Author Topic: Killing animals  (Read 144921 times)

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Offline CNS

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #775 on: October 25, 2016, 05:40:55 PM »
Seems to be a backdoor into shooting whatevs whenevs and could possibly harm conservation.  I haven't read it, just watched a news thingy on it.

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Offline Tobias

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #776 on: October 25, 2016, 05:47:38 PM »
increases available elk tags but cedes public land to the clinton foundation

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #777 on: October 26, 2016, 03:06:20 AM »
Kansas is too flippant with Constitutional Amendments. Vote No.

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #778 on: October 26, 2016, 07:41:01 AM »
Do you have a link Mrs Gooch?

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #779 on: October 26, 2016, 07:44:57 AM »

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #780 on: October 26, 2016, 07:45:25 AM »
lol Tapatalk compression

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #781 on: October 26, 2016, 07:52:25 AM »
These amendments are not uncommon, currently the right to hunt/fish is guaranteed by ~17 states.

Here's my take:  this is a defensive amendment aimed at putting something in place that would be hard to get rid of much further down the road.  It doesn't really do anything now.  I'm voting yes.  The extreme opposite of a place like Kansas would be a place like California, where anti-hunters have successfully chipped away at the edges of hunting.  For example, they've outlawed mountain lion hunting, and now deer populations are at all-time lows, and the state spends many millions of dollars hiring professionals to take out problem lions.  Same with some forms of bear hunting there. 

The wildlife belongs to the public, the state is charged with managing the wildlife according to sound and proven conservation science.  Without hunting, you'll end up with lots of very controversial deer shoots like what has happened at Shawnee Mission Park.  No one wants that.  Vote yes Mrs Gooch.

Offline HerrSonntag

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #782 on: October 26, 2016, 07:59:12 AM »
actual text:

Quote
§21. Right of public to hunt, fish and trap wildlife. The people have the right to hunt, fish and trap, including by the use of traditional methods, subject to reasonable laws and regulations that promote wildlife conservation and management and that preserve the future of hunting and fishing. Public hunting and fishing shall be a preferred means of managing and controlling wildlife. This section shall not be construed to modify any provision of law relating to trespass, property rights or water resources

Doesn't seem subversive or open to abuse.

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #783 on: October 26, 2016, 08:03:38 AM »
My like my father before me and his father before him and so forth from time immemorial, my traditional hunting method is a pellet of polonium 210 injected by a hidden syringe at the tip of a normal in appearance only umbrella.

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #784 on: October 26, 2016, 08:07:23 AM »
My concern is whether this amendment can later be used to strike down gun regulations. (BTW, I'm all for gun ownership but there are some reasonable restrictions.) Like is someone later going to come in an say, "One of the 'traditional methods' I use to hunt is my fully automatic M-60, so therefore you can't ever put any restrictions on that gun."


Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #785 on: October 26, 2016, 08:15:47 AM »
Hunting with a fully automatic is not legal nor has it ever been.  And even semi auto's are limited to 5 rounds, which is much more restrictive than the (for example) non-hunting Colorado magazine capacity restriction.

FWIW I would be more comfortable with sensible gun control laws if this amendment were on the books. 

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #786 on: October 26, 2016, 08:30:35 AM »
It's not legal now, but after the amendment passes is anyone going to try to say the law about automatic weapons is unconstitutional?

(Automatic weapons is an extreme example. There are other gun restrictions that this same reasoning could apply to.)

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #787 on: October 26, 2016, 08:32:09 AM »
Well I don't know how they could, especially considering the regulation on the automatic weapons is a federal regulation.  A state amendment isn't going to change that.

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #788 on: October 26, 2016, 08:36:41 AM »
Well I don't know how they could, especially considering the regulation on the automatic weapons is a federal regulation.  A state amendment isn't going to change that.

OK, well automatic weapons is a bad example then. I don't know enough gun laws to make a good example. Let's say that someone proposed a law that said you must be trained in gun safety to conceal carry (crazy, I know). But then that law would be unconstitutional because "This is the gun a traditionally hunt with and yes I traditionally conceal my weapon when I hunt."

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #789 on: October 26, 2016, 08:40:15 AM »
I really think you're making leaps here. 

You do know that today you can carry, concealed or otherwise, with absolutely no training, right?

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #790 on: October 26, 2016, 08:41:52 AM »
I really think you're making leaps here. 

You do know that today you can carry, concealed or otherwise, with absolutely no training, right?

Yes, I know that is why I said "Let's say someone proposed a law..." It was an imaginary future where people in Kansas had gained some sanity.

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #791 on: October 26, 2016, 08:46:13 AM »
Maybe look at the other 17 states that have passed these amendments and see what unintended consequences have popped up?

It's really a pretty basic amendment in it's language.  People just want to go hunt and provide for their families.  NO NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES as I believe someone once so eloquently said.

Offline Tobias

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #792 on: October 26, 2016, 09:12:05 AM »
SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #793 on: October 26, 2016, 09:21:48 AM »
I really think you're making leaps here. 

You do know that today you can carry, concealed or otherwise, with absolutely no training, right?

Also, people can kill animals in Kansas right now.

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #794 on: October 26, 2016, 09:27:31 AM »
I really think you're making leaps here. 

You do know that today you can carry, concealed or otherwise, with absolutely no training, right?

Also, people can kill animals in Kansas right now.

Is this your pivot?  The amendment would make it a right to hunt/fish, not just legal. 

Offline Tobias

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #795 on: October 26, 2016, 09:30:18 AM »
i think the framers of the kansas constitution knew what they were talking about

Offline Mrs. Gooch

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #796 on: October 26, 2016, 09:38:36 AM »
I'm not sure if God intended hunting/fishing to be a right. I'm sure he didn't intend trapping to be a right because it is pretty cruel.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #797 on: October 26, 2016, 09:39:35 AM »
I'm voting yes on the hunting amendment.

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #798 on: October 26, 2016, 09:44:11 AM »
I'm not sure if God intended hunting/fishing to be a right. I'm sure he didn't intend trapping to be a right because it is pretty cruel.

God intended man to have dominion over the animals.

Trapping is the only way to keep some populations in check.  Even if it were outlawed for citizens it would still get done by contractors of the state, only on taxpayer's dime. 

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: Killing animals
« Reply #799 on: October 26, 2016, 09:45:29 AM »
Hi Mrs Gooch, do you eat meat of any sort?  Have any sort of dietary restrictions, self-imposed or other?