Author Topic: The State of Our Union (Read 9844 times)

420seriouscat69 · « **Reply #100 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:27:00 AM »

Wow, Phil's meltdown in here last night.

catastrophe · « **Reply #101 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:37:22 AM »

Another memorable moment. This is pretty close to the actual conversation.

Trump: "And we finally repealed the worst part of Obamacare, the individual mandate."

Mrs. Cat (in health insurance but doesn't care about politics): "What?!"

Me: "Yeah, they repealed the individual mandate as part of the tax bill."

Mrs. Cat: "But they don't really mean that right? They mean they replaced it with something else or changed the rule on preexisting conditions too."

Me: "Nope"

Mrs. Cat: "WHAT ARE THEY DOING?"

john "teach me how to" dougie · « **Reply #102 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:46:24 AM »

Yes, the individual mandate was a tax. Republicans were arguing that from the beginning, but Obama kept denying it until it got to the supreme court. Stud move on his part.

chum1 · « **Reply #103 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:47:56 AM »

Trump is a very sincere speaker.

Phil Titola · « **Reply #104 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:53:24 AM »

Quote from: WackyCat08 on January 31, 2018, 08:27:00 AM

Wow, Phil's meltdown in here last night.

Lol wut? Which part was a meltdown?

420seriouscat69 · « **Reply #105 on:** January 31, 2018, 08:59:34 AM »

I think my favorite part was that every news outlet was calling it a success, but you were trying so hard to find something wrong with it.

Classic lib Phil.

catastrophe · « **Reply #106 on:** January 31, 2018, 09:00:36 AM »

I should have clarified. The conversation I posted would only make sense if you knew how health insurance works.

Whisker Biscuit · « **Reply #107 on:** January 31, 2018, 09:14:55 AM »

Quote from: catastrophe on January 31, 2018, 09:00:36 AM

I should have clarified. The conversation I posted would only make sense if you knew how health insurance works.

Your conversation as posted makes it sound like your wife has no idea what the individual mandate is/was. No dog in this fight, just an observation.

star seed 7 · « **Reply #108 on:** January 31, 2018, 09:59:05 AM »

Quote from: sys on January 30, 2018, 10:18:55 PM

i think i figured out all the people that were picking incomprehensible temps. they don't actually know what temperature it is! they probably see the high for the day and then they walk outside at like 7 am and they're like, "hey, this is pretty nice. i guess 90 F is a comfortable temperature."

If the high is 90, there is a good chance it's already 80 at 7am so they are still weirdo losers

Phil Titola · « **Reply #109 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:05:49 AM »

Quote from: WackyCat08 on January 31, 2018, 08:59:34 AM

I think my favorite part was that every news outlet was calling it a success, but you were trying so hard to find something wrong with it. Classic lib Phil.

Lol. Yeah I was trying really really hard

420seriouscat69 · « **Reply #110 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:07:36 AM »

Thanks for admitting it,

Phil Titola · « **Reply #111 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:09:24 AM »

Quote from: WackyCat08 on January 31, 2018, 10:07:36 AM

Thanks for admitting it,

5 posts on a topic isn't a meltdown...you should know the meltdown guidelines.

K-S-U-Wildcats! · « **Reply #112 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:24:33 AM »

Quote from: catastrophe on January 31, 2018, 08:37:22 AM

Another memorable moment. This is pretty close to the actual conversation.

Trump: "And we finally repealed the worst part of Obamacare, the individual mandate."

Mrs. Cat (in health insurance but doesn't care about politics): "What?!"

Me: "Yeah, they repealed the individual mandate as part of the tax bill."

Mrs. Cat: "But they don't really mean that right? They mean they replaced it with something else or changed the rule on preexisting conditions too."

Me: "Nope"

Mrs. Cat: "WHAT ARE THEY DOING?"

You shoulda heard some of my conversations back when Dems were ramming this turd through in the first place. Wish we had headed off these problems at that point.

catastrophe · « **Reply #113 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:38:15 AM »

Quote from: Whisker Biscuit on January 31, 2018, 09:14:55 AM

Quote from: catastrophe on January 31, 2018, 09:00:36 AM
I should have clarified. The conversation I posted would only make sense if you knew how health insurance works.

