KSUFans Archives
Sports => Snyder's Electronic Cyber Space World => Topic started by: Kat Kid on September 17, 2006, 05:11:17 PM
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1. This needs to be said. This team is well coached. I hate that I am so wrong about this and maybe it will change once we face some better teams, but there is better special teams, a better D (with a seemingly bigger emphasis on big plays) and an entirely different attitude/atmosphere than we have seen in some time. The special teams is exactly what I remember those KSU teams on recent vintage (game changing, always a threat forcing teams to think/gameplan it every game.
2. That said, the coaches have done some things that I disagree with. 1 of them is giving up on the run too early, IMHO. Clayton ran 18 times. 1 TD, 5 runs for a first down, 4.2 a carry. That isn't spectacular, that isn't what we want. But that is enough to warrant more consistent play calling for him. Bringing McCardle in was an absolute abortion and I knew that had bad news written all over it from the get-go. The fact he plays FB in the I, is another sign of just how thin we are in certain spots. That is also disturbing, especially considering where the O-line is.
3. Norwood and the 5 yrd. TE curl is great, but look for teams to adjust to that. If we don't have a better/more imaginative answer vs. the Ville look for a few interceptions.
4. Our safeties are both potential all big 12 1/2nd team. Watts looks pretty good. That interception was terrific.
5. McKinney sucks. Bad.
6. This game's biggest play in terms of momentum was Prince brining in McCardle off the bench and fumbling that ball after a nice run. If we score there game over, and a much better win. Much like the last time Marshall came to town, that play led to Marshall's biggest drive of the game. Keep in mind they were @ our 21 yard line when the D stepped up and got a holding call, then a sack, then Marshall punts (in the maroon zone: "Where manly men GO FOR IT!" *hat tip TMQ*) for a lowly 19 yard net. The next KSU series was the blocked punt. The diference in this game was the way our Defense responded. KSU has a 12 yard drive stall out and then the D responds with the Watt pick. That put us up 10-7 at the half. THAT WAS HUGE, BUT IT SHOULD'VE BEEN A TD. When the D/Special Teams consistently gives the O the short field, the O has to be good enough to take advantage. We have never asked the O to drive 80 yards over and over. Just come out of the Red Zone with more than a field goal more times than not. That is the biggest difference between this team losing 4-5 games and losing 6-7 games from here out.
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^^^^^
What he said.
I'm cautiously optimistic about where we're headed after the first three games.
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"The fact he plays FB in the I, is another sign of just how thin we are in certain spots. That is also disturbing, especially considering where the O-line is."
We knew the Cats were not deep at FB, especially following the move of Rimon to D and loss of Roxas. However, I have the belief reinforced more and more that Prince is playing who he is playing in certain areas to send messages to others who are underperforming. So far it hasn't had an incredible negitive affect, and I hope it doesn't in the future. We're getting into big boy football now (Louisville then the conference slate), and I hope everyone steps up and realizes that.
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"The fact he plays FB in the I, is another sign of just how thin we are in certain spots. That is also disturbing, especially considering where the O-line is."
We knew the Cats were not deep at FB, especially following the move of Rimon to D and loss of Roxas. However, I have the belief reinforced more and more that Prince is playing who he is playing in certain areas to send messages to others who are underperforming. So far it hasn't had an incredible negitive affect, and I hope it doesn't in the future. We're getting into big boy football now (Louisville then the conference slate), and I hope everyone steps up and realizes that.
I would argue McCardle's 1 rush for 1 fumble was disastorous as possible considering the D's amazing game.
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Regardless of the result of the Louisville game, I think that it's going to benefit us come Big XII time, barring any major injuries.
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Regardless of the result of the Louisville game, I think that it's going to benefit us come Big XII time, barring any major injuries.
I agree, however, if the team falls apart during conference play and we only pull of two wins, I will definitely be questioning the scheduling.
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Regardless of the result of the Louisville game, I think that it's going to benefit us come Big XII time, barring any major injuries.
I agree, however, if the team falls apart during conference play and we only pull of two wins, I will definitely be questioning the scheduling.
Well, sure, for the sake of getting to a bowl.
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"I would argue McCardle's 1 rush for 1 fumble was disastorous as possible considering the D's amazing game."
It did not affect the outcome of the game.
Yes, those of you out there grinding your teeth just waiting for that slip-up which costs K-State a game so you can ultimately point back to Ron Prince and brand him as a loser, that day will come. It was not yesterday.
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We can talk and analyze all we want, but to win at the D-1 level, you MUST have a playmaker at QB. The O-Line gave our QB plenty of time to get the ball to open receivers and it just didn't happen. Just be glad that our defense is way ahead of our Offense, or this would be long season. Dylan-PLEASE prove me wrong!
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We can talk and analyze all we want, but to win at the D-1 level, you MUST have a playmaker at QB. The O-Line gave our QB plenty of time to get the ball to open receivers and it just didn't happen. Just be glad that our defense is way ahead of our Offense, or this would be long season. Dylan-PLEASE prove me wrong!
No, you don't. We need Dylan to manage games and he's almost done that. Freeman isn't a realistic option for us to be successful, so I really don't know why people discuss this.
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Just because Freeman isn't ready doesn't mean the Meier doesn't suck. That said I agree that you don't need a playmaker at QB to win in D-I, what you need is a reliable QB who gives his receivers an opportunity to make plays the overwhelming majority of the time. Meier simply isn't capable of doing that and it's going to start costing us wins very soon.
Personally I thought it was nice to see a bit more Bill Snyder in Prince on the brief FSN postgame interview, "The defense played well, everything else was unacceptable." I'm relieved that it only took him two weeks to overcome the, "Golly gee but it's tough to win any game and we're just sooooo grateful for the win" bit.
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Mediocre runblocking O-Line and mediocre RB's -----> start chuckin' the pig for the short stuff.
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Just because Freeman isn't ready doesn't mean the Meier doