Amendment rights are subject to reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions. The key is to avoid vagueness, overbreadth, and arbitrary enforcement, as those are the usual grounds for striking down speech-based state actions.

Offline catastrophe

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #81 on: June 28, 2020, 06:23:33 PM »
Easy way to have a policy that expels white supremacists is to stipulate that enforcement on the first offense can be waived if the person publicly states that they had no intention to disparage a protected group or support the superiority of any racial group.

Offline catastrophe

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #82 on: June 28, 2020, 07:10:30 PM »
Alternate (better?) idea: raise tuition to $200k per semester, but unlimited scholarships available for students who write a 200 word essay describing why black lives matter.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #83 on: June 28, 2020, 07:13:18 PM »
You're making a gigantic reach if you are classifying that tweet as harassment.

If I tweet out something derogatory about Jesus, am I harrasing Christians?

Depends on the circumstance, however that wasn't really the point, the larger point is "it was a joke" isn't a defense of harassment.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #84 on: June 28, 2020, 07:14:40 PM »
Pretty rough ridin' stupid.  They want a policy put in place to be able to dismiss a person from the university for being disrespectful. What a clown show.

Just go beat up this individual piece of crap person who attends the university and said stuff on Twitter and move on.

easy for you to dismiss this guy as just being "disrespectful".

oddly enough, beating up this guy would CLEARLY be grounds for dismissal
No, I’m talking specifically about the statement from the athletes. “We are demanding that Kansas State University put a policy in place that allows a student to be dismissed for displaying racist, threatening or disrespectful actions toward a student or groups of students.”

You can get expelled for sexual harassment, how is a policy.banning race based harassment any different? Like with Gundy and the OAN shirt, why are we making the assumption that their knowledge of this crap head is limited to the one tweet?
I think a policy banning race based harassment could be a good one. I don’t think a policy banning disrespect, with penalty of expulsion, would be good in any circumstance.

Don't get lost in the weeds.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #85 on: June 28, 2020, 07:16:49 PM »
Why was my post deleted?

Did eastcat actually have a post deleted?

Offline DaBigTrain

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #86 on: June 28, 2020, 07:22:02 PM »
If so it was the deep state mods  :shakesfist:
"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks"

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Offline eastcat

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #87 on: June 28, 2020, 07:23:41 PM »
Why was my post deleted?

Did eastcat actually have a post deleted?

Yep. Asked Michigan cat why he hated the constitution so much.

Offline GregKSU1027

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #88 on: June 28, 2020, 07:24:55 PM »
Why was my post deleted?

Did eastcat actually have a post deleted?

Yep. Asked Michigan cat why he hated the constitution so much.
Lolz. Well I wouldn’t say he hates the constitution...


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Offline Trim

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #89 on: June 28, 2020, 07:28:19 PM »
Why was my post deleted?

Did eastcat actually have a post deleted?

Yep. Asked Michigan cat why he hated the constitution so much.

It's right here. You even got an answer from him.

https://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=41201.msg1990490#msg1990490

Online wetwillie

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #90 on: June 28, 2020, 07:38:23 PM »
More like cantreadcat
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

Offline eastcat

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #91 on: June 28, 2020, 08:48:53 PM »
On a serious note, this season would be a great opportunity to end football at the college level.

We know its dangerous. This is a convenient place to stop.

Offline gatoveintisiete

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #92 on: June 28, 2020, 10:04:47 PM »
with athletes able to profit off of their likeness I would be ok with a professional only model for sports.  Universities could focus on education and maybe some intramural activities.  Flag football obviously.
it’s not like I’m tired of WINNING, but dude, let me catch my breath.

Online wetwillie

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #93 on: June 28, 2020, 10:11:35 PM »
Minor league football teams wouldn’t work
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

Offline DQ12

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #94 on: June 28, 2020, 10:15:47 PM »
This Jaden fellow has really gotten under my skin.


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Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #95 on: June 29, 2020, 12:21:00 AM »
On a serious note, this season would be a great opportunity to end football at the college level.

We know its dangerous. This is a convenient place to stop.

Hey bud remember a few posts ago when you tried to play the victim and then had your question answered very clearly and then just tried to skate right on past it with no acknowledgement other than, “on a serious note...”

Rofl @ eastcat
« Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 02:45:53 PM by SkinnyBenny »
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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #96 on: June 29, 2020, 04:22:35 AM »
On a serious note, this season would be a great opportunity to end football at the college level.

We know its dangerous. This is a convenient place to stop.

with athletes able to profit off of their likeness I would be ok with a professional only model for sports.  Universities could focus on education and maybe some intramural activities.  Flag football obviously.

These honkeys are so upset about student-athletes actually being treated like humans that they are ready to punt on college sports, literally overnight.

Offline gatoveintisiete

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #97 on: June 29, 2020, 08:06:29 AM »
On a serious note, this season would be a great opportunity to end football at the college level.

We know its dangerous. This is a convenient place to stop.

with athletes able to profit off of their likeness I would be ok with a professional only model for sports.  Universities could focus on education and maybe some intramural activities.  Flag football obviously.

These honkeys are so upset about student-athletes actually being treated like humans that they are ready to punt on college sports, literally overnight.

Our point had more to do with professionalism and CTE safety, but if that allows you an opportunity to use racist slang, you do you....
it’s not like I’m tired of WINNING, but dude, let me catch my breath.

Offline BIG APPLE CAT

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #98 on: June 29, 2020, 08:15:22 AM »
yes MIR please show some decorum if you must spout that kind of vitriol could you at least say like "the h-word" instead of spelling out h**keys?

Offline catastrophe

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Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« Reply #99 on: June 29, 2020, 09:39:41 AM »
Not a good look for some of my fellow honkeys ITT