Your conversation as posted makes it sound like your wife has no idea what the individual mandate is/was. No dog in this fight, just an observation.

Here it is again, with subtext:

Quote from: catastrophe on January 31, 2018, 08:37:22 AM

Another memorable moment. This is pretty close to the actual conversation.

Trump: "And we finally repealed the worst part of Obamacare, the individual mandate." [The individual mandate is the requirement that all Americans purchase health insurance]

Mrs. Cat (in health insurance but doesn't care about politics): "What?!" [It's basically the backbone of the entire Affordable Care Act]

Me: "Yeah, they repealed the individual mandate as part of the tax bill."

Mrs. Cat: "But they don't really mean that right? They mean they replaced it with something else or changed the rule on preexisting conditions too." [It makes zero sense to only repeal the individual mandate aspect of the bill. If you require health insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions, but do not require healthy individuals to buy insurance, it means healthy people have zero reason to buy health insurance until they get sick. That is like the exact opposite of what insurance is supposed to be.]

Me: "Nope"

Mrs. Cat: "WHAT ARE THEY DOING?" [Insurance companies now have to cover sick people, healthy people now don't have to buy insurance until they get sick, and the federal government now pays subsidies to insurance companies to make sure rates are not insanely high. Basically, we are currently in a system where sick people receive government bailouts, but it a convoluted way that makes it even more expensive than single payer would ever be.]

K-S-U-Wildcats! · « **Reply #114 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:45:22 AM »

Probably shouldn’t have passed a law requiring insurance to cover preexisting conditions, huh? Also, insurance premiums were exploding regardless of the individual mandate because not nearly enough young, healthy people were buying insurance, mandate be damned.

And not to quibble, but the primary aim of Obamacare was always expanding Medicaid. It has been marvelously “successful” (at running up massive costs) in that regard.

Democrats rammed this crap bill through, and it’s gonna get worse until they join with Pubs to fix the mess they made. By contrast, Pubs rammed through tax reform, which I suspect is going to be hugely popular.

catastrophe · « **Reply #115 on:** January 31, 2018, 10:51:10 AM »

I did not like Obamacare at all, although most people agreed something should be done about the current treatment of preexisting conditions. This is really more about how Republicans decided to make it the worst possible version of anything instead of passing something that made sense.

That said, the more I think about it, the more I think Democrats were actually ok with repealing the individual mandate because we are now way closer to single payer than we ever have been. Insurance companies are going to struggle. If the system collapses, the government will be forced to step in and essentially subsidize insurers to the point where the government becomes the ultimate provider.

ChiComCat · « **Reply #116 on:** January 31, 2018, 11:02:25 AM »

My thoughts after not watching the speech and not watching the rebuttal

SOTU: Was probably a good speech. Some of that is also probably graded on a curve for Trump so long as he doesn't say anything outright inflammatory. Glad he invited that police officer. Not a GOP/Dem thing, that police officer is probably just a great dude

Rebuttal: That speech location/backdrop is way too pandery. Don't like the Kennedy choice. If Dem's want to give the Trump kids crap for their ridiculous involvement, should probably make sure Kennedy has some signature achievements on his own (maybe he does?)

catastrophe · « **Reply #117 on:** January 31, 2018, 11:39:45 AM »

I wouldn't expect much in the way of accomplishments for rebuttal speakers. At least in recent history, the response has always been used to let a younger, lesser-known congressperson get some spotlight time. I hadn't heard of Rubio before his response, and I did not know there was another Kennedy in congress until this one.

I_have_purplewood · « **Reply #118 on:** January 31, 2018, 12:29:18 PM »

Quote from: ChiCat on January 31, 2018, 11:02:25 AM

My thoughts after not watching the speech and not watching the rebuttal

SOTU: Was probably a good speech. Some of that is also probably graded on a curve for Trump so long as he doesn't say anything outright inflammatory. Glad he invited that police officer. Not a GOP/Dem thing, that police officer is probably just a great dude

Rebuttal: That speech location/backdrop is way too pandery. Don't like the Kennedy choice. If Dem's want to give the Trump kids crap for their ridiculous involvement, should probably make sure Kennedy has some signature achievements on his own (maybe he does?)

