Congrats to Baylor, OU, and OSU . . .

[Skipper44]

it's just reality. k-state hoops is headed for disaster, and football isn't far behind.

at least hoops has potential for upside post weber.

do you have any additional reasons for the above other than the simple math that it is easier to recruit 2 or 3 good to great players in hoops than recruiting the 3 to 4 needed on each side of ball in football?

if briles, patterson and gundy stay where they are, k-state football is rolling a gigantic boulder up a hill in football. what snyder did in pt ii, particularly in the B2B klein years, was as amazing as anything i've witnessed not just in college football, but any sport at any level ever. good luck trying to string together consistent great years in the B12 while facing those five schools year after year in the post snyder era.

i know some get excited about 8-4 or 9-3 and trips to the Wild Wings or Alamo Bowls, but...blah, not all that exciting. k-state can certainly achieve plenty of 7-5 years going forward with occasional 8-4's and 9-3's when everything goes perfect. but post snyder, i'll make k-state a big underdog to post another 10-win season by 2025.

k-state hoops is likely to be in the bottom half of the league for the foreseeable future, but will build toward occasional good years and make the 68-team field every now and then. that's at least semi exciting.

sounds like you feel 11-7/10-8 in hoops is more enjoyable than 6-3/5-4 in football.  That is actually a very pretty good question from a personal perspective even if financially football wins by a landslide. 

I do agree the Big 12 is full of football first ADs and moving up the food chain is much easier when only the KU, ISU and KSU fanbases really give 2 shits about basketball.

[meow meow]

j rake also thinks it's hard to recruit to Manhattan.

[MakeItRain]

Fanning thinks this team wins 3 more games

Yeah and I'd put a bet on it too. I mean, we took 3 top 15 teams down to the wire (not moral victoring here), so I just feel like we'll beat these other pud teams.

I'd say that those 3 games were close because the top 15 opponent was overlooking a pud ksu team.

So so so dumb

Also for the love of God can someone go and recruit the 8 dudes on twitter droning on about moral victories so dax can have someone to argue about.

[Skipper44]

Fanning thinks this team wins 3 more games

Yeah and I'd put a bet on it too. I mean, we took 3 top 15 teams down to the wire (not moral victoring here), so I just feel like we'll beat these other pud teams.

I'd say that those 3 games were close because the top 15 opponent was overlooking a pud ksu team.

So so so dumb

Also for the love of God can someone go and recruit the 8 dudes on twitter droning on about moral victories so dax can have someone to argue about.

Is there a @fakesonofdaxjones?

[MakeItRain]

Fanning thinks this team wins 3 more games

Yeah and I'd put a bet on it too. I mean, we took 3 top 15 teams down to the wire (not moral victoring here), so I just feel like we'll beat these other pud teams.

I'd say that those 3 games were close because the top 15 opponent was overlooking a pud ksu team.

So so so dumb

Also for the love of God can someone go and recruit the 8 dudes on twitter droning on about moral victories so dax can have someone to argue about.

Is there a @fakesonofdaxjones?

The formula would be some combination of the words/phrases
Tuck
DITR
German Pill Box
Weiser
Sad, really
KthUg

[sonofdaxjones]

I love pissing off MIR.   

[j rake]

it's just reality. k-state hoops is headed for disaster, and football isn't far behind.

at least hoops has potential for upside post weber.

do you have any additional reasons for the above other than the simple math that it is easier to recruit 2 or 3 good to great players in hoops than recruiting the 3 to 4 needed on each side of ball in football?

if briles, patterson and gundy stay where they are, k-state football is rolling a gigantic boulder up a hill in football. what snyder did in pt ii, particularly in the B2B klein years, was as amazing as anything i've witnessed not just in college football, but any sport at any level ever. good luck trying to string together consistent great years in the B12 while facing those five schools year after year in the post snyder era.

i know some get excited about 8-4 or 9-3 and trips to the Wild Wings or Alamo Bowls, but...blah, not all that exciting. k-state can certainly achieve plenty of 7-5 years going forward with occasional 8-4's and 9-3's when everything goes perfect. but post snyder, i'll make k-state a big underdog to post another 10-win season by 2025.

k-state hoops is likely to be in the bottom half of the league for the foreseeable future, but will build toward occasional good years and make the 68-team field every now and then. that's at least semi exciting.

sounds like you feel 11-7/10-8 in hoops is more enjoyable than 6-3/5-4 in football.  That is actually a very pretty good question from a personal perspective even if financially football wins by a landslide. 

I do agree the Big 12 is full of football first ADs and moving up the food chain is much easier when only the KU, ISU and KSU fanbases really give 2 shits about basketball.

if the big 12 had split divisions or non-round robin league scheduling, k-state would be just fine. they'd be a 7-5 or 8-4 program and could get their occasional 10-win season when the schedule sets up perfectly and they catch a few good breaks.

iowa is 8-0 this year but would be 3-5 against k-state's schedule. iowa is likely to finish unbeaten and in the top 5 despite not even being a top-15 level team. they somehow avoided michigan, michigan st and ohio state and will (likely) run the table against a super easy schedule.

in the current big 12 format, k-state will never play an easy schedule.

i hate the 10 teams and round robin scheduling. the league is making it needlessly difficult for its top teams to make it to the finish line unscathed.

[catastrophe]

Just to add to the point about round robin scheduling, look at how much the Pac 12 stock has risen since they input north and south divisions. Even if a round robin lends to more exciting football games week to week, it definitely does negatively affect perception of the conference.

[MakeItRain]

I love pissing off MIR.   

I'm not sure why you think it pisses me off, it certainly doesn't.

[j rake]

Just to add to the point about round robin scheduling, look at how much the Pac 12 stock has risen since they input north and south divisions. Even if a round robin lends to more exciting football games week to week, it definitely does negatively affect perception of the conference.

snyder 1.0 was able to schedule four crap non-con teams and beat the tar out of ku, isu, mizzou and get to seven wins every year. then it's just a matter of catching the good or better teams at home, or drawing the crap teams from the south (baylor was awful, okla st and texas tech were alternatively mediocre, and A&M was nothing special either).

the 2011 k-state team that went 10-3 was listed as an underdog NINE times. the year before, they were dogs six times. this year k-state has been an underdog in every league game and will have a few more coin flip games coming in.

in the early 2000s, k-state teams that were the same (or possibly worse) than the klein years were listed as favorites every game, in all but one game, or in all but two games. and they weren't just favorites, but overwhelming favorites. it was so so so much easier.

k-state has been listed as underdogs in 34 of 57 league games since snyder's return and is 34-23 in big 12 play despite being the lesser team more often than not. k-state has been a double digit underdog in 21 percent of all league games since '09, including the Baylor game yesterday.

the mini run pulled off by snyder 2.0 will never be duplicated as long as the big 12 continues on in its current format.

[MakeItRain]

3 non cons in Snyder 1.0. The two times we played 12 regular season games you had to play a non pud to get the fourth non con.

[KST8FAN]

3 non cons in Snyder 1.0. The two times we played 12 regular season games you had to play a non pud to get the fourth non con.

Snyder 1.0 played in Big 8 (7 league games) from 89-95 so we had 4 non cons before Big 12.

Tom

[Functianalyst]

osu went 6-6 last year, and needed somewhat of a miracle in norman to not finish the season with 6 straight losses.

To add to that OU went 8-5 as well last year.  TCU was 4-8 in 213 and 7-6 in 2012 while BU was 8-5 in 2012.  Understandable that it's hard to deal with while the season is going on, but enough with the chicken little woe is me crap.

[wetwillie]

Yep we are poised for a breakout season next year....rough ridin' idiots.

[sonofdaxjones]

Okay now that closeted Tuck Nation has chimed in and re-directed the narrative.

Let's get back to the fact that K-State plays with no swag, no one on this team or roster (that includes hurt, legless, concussed, shoulder herniated etc. etc.) intimidates a soul either physically or mentally.   When I look up and down the list of recruits and commits I see a list of youngsters that 5 Heart Loving Tuck Nation is going to be proud of, but no opponent will fear on any level.

