First Openly Gay Athlete (in a major sport)

[EMAWmeister]

What the Bible says about homosexuality is clear, but what is equally clear is what is said about marriage and adultery and that is where this discussion should take place.

I asked if you and/or fun muffin would view a homosexual virgin as a sinner.

I'm a Catholic, but disagree with the Church on the issue of homosexuality. But from what I gathered in 12 years of private catholic schools, homosexual thoughts or tendencies are not sinful, but it's when they are acted upon.

Again, that isn't what I believe, just answering your question.

[fun muffin]

So you are quoting Leviticus.  Did you know that not all of Leviticus was written to everyone?  There were sins that applied only to the Jews such as eating shellfish, rabbit, and pork, etc., which were things that represented purity before the Lord.  We know this because God says, "Speak to the sons of Israel saying..."  He gives instructions to the Israelites, not to the rest of the nations.

Meanwhile, homosexuality is an abomination that is seen elsewhere in scripture not referring to Jews only.  But to all people, all nations. 

When you quote the Bible is has to be in it's proper context.  You took the seafood stuff and mixed fabrics out of context.  It was written specifically for Jews.

Actually it was Deuteronomy for the fabric and more importantly....new versus old testament, how does it work?/ICP magnets

Just because it's also in Deuteronomy doesn't mean it isn't in Leviticus. 

Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law.  Take the ten commandments for example.  They are meant to show that man is sinful.  No human being can go their entire life without breaking one of the commandments. 

Since we cannot keep the law ourselves, we need Jesus to do it for us. 

[MakeItRain]

What the Bible says about homosexuality is clear, but what is equally clear is what is said about marriage and adultery and that is where this discussion should take place.

I asked if you and/or fun muffin would view a homosexual virgin as a sinner.

I think you are asking the wrong question.

So no answer to this or whether Acts 17:26 and/or Rom. 9:19-24 should be used as a defense against interracial marriage. Got it. You two would look less foolish if you just said "I don't like homosexuality and I don't have to." Using scripture as a crutch opens you up to hypocrisy. I don't care what either of you or anyone else thinks of homosexuality, I do care that people like you use Christianity as a cruch for your personal choice.

[hemmy]

So you are quoting Leviticus.  Did you know that not all of Leviticus was written to everyone?  There were sins that applied only to the Jews such as eating shellfish, rabbit, and pork, etc., which were things that represented purity before the Lord.  We know this because God says, "Speak to the sons of Israel saying..."  He gives instructions to the Israelites, not to the rest of the nations.

Meanwhile, homosexuality is an abomination that is seen elsewhere in scripture not referring to Jews only.  But to all people, all nations. 

When you quote the Bible is has to be in it's proper context.  You took the seafood stuff and mixed fabrics out of context.  It was written specifically for Jews.

Actually it was Deuteronomy for the fabric and more importantly....new versus old testament, how does it work?/ICP magnets

Just because it's also in Deuteronomy doesn't mean it isn't in Leviticus. 

Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law.  Take the ten commandments for example.  They are meant to show that man is sinful.  No human being can go their entire life without breaking one of the commandments. 

Since we cannot keep the law ourselves, we need Jesus to do it for us. 

Depends how long you live.

[PoetWarrior]

What the Bible says about homosexuality is clear, but what is equally clear is what is said about marriage and adultery and that is where this discussion should take place.

I asked if you and/or fun muffin would view a homosexual virgin as a sinner.

I think you are asking the wrong question.

We are all sinners, by nature and choice, first of all. Second, someone who has not acted on their homosexual desires has done well, but they may have additional, equal, issues with lusting after the same sex, which Jesus says is equal to adultery. That is why homosexuality is equal to all other temptations. In your world view some temptations (pedophilia) may seem more perverted than others, but in God's view all lust and all adultery are sins outside of his intent for sex to be used in marriage between one man and one woman.

