Lets get everyone on the record.

[MakeItRain]

and finds a job in FL after that. FIU, FAU, USF, UCF, UM etc..

there is a great disparity in those jobs

I am with trim. Basically, Frank is a good coach and oscar is not. Whatever those numbers are.

[Stevesie60]

oscar will make the round of 32 this year, NIT next year, and whiff his third.
Frank will take another job as soon as he gets South Carolina into the tournament, probably in his third year.

[gatoveintisiete]

So what I am getting here is two pretty average coaches, neither expected to achieve any level of greatness, one that is entertaining in the press room and one that isn't, one that left the program and one that wants to coach it.  I think I am ready to move on now and just pull for the cats.

[Stevesie60]

Look at the situation that each one of them is in. Think of what the expectations would have been for Frank had he been here this year with this roster. They are not comparable coaches.

[felix rex]

Kstate is not South Carolina. This seems to be escaping some folks.

[catzacker]

I am with trim. Basically, Frank is a good coach and oscar is not. Whatever those numbers are.

I tend to agree with this, except I wonder if SC was too much for frank (I understand that is an arrogant thing to say as a KSU fan, but, like Beasley - and the residual effects/recruits of Beasley - aren't walking through that door). 

I think oscar will ultimately fail at KSU, but it will be a slow death.  Like when a salesman gets close to his quota every quarter.

My hope is that after Weber fails, that we are in good enough shape to hire Pearl (hopefully Pearl can get a shot at a smaller school or something), but I doubt it.  I wouldn't want Dougie after Weber.

[Mr Bread]

Look at the situation that each one of them is in. Think of what the expectations would have been for Frank had he been here this year with this roster. They are not comparable coaches.

You can apply this to their contemporaneous tenures at Illinois and KSU the previous five seasons.  Frank substantially outperformed oscar.  Frank succeeded, oscar failed.  Frank left for another job, oscar got fired.  If they had swapped schools, Frank would have succeeded at Illinois (at least as much as he did at KSU) and oscar would have failed at KSU (at least as much as he did at Illinois).  They are not comparable coaches.

[MakeItRain]

So what I am getting here is two pretty average coaches, neither expected to achieve any level of greatness, one that is entertaining in the press room and one that isn't, one that left the program and one that wants to coach it.  I think I am ready to move on now and just pull for the cats.

You either have trouble reading or unclear about how bad USC is right now.  I think it is pretty close to a consensus that Frank is a better coach than Weber and is better than average.  When people say Frank's average finish in the SEC is 6 you need to remember that there are 14 teams in the SEC and UK, Mizzou, and Florida will always be better than USC.

[CHONGS]

I think Weber will be here at least 8 years.   NCAA 3, NIT 5 and "retires".

As for Frank, I I think he will do quite well for South Car standards and leave for a better job (better defined by one he wants).

[ChiComCat]

Length of Tenure at current schools
oscar - 5 (I'm an optimist)
Frank - 4

Reason for end of tenure
oscar - Fired
Frank - Better job

High conference finish
Frank - 5
oscar - 5

Average conference finish
oscar - 6.5
Frank - 7

Will they coach at another Big conference school
Frank - yes
oscar - no

[gatoveintisiete]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

[gatoveintisiete]

Should call it the Jake Martin Era

[catzacker]

I think Weber will be here at least 8 years.   NCAA 3, NIT 5 and "retires".
As for Frank, I I think he will do quite well for South Car standards and leave for a better job (better defined by one he wants).

i just rough ridin' throw up thinking about how true that statement might be.

[Stevesie60]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

Don't be Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!). '08 was the only year that you can attribute Frank's success to the talent on the floor. Show me the ranks of his recruiting classes after that. He knows how to coach non-talented players. Get lots of rebounds, especially on the offensive end, and hustle your ass off on the defensive end. oscar apparently doesn't know how to coach that. I saw one player hustle the entire game yesterday, maybe two. And guess how much oscar seemed to care. I literally have no idea how you think Frank is worse. Look at their past 4 years. It's not even close.

[Trim]

BOOK IT!!

[Stevesie60]

BOOK IT!!

[wetwillie]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

Don't be Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!). '08 was the only year that you can attribute Frank's success to the talent on the floor. Show me the ranks of his recruiting classes after that. He knows how to coach non-talented players. Get lots of rebounds, especially on the offensive end, and hustle your ass off on the defensive end. oscar apparently doesn't know how to coach that. I saw one player hustle the entire game yesterday, maybe two. And guess how much oscar seemed to care. I literally have no idea how you think Frank is worse. Look at their past 4 years. It's not even close.

What a second, did you just go all Dax and call this team untalented?

[kitten_mittons]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

Don't do this to yourself.

[Stevesie60]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

Don't be Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!). '08 was the only year that you can attribute Frank's success to the talent on the floor. Show me the ranks of his recruiting classes after that. He knows how to coach non-talented players. Get lots of rebounds, especially on the offensive end, and hustle your ass off on the defensive end. oscar apparently doesn't know how to coach that. I saw one player hustle the entire game yesterday, maybe two. And guess how much oscar seemed to care. I literally have no idea how you think Frank is worse. Look at their past 4 years. It's not even close.

What a second, did you just go all Dax and call this team untalented?

They're talented because Frank coached them up. The last 3 year's of their tenure, Illinois had 3 top 25 classes. K-State had 1, and without Wally Judge it would not have been.

[Cire]

oscar won't make it past year 4.  Unless Currie gtfooh, then maybe 3.  won't make an ncaa in the next 3 years, probably ever.

tucks will turn when half of bram is red and blue and seff beats us 78-40.

[felix rex]

I'm glad we got a coach that can win without someone else's players.

[kso_FAN]

Next 3-5 years both will probably have similar results. oscar is good enough to be decent after inheriting a solid program as long as he avoids a collapse like he had last year. Frank is good enough to build SC into a solid program like he did at K-State. Next 5 years both probably have a couple NCAAs and couple NITs while going a bit above .500 in league play.

[SdK]

I think both coaches have similar results at the their respective schools. Frank will forever bounce around. He'll never have a "home." oscar will be with us until KSU decides they don't want to have him anymore. I think oscar would stick around after great years and after bad years, is my point.

[MakeItRain]

Ok here is what I will say, Frank has already had his best years as a basketball coach, he will never again have the talent he had early at k-state, you guys have pissed me off and I will revise Franks level of success at usc to suck for 3 years, fired and on to halftime commentator.  Didn't want to have to do this but BOOK IT!!   oscar will remain at average status unless he shocks us with recruiting.  You guys are the recruiting experts, did Frank bring in Pullen, Clemente, Kelly? Imo those were the difference maker players in our run, The only guy that came in after them with a chance to is Angel, love the other guys but they are complementary type players and we have a roster full of them right now and won't do anything big because of it.  As stated before many times Frank knew this.

Don't do this to yourself.

gatowhatever may be Kim Carnes sock so I'm treating him as such, nothing it says should be treated seriously or responded to

[kitten_mittons]

Don't do this to yourself.

gatowhatever may be Kim Carnes sock so I'm treating him as such, nothing it says should be treated seriously or responded to

Good catch, I will keep this in mind.