The riot to reform police thread

[catastrophe]

Personally I don’t really gaf about any statues but I do think the vandals should pay for the damage.

like a reparation?

Well except this would be payment from the exact perpetrators to the exact victim. So maybe more like a lawsuit.

you should look up the definition of the word "reparation". "Exactness" doesn't have anything to do with it

I truly have no idea where you are going with this.

[Spracne]

That would be Union General and President Ulysses S. Grant?

Left off slave owner

I'm not going to look too much into it, but his wiki page seems to suggest his ties to slavery were pretty weak, with lots of evidence suggesting he supported emancipation (like teabagging the Confederacy). There should be more nuance when peering into the past. If the standard is that recordable history starts at the point where the badges of racism cease to exist in society, then history has yet to begin.

Anyway, I guess I just was unaware that Grant had been cancelled.

You own one fellow human being and they never let you live it down...

You say this, but in 50 years when the vast majority of humans realize how barbaric the practice of imbibing energy drinks was, I hope you're not around to find out for whom the bell tolls. Hint: for thee.

[treysolid]

Personally I don’t really gaf about any statues but I do think the vandals should pay for the damage.

like a reparation?

Well except this would be payment from the exact perpetrators to the exact victim. So maybe more like a lawsuit.

you should look up the definition of the word "reparation". "Exactness" doesn't have anything to do with it

I truly have no idea where you are going with this.

you're too caught up in the details. why would anyone give a eff about tearing down one USG statue? if 300 confederate statues get torn down, that's awesome right? but if protestors tear down 300 confederate statues and 1 USG statue, now all of a sudden it's a rough ridin' travesty.

[sys]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

[Dugout DickStone]

That would be Union General and President Ulysses S. Grant?

Left off slave owner

I'm not going to look too much into it, but his wiki page seems to suggest his ties to slavery were pretty weak, with lots of evidence suggesting he supported emancipation (like teabagging the Confederacy). There should be more nuance when peering into the past. If the standard is that recordable history starts at the point where the badges of racism cease to exist in society, then history has yet to begin.

Anyway, I guess I just was unaware that Grant had been cancelled.

You own one fellow human being and they never let you live it down...

You say this, but in 50 years when the vast majority of humans realize how barbaric the practice of imbibing energy drinks was, I hope you're not around to find out for whom the bell tolls. Hint: for thee.

Then my statues will have to come down. It’s the rules

[treysolid]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

[michigancat]

I think tearing down the grant statue is silly even though I had no idea it existed.

It's also interesting that I learned he was a slaveowner because of it, considering the main non-racist argument against tearing down the confederate statues is you'll forget history.

[DQ12]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

Great.  Glad we agree that tearing down the Grant statue was dumb. 

[kim carnes]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

You could literally say the same thing about this country and yet your maligning it on this board constantly. 

[treysolid]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

Great.  Glad we agree that tearing down the Grant statue was dumb.

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

[treysolid]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

You could literally say the same thing about this country and yet your maligning it on this board constantly.

except when the country fucks up, people needlessly suffer. that's alot different from tearing down a statue of a union general (a victimless crime).

[sys]

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

this is literally the same argument made by those who oppose removing statues of confederate soldiers.


and it's just as stupid on either side.  the stories we tell ourselves about our history matter.  they're part of what forms our culture.

[treysolid]

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

this is literally the same argument made by those who oppose removing statues of confederate soldiers.


and it's just as stupid on either side.  the stories we tell ourselves about our history matter.  they're part of what forms our culture.

except that people's lives ARE negatively affected by glorification of the antebellum south. it really seems to be picking nits - you tear down one statue that maybe didn't deserve to be torn down and every POS pub comes out of the woodwork to suggest that the BLM movement is dangerous, or stupid, or just an example of cancel culture, instead of the many great substantive things that it is

[gatoveintisiete]

treysolid 

[treysolid]

treysolid 

POS pub right on cue

[Spracne]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

Great.  Glad we agree that tearing down the Grant statue was dumb.

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

I happen to be the great-great-great great-grandson of USG, and I can tell you this hit me like a shot to the gut.

[DQ12]

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

this is literally the same argument made by those who oppose removing statues of confederate soldiers.


and it's just as stupid on either side.  the stories we tell ourselves about our history matter.  they're part of what forms our culture.

except that people's lives ARE negatively affected by glorification of the antebellum south. it really seems to be picking nits - you tear down one statue that maybe didn't deserve to be torn down and every POS pub comes out of the woodwork to suggest that the BLM movement is dangerous, or stupid, or just an example of cancel culture, instead of the many great substantive things that it is

You can be critical of tearing down the USG statue without condemning the broader movement.  As proof, many people have done it right here in the last page and a half of this thread.

[treysolid]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

Great.  Glad we agree that tearing down the Grant statue was dumb.

whose life is negatively affected by that? much ado about nothing

I happen to be the great-great-great great-grandson of USG, and I can tell you this hit me like a shot to the gut.

my condolences for your loss, spracs

[wetwillie]

If people want to topple statues there is one in MHK I could direct them towards.

[star seed 7]

If people want to topple statues there is one in MHK I could direct them towards.

What do you have against Johnny kaw, fascist?

[8manpick]

If people want to topple statues there is one in MHK I could direct them towards.

What do you have against Johnny kaw, fascist?

[LickNeckey]

 

[sys]

you tear down one statue that maybe didn't deserve to be torn down and every POS pub comes out of the woodwork to suggest that the BLM movement is dangerous, or stupid, or just an example of cancel culture.

no one is saying that.  they're saying that one small group of people in one city was just randomly pulling down statues without any real justification or rationale.

of the three statues they pulled down, they pulled down two that were like: "huh, that's weird."  and one that was like:  "lol, you dudes are complete dumbasses."

[Fedor]

yeah, look it's bad and the people that tore down that statue are dumbasses.  you don't have to reflexively defend everything that people you perceive as on your side do.

at the same time, it's also counterproductive to malign a movement that's doing a lot of good things just because they aren't doing everything perfectly 

Yeah, just like the police.

[sonofdaxjones]

Was that Talcum X calling for the destruction of historic stained glass windows because Jesus looks White?