State of the State - case closed, money is bad for schools

[Rage Against the McKee]

Something drastic needs to be done with public schools, because they are failing and more and more money has done nothing to help. Sam has his approach. The establishment will obviously fight to the death to protect their entitlement (status quo). How anyone is surprised by this, I don't know.

Dear God, do people have any idea what even goes on in schools before spouting the "failing" comments?  Please give me specific examples of how exactly our Kansas schools are failing.  The expectations on these kids are sky high...MUCH HIGHER than when I was in school.  The stakes are sky high as well.  I just get so sick of people who have no education or child development background proclaiming the schools, teachers, and students to be failures. 

Have you read studies about how skewed the data is when comparing our ed data to that of other countries?  Poverty is the number one factor in determining at-risk students. For a little light reading on the subject, check this out.

http://www.epi.org/publication/us-student-performance-testing/

I'm far from an expert on education, but common sense would indicate that you are correct in that poverty (or more likely terrible parenting, but they go hand in hand) is the most significant factor in a child's education. However, the same common sense also dictates that simply shoveling more money into schools won't fix that problem.

I think our schools could probably get by with a quite a bit less money - they should focus more on the fundamentals, consolidate, and shed a lot of redundant administrative positions. Schools are susceptible to the same bloat as any other government-funded bureaucracy.

Aren't the administrators whose positions you advocate cutting the same people who will be tasked with setting new budgets with less money? I wouldn't expect them to cut themselves.

[Stellarcat]

I think our schools could probably get by with a quite a bit less money - they should focus more on the fundamentals, consolidate, and shed a lot of redundant administrative positions. Schools are susceptible to the same bloat as any other government-funded bureaucracy.

Focus MORE on fundamentals?!  Nearly the entire school day is spent on reading, writing, and math instruction. 

[michigancat]

If parenting is the most important factor, how do rich kids at elite boarding schools always do so well away from their parents?

They don't have to go home to shitty parents.

They also don't get to go home to good ones.

[CNS]

If parenting is the most important factor, how do rich kids at elite boarding schools always do so well away from their parents?

They don't have to go home to shitty parents.

They also don't get to go home to good ones.

Expectations.

[michigancat]

If parenting is the most important factor, how do rich kids at elite boarding schools always do so well away from their parents?

They don't have to go home to shitty parents.

They also don't get to go home to good ones.

Expectations.

oh, that's it?

[CNS]

Yeah.  That and the enrichment, time spent reading, etc Stellar mentioned, when the kids are younger.  You know, parents parenting and stuff. 

[michigancat]

Is a parent who can't afford pre school a "shitty parent"?

[CNS]

Not necessarily.  They are if they smoke two packs a day, have a crap load of cable channels and hit the casino a couple times a month, though.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Is a parent who can't afford pre school a "shitty parent"?

In most cases, probably so. If you don't earn enough money to send a kid to preschool, you could just work a little bit harder to either get a better job or a second job.

[michigancat]

Is a parent who can't afford pre school a "shitty parent"?

In most cases, probably so. If you don't earn enough money to send a kid to preschool, you could just work a little bit harder to either get a better job or a second job.

How will you have time to read to your kids if you're working two jobs?

[Stellarcat]

Is a parent who can't afford pre school a "shitty parent"?

In most cases, probably so. If you don't earn enough money to send a kid to preschool, you could just work a little bit harder to either get a better job or a second job.

Ah, so spend even less time with your child?  Preschool is expensive.

[CNS]

Preschool is one area the state should spend more money.  All kids should get it.  Significant difference in those who get it and those who dont.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

I think our schools could probably get by with a quite a bit less money - they should focus more on the fundamentals, consolidate, and shed a lot of redundant administrative positions. Schools are susceptible to the same bloat as any other government-funded bureaucracy.

Focus MORE on fundamentals?!  Nearly the entire school day is spent on reading, writing, and math instruction.

I can't speak for higher grades, but I've got a child in 1st grade public school and they seem to spend a disappointingly small amount of time on fundamentals. They did waste a good 20 or so hours over the past few weeks rehearsing for a really awful music performance that most of the kids appeared to have cared less about.

[8manpick]

Well holy crap, those rough ridin' Asians just zoomed past your kids during that 20 hours. Good luck competing in the global economy now.

[Rage Against the McKee]

So they spent an hour rehearsing per day over a 4 week period? That would still leave about 5 hours per day for reading, writing, and math. Maybe these kids need to start going to school from 8-5 to get everything in.

[ChiComCat]

If those 7 year olds aren't putting their hearts in the play, we should cut the arts

[Cire]

If my kid doesn't want to act at seven I'll be damned if her dumbass teachers are going to make her act

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

If my kid doesn't want to act at seven I'll be damned if her dumbass teachers are going to make her act

I'd rather they just learn reading, writing, math, dodgeball, and lunchroom etiquette - the tools they'll need to be successful in life. Maybe an hour each week for art or music.

[Jabeez]

If my kid doesn't want to act at seven I'll be damned if her dumbass teachers are going to make her act

I'd rather they just learn reading, writing, math, dodgeball, and lunchroom etiquette - the tools they'll need to be successful in life. Maybe an hour each week for art or music.

Art and music actually help some people be successful and learn things in life, maybe not you though.

[CNS]

Something drastic needs to be done with public schools, because they are failing and more and more money has done nothing to help. Sam has his approach. The establishment will obviously fight to the death to protect their entitlement (status quo). How anyone is surprised by this, I don't know.

Dear God, do people have any idea what even goes on in schools before spouting the "failing" comments?  Please give me specific examples of how exactly our Kansas schools are failing.  The expectations on these kids are sky high...MUCH HIGHER than when I was in school.  The stakes are sky high as well.  I just get so sick of people who have no education or child development background proclaiming the schools, teachers, and students to be failures. 

Have you read studies about how skewed the data is when comparing our ed data to that of other countries?  Poverty is the number one factor in determining at-risk students. For a little light reading on the subject, check this out.

http://www.epi.org/publication/us-student-performance-testing/

I'm far from an expert on education, but common sense would indicate that you are correct in that poverty (or more likely terrible parenting, but they go hand in hand) is the most significant factor in a child's education. However, the same common sense also dictates that simply shoveling more money into schools won't fix that problem.

I think our schools could probably get by with a quite a bit less money - they should focus more on the fundamentals, consolidate, and shed a lot of redundant administrative positions. Schools are susceptible to the same bloat as any other government-funded bureaucracy.

From my wife's super today:

As you may have already heard, on Thursday Kansas Governor Sam Brownback announced that he will be moving ahead with funding reductions for public schools and higher education.  The automatic cuts do not require legislative approval and are scheduled to go into effect on March 7th.


By instituting this reduction measure, this partially helps to plug a hole in the state's looming budget deficit.  Specifically, it will save the State of Kansas $44.5 million in the current fiscal year.  The cuts were announced after the state missed its January revenue expectations by $47 million.

What is super great about Sam is that not only does he agree with K_S_U W, but he also thinks it prudent to make such cuts smack int he middle of the school year rather than implementing the necessary planning and policy to plan ahead accordingly. 

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Is a parent who can't afford pre school a "shitty parent"?

Well it's free for poors, and people that aren't poor can obviously afford it, so I don't think cost is at issue.

[Stellarcat]

Well it's free for poors, and people that aren't poor can obviously afford it, so I don't think cost is at issue.

A family of 4 can't make more than $24,000 to qualify for Head Start. 

[Stellarcat]

I can't speak for higher grades, but I've got a child in 1st grade public school and they seem to spend a disappointingly small amount of time on fundamentals. They did waste a good 20 or so hours over the past few weeks rehearsing for a really awful music performance that most of the kids appeared to have cared less about.

Besides the evidence that math skills are improved by music exposure, I'm going to assume that your kid doesn't spend this much time on music practice during the entire school year.  Special circumstances do come up in life.

My son is in 1st grade as well.  His day:
8:30-9:10 Phonics and Calendar (math based)
9:10-9:30 Recess
9:30-10:30 Reading groups
10:30-11:00 Whole group reading
11:00-11:25 Lunch
11:25-12:00 Writing
12:00-12:20 Recess
12:20-1:30 Math
1:30-2:30 Specials (PE, Music, Library, Computer/Guidance)
2:30-3:20 Social Studies/Science

tl;dr  A ton of fundamentals

[Dugout DickStone]

Pretty mad about this anti-Johnson county movement that is afoot...

http://www.kansascity.com/news/government-politics/article9752516.html

[nicname]

http://cjonline.com/news/2015-02-13/usd-501-announces-cuts-summer-school-field-trips-response-funding-loss

USD 501 announces cuts to summer school, field trips in response to funding loss

More cuts. Are they from the right places? Interesting after reading Dickstone's JoCo article.