Pretty accurate recap. I didn't think it was a bad speech and I thought the rebuttal was totally pandering. He speaks good Spanish though.

Dugout DickStone · « **Reply #119 on:** January 31, 2018, 01:02:52 PM »

wonder why Baio didn't go...

Whisker Biscuit · « **Reply #120 on:** January 31, 2018, 01:05:57 PM »

Quote from: K-S-U-Wildcats! on January 31, 2018, 10:45:22 AM

Probably shouldn’t have passed a law requiring insurance to cover preexisting conditions, huh? Also, insurance premiums were exploding regardless of the individual mandate because not nearly enough young, healthy people were buying insurance, mandate be damned.

And not to quibble, but the primary aim of Obamacare was always expanding Medicaid. It has been marvelously “successful” (at running up massive costs) in that regard.

Democrats rammed this crap bill through, and it’s gonna get worse until they join with Pubs to fix the mess they made. By contrast, Pubs rammed through tax reform, which I suspect is going to be hugely popular.

Most of America has no idea how much Obamacare has mumped up insurance coverage for people that are not covered by the gov't or their employer (which is most of America). For those people like myself who actually have to purchase our own insurance....my wife and son and i are on our 4th different provider in 4 years and pay around 3X what we were paying 5 years ago for less coverage and a much higher deductible. It's basically a month long process (on the phone) each time our provider decides they aren't going to cover our "area" any longer. It's a way bigger mess than most people realize.

I_have_purplewood · « **Reply #121 on:** January 31, 2018, 01:18:52 PM »

Quote from: Whisker Biscuit on January 31, 2018, 01:05:57 PM

Quote from: K-S-U-Wildcats! on January 31, 2018, 10:45:22 AM
Probably shouldn’t have passed a law requiring insurance to cover preexisting conditions, huh? Also, insurance premiums were exploding regardless of the individual mandate because not nearly enough young, healthy people were buying insurance, mandate be damned.

And not to quibble, but the primary aim of Obamacare was always expanding Medicaid. It has been marvelously “successful” (at running up massive costs) in that regard.

Democrats rammed this crap bill through, and it’s gonna get worse until they join with Pubs to fix the mess they made. By contrast, Pubs rammed through tax reform, which I suspect is going to be hugely popular.

Most of America has no idea how much Obamacare has mumped up insurance coverage for people that are not covered by the gov't or their employer (which is most of America). For those people like myself who actually have to purchase our own insurance....my wife and son and i are on our 4th different provider in 4 years and pay around 3X what we were paying 5 years ago for less coverage and a much higher deductible. It's basically a month long process (on the phone) each time our provider decides they aren't going to cover our "area" any longer. It's a way bigger mess than most people realize.

There is much truth to this statement. The people I would listen to debate insurance would be the people that have had to use Obamacare in some form. The coverage is total crap and very expensive.

star seed 7 · « **Reply #122 on:** January 31, 2018, 01:24:54 PM »

Think about that wonderful free socialized medicine wb

Phil Titola · « **Reply #123 on:** January 31, 2018, 01:45:18 PM »

Lot of confusing health insurance and healthcare.

ChiComCat · « **Reply #124 on:** January 31, 2018, 02:05:22 PM »

Quote from: catastrophe on January 31, 2018, 11:39:45 AM

I wouldn't expect much in the way of accomplishments for rebuttal speakers. At least in recent history, the response has always been used to let a younger, lesser-known congressperson get some spotlight time. I hadn't heard of Rubio before his response, and I did not know there was another Kennedy in congress until this one.

I agree that it's usually a rising star so accomplishments maybe light but don't like a Kennedy in that role. Maybe 2 years away from an election, it's not a huge deal but I think using a Kennedy speaks to the Democrats' problem that helped cost them the election. It shouldn't be hard to appeal to the working class better than billionaire Trump but the Democrats keep trotting out rich, white people from career politician families to do it.