"Obamacare"

[Rage Against the McKee]

What if a company has a religious objection vaccinations for children*? (*female only)

http://catholicexchange.com/hpv-vaccine-cant-innoculate-against-immorality

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

What if a company has a religious objection vaccinations for children*? (*female only)

http://catholicexchange.com/hpv-vaccine-cant-innoculate-against-immorality

I'd be fine with that. I wouldn't work there.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

One of the biggest fallacies in the arguments against the opinion is that HL is some how imposing their religious beliefs on employees by not paying for something. This is between the Fed and HL, and it's the Fed imparting their "religious" beliefs on HL and HL seeking protection from the court.

[michigancat]

Really, the government should just pay for birth control for anyone that wants it. It's bullshit we're asking Hobby Lobby to pay IMO.

[Stevesie60]

Really, the government should just pay for birth control for anyone that wants it. It's bullshit we're asking Hobby Lobby to pay IMO.

Yes. And it would not take long at all for taxes to go down.

[OK_Cat]

if women just had a penis then this wouldn't be an issue. 

[Institutional Control]

Really, the government should just pay for birth control for anyone that wants it. It's bullshit we're asking Hobby Lobby to pay IMO.

Yes. And it would not take long at all for taxes to go down.

Exactly. Less people on welfare.

[puniraptor]

I think it's bullshit that a corporation can have religious beliefs.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I think it's bullshit that a corporation can have religious beliefs.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Hobby Lobby isn't going to heaven when it dies, regardless of what it believes.

[puniraptor]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

[puniraptor]

the fact that the court could be asked to decide what is and what isn't sincere religious conviction is also hilarious to me

[Stevesie60]

Yeah, I'm kind of surprised how everyone's talking mostly about the birth control thing and not about how thin of a line is being walked by making this ruling.

[puniraptor]

Yeah, I'm kind of surprised how everyone's talking mostly about the birth control thing and not about how thin of a line is being walked by making this ruling.

looks to me like maybe its this slippery slope thing that everyone is so worried about

what would have happened if hobby lobby was a muslim corporation and used islam to refuse to cover birth control? who (here or anywhere) would be fighting for them then?

[nicname]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

Midification: The Fed Gov shouldn't be able to force them to hire women. The bold goes for about everything I say in here.

[Asteriskhead]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

[nicname]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

Ok, well I'll just go on record as disagreeing with that. But business owners are going to have a very hard time convincing a court that their religious beliefs prevent employment of women (unless, that is, you're the Catholic Church).

[puniraptor]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

i get what you're going for with the lassez faire stuff, but the federal gov has the responsibility of protecting minorities from the oppression of the majority. I think the olden days, where the market was more free than now, shows that the free market doesnt have the power or will to give all people, created equal, their fair shake.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

I think it's bullshit that a corporation can have religious beliefs.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Hobby Lobby isn't going to heaven when it dies, regardless of what it believes.

The owners might. They're the ones who actually pay for the health insurance - not a fictional entity. Yet another phony argument.

[puniraptor]

Ok, well I'll just go on record as disagreeing with that. But business owners are going to have a very hard time convincing a court that their religious beliefs prevent employment of women (unless, that is, you're the Catholic Church).

but what if, ksuDUB? how are the courts to discern which religious convictions are valid and which are not?

[Rage Against the McKee]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

Ok, well I'll just go on record as disagreeing with that. But business owners are going to have a very hard time convincing a court that their religious beliefs prevent employment of women (unless, that is, you're the Catholic Church).

There are non-Christian religions out there that are supposed to have the same protections as every other religion, you know. Hell, I could write a book and start my own religion with any rules I want just like L. Ron Hubbard did.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

Ok, well I'll just go on record as disagreeing with that. But business owners are going to have a very hard time convincing a court that their religious beliefs prevent employment of women (unless, that is, you're the Catholic Church).

but what if, ksuDUB? how are the courts to discern which religious convictions are valid and which are not?

Just like they decide any other issues - they weigh the evidence. Believe it or not, we actually pay judges to think. That's their job. This is no more difficult an issue to ascertain than countless others.

[nicname]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

i get what you're going for with the lassez faire stuff, but the federal gov has the responsibility of protecting minorities from the oppression of the majority. I think the olden days, where the market was more free than now, shows that the free market doesnt have the power or will to give all people, created equal, their fair shake.

Like protecting the minority of idiots who would choose not to hire women to work at AJ's basket company for whatever reason, when most of society feels that they should be forced to disregard gender when hiring? I agree they should be protected to make their idiotic decisions, at least by the Feds. I'm cool with Kansas or some other state thinking that is a bad idea and making it illegal.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

Ok, well I'll just go on record as disagreeing with that. But business owners are going to have a very hard time convincing a court that their religious beliefs prevent employment of women (unless, that is, you're the Catholic Church).

There are non-Christian religions out there that are supposed to have the same protections as every other religion, you know. Hell, I could write a book and start my own religion with any rules I want just like L. Ron Hubbard did.

Again, as I just said, we pay judges to use their brains. The "slippery slope" in this instance is a stupid, lazy argument. If someone says "well, the religion I invented a few years makes me morally opposed to hiring blacks and women" they're going to get laughed out of court (and that assumes the judge has a sense of humor).

[puniraptor]

like, what if a corporation had a strong religious conviction against women working. would anyone be against the eeo laws that force them to hire women? (prolly)

They shouldn't have to hire women.

You're going to need to explain yourself.

They are a privately owned business. They shouldn't be forced by the federal government to hire anyone, or to do business with anyone.

i get what you're going for with the lassez faire stuff, but the federal gov has the responsibility of protecting minorities from the oppression of the majority. I think the olden days, where the market was more free than now, shows that the free market doesnt have the power or will to give all people, created equal, their fair shake.

Like protecting the minority of idiots who would choose not to hire women to work at AJ's basket company for whatever reason, when most of society feels that they should be forced to disregard gender when hiring? I agree they should be protected to make their idiotic decisions, at least by the Feds. I'm cool with Kansas or some other state thinking that is a bad idea and making it illegal.

back in the day, those idiots were the majority