[fun muffin]

well it's the truth.  that's why we need Jesus and the grace he offers.

please stop posting.  that was a direct question to establish his superior qualifications.  he tapped the mat.

he tapped the mat by showing why we all need Jesus.  That is not a tap out. 

Please tell me your understanding of the basic Gospel message.  It will help me greatly to see where you are at.

[PoetWarrior]

whether Acts 17:26 and/or Rom. 9:19-24 should be used as a defense against interracial marriage.

I honestly don't have the slightest clue about what you're talking about here.

That is not something I believe and I don't see how those passages could be taken that way, nor have I ever heard them taken that way by anyone I believe to be right or wrong.

[PoetWarrior]

please stop posting.  that was a direct question to establish his superior qualifications.  he tapped the mat.

I've opened the Bible and used my eyes to read it. What more are you looking for? That is the answer to your question.

which bible?

I already answered this. I think we can all agree less repetition here, is more. OH!

[fun muffin]

What the Bible says about homosexuality is clear, but what is equally clear is what is said about marriage and adultery and that is where this discussion should take place.

I asked if you and/or fun muffin would view a homosexual virgin as a sinner.

I think you are asking the wrong question.

So no answer to this or whether Acts 17:26 and/or Rom. 9:19-24 should be used as a defense against interracial marriage. Got it. You two would look less foolish if you just said "I don't like homosexuality and I don't have to." Using scripture as a crutch opens you up to hypocrisy. I don't care what either of you or anyone else thinks of homosexuality, I do care that people like you use Christianity as a cruch for your personal choice.

I honestly have no idea what those verses would have to do with interracial marriage.  In fact after looking at them for 30 seconds I'm quite sure the verses have nothing to do with interracial marriage. 

[ednksu]

whether Acts 17:26 and/or Rom. 9:19-24 should be used as a defense against interracial marriage.

I honestly don't have the slightest clue about what you're talking about here.

That is not something I believe and I don't see how those passages could be taken that way, nor have I ever heard them taken that way by anyone I believe to be right or wrong.

LOL 

well it's the truth.  that's why we need Jesus and the grace he offers.

please stop posting.  that was a direct question to establish his superior qualifications.  he tapped the mat.

he tapped the mat by showing why we all need Jesus.  That is not a tap out. 

Please tell me your understanding of the basic Gospel message.  It will help me greatly to see where you are at.

when someone says tell me why you think you're an authority and you clam up, you look like a fool. that was the question. 




And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

[fun muffin]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

[ednksu]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

OMG.....just done.....

[Dugout DickStone]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

Control of people

[Asteriskhead]

Your "god" is supposed to be both benevolent and omnipotent, is he not?

[ednksu]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

Control of people

[fun muffin]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

OMG.....just done.....

I'm sorry I don't see the Gospel message in what you posted.  Not even a little bit.

The basic Gospel message is that man is sinful.  Therefore separated from God, who hates sin.  God still loves people so much that He sent His Son to die on the cross for us.  Then Jesus rose from the dead, defeating death and sin.  Jesus is a gift, should we choose to accept Him.  All we have to do to accept the gift of Jesus is turn from our sin (repent) and trust in Jesus.  Living our lives after His example.  That is the Gospel. 

[The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep]

rough ridin' hate it when the birther pit escapes its hole

[ednksu]

And as far as my opinions on the good book, I see many issues with inaccurate translations and distorted interpretations.  I believe the Christ figure would want good people to work in the margins of society, as he did, and save judgement for a higher power.  I believe that higher power looks to the acts of people and how they treated their fellow humans. 
I see many perverted interpretations of the bible by people who wish to oppress others through the faith.  MiR is directly on point.  If you don't know the long history of religiously based segregation than you have NO place in this or any conversation regarding the morality of the bible and how it has been perverted to codify intolerance. The stories of Jesus blessing the prostitutes, meek, and disabled, the story of the good Samaritan (especially if you understand the historical context of Samaritans in the ancient world) are what we should let guide us.