[wetwillie]

The lone exception to your narrative is Elijah Lee

[lopakman]

Okay now that closeted Tuck Nation has chimed in and re-directed the narrative.

Let's get back to the fact that K-State plays with no swag, no one on this team or roster (that includes hurt, legless, concussed, shoulder herniated etc. etc.) intimidates a soul either physically or mentally.   When I look up and down the list of recruits and commits I see a list of youngsters that 5 Heart Loving Tuck Nation is going to be proud of, but no opponent will fear on any level.

when dax is on point he's really on point

[MakeItRain]

The lone exception to your narrative is Elijah Lee

Not even close to the lone exception. I know it doesn't fit the narrative but there is some talent on this team, some of it is even from small towns in Kansas.

[kso_FAN]

The lone exception to your narrative is Elijah Lee

Not even close to the lone exception. I know it doesn't fit the narrative but there is some talent on this team, some of it is even from small towns in Kansas.

Yeah, this narrative that teams that don't have a bunch of undisciplined cocky pricks can't be good is dumb. We have plenty of guys with confidence, especially on defense. No doubt we need to recruit better and we need more speed/playmaking ability on offense. But we don't necessarily need our guys to play like Baylor and take cheap shots and hit people after the whistle. You can be confident and have some discipline and I have no doubt that Briles allowing his guys to consistently go over the edge will cost them at some point this season.

[catastrophe]

Okay now that closeted Tuck Nation has chimed in and re-directed the narrative.

Let's get back to the fact that K-State plays with no swag, no one on this team or roster (that includes hurt, legless, concussed, shoulder herniated etc. etc.) intimidates a soul either physically or mentally.   When I look up and down the list of recruits and commits I see a list of youngsters that 5 Heart Loving Tuck Nation is going to be proud of, but no opponent will fear on any level.

Looks like someone has never heard of the Origami Rose.

I also think McDaniel played with a bit of swag and I'm sad he's out.  Shelley and Lee look like they could develop nicely as well.  If Delton turns into a stud as anticipated, I actually like where this team can go in the next 1-3 years.

[catastrophe]

The lone exception to your narrative is Elijah Lee

Not even close to the lone exception. I know it doesn't fit the narrative but there is some talent on this team, some of it is even from small towns in Kansas.

Yeah, this narrative that teams that don't have a bunch of undisciplined cocky pricks can't be good is dumb. We have plenty of guys with confidence, especially on defense. No doubt we need to recruit better and we need more speed/playmaking ability on offense. But we don't necessarily need our guys to play like Baylor and take cheap shots and hit people after the whistle. You can be confident and have some discipline and I have no doubt that Briles allowing his guys to consistently go over the edge will cost them at some point this season.

So much this.  Does no one remember why Baylor didn't go undefeated last year?  They racked up like 200+ yards worth of penalties against WVU.  If Baylor gets a zero tolerance officiating crew they have trouble adjusting.  Have not looked at the stats, but this probably has quite a bit to do with their dismal bowl record as well.

[sonofdaxjones]

That's fantastic and all, but Baylor is in-line to win a 2nd straight conference championship, while K-State is trying to avoid Toilet Bowl II.

[MakeItRain]

3rd

[catastrophe]

That's fantastic and all, but Baylor is in-line to win a 2nd straight conference championship, while K-State is trying to avoid Toilet Bowl II.

This has more to do with having a superior team and game plan than doing a lot of head-bobbing on the field.  JMHO.

[kso_FAN]

That's fantastic and all, but Baylor is in-line to win a 2nd straight conference championship, while K-State is trying to avoid Toilet Bowl II.

No doubt he's done a great job. And when we had more talent in the program in the late 90s/early 00s we had more swagger and confidence and it was good, but we did not do the crap Baylor does on a consistent basis. Briles is recruiting very well and it shows in what he's built in his program, but I don't like the demeanor of his teams and I don't think you have to allow that kind of stuff to be elite.