At no point did you address the Gospel message.  Do you know what the MAIN THEME of the Bible is about?

OMG.....just done.....

I'm sorry I don't see the Gospel message in what you posted.  Not even a little bit.

The basic Gospel message is that man is sinful.  Therefore separated from God, who hates sin.  God still loves people so much that He sent His Son to die on the cross for us.  Then Jesus rose from the dead, defeating death and sin.  Jesus is a gift, should we choose to accept Him.  All we have to do to accept the gift of Jesus is turn from our sin (repent) and trust in Jesus.  Living our lives after His example.  That is the Gospel.

No you bigot, that is what you want the bible and gospel to believe. 

I believe in the works of Christ the liberal who wore sandals and hung out with whores. 

Get out of here with your interpretations of Sola Fide, Sola Gratia, and Sola Scriptura.

[420seriouscat69]

I'm going to tell my gay uncle and his life partner that Poetwarrior thinks they're going to rot in hell cause of "their life choices."

[Dugout DickStone]

I'm going to tell my gay uncle and his life partner that Poetwarrior thinks they're going to rot in hell cause of "their life choices."

Not if they ask for forgiveness 1 second before they die.

[MakeItRain]

I'm going to tell my gay uncle and his life partner that Poetwarrior thinks they're going to rot in hell cause of "their life choices."

Only if they have sex, according to pw and fun muffin being gay is only about who you have sex with and nothing about who you are and who you love.

At the end of the day they are no different than people who take bible verses out of context to fit an agenda such as the evils of race mixing.

[420seriouscat69]

I'm going to tell my gay uncle and his life partner that Poetwarrior thinks they're going to rot in hell cause of "their life choices."

Not if they ask for forgiveness 1 second before they die.

Thanks. Good to know.

[EMAWmeister]

PW, you aren't wrong for believing that men and women are called to be chaste.  That's a perfectly reasonable belief. But knock it off with the my god/your god bullshit.

I agree with j-dub in regards to religious/spiritual people not automatically being hateful/bigots.  While their views towards homosexuality is ignorant IMO, their actions are more important.  I don't think that simply disagreeing with homosexuality is necessarily hateful, provided you treat homosexuals with the love and respect you treat other humans with.  Saying that you are 'against' either homosexuality or spirituality seems to be an aggressive viewpoint that gets in the way of meaningful debate.

Being progressive does not mean bullying others into believing what you believe to be an "enlightened" opinion.  Being open and progressive is about accepting the differences in others without treating them as a sub-class of humans. I think both sides should be able to see that. 

Now eff, lets just all get pak'd and hug it out.

[scottwildcat]

PW, you aren't wrong for believing that men and women are called to be chaste.  That's a perfectly reasonable belief. But knock it off with the my god/your god bullshit.

I agree with j-dub in regards to religious/spiritual people not automatically being hateful/bigots.  While their views towards homosexuality is ignorant IMO, their actions are more important.  I don't think that simply disagreeing with homosexuality is necessarily hateful, provided you treat homosexuals with the love and respect you treat other humans with.  Saying that you are 'against' either homosexuality or spirituality seems to be an aggressive viewpoint that gets in the way of meaningful debate.

Being progressive does not mean bullying others into believing what you believe to be an "enlightened" opinion.  Being open and progressive is about accepting the differences in others without treating them as a sub-class of humans. I think both sides should be able to see that. 

Now eff, lets just all get pak'd and hug it out.

If everyone had your mindset the world would be a better place.

[mocat]

I'm going to tell my gay uncle and his life partner that Poetwarrior thinks they're going to rot in hell cause of "their life choices."

Only if they have sex, according to pw and fun muffin being gay is only about who you have sex with and nothing about who you are and who you love.

At the end of the day they are no different than people who take bible verses out of context to fit an agenda such as the evils of race mixing.

I don't think pw said anything about condemning people or rotting in hell, could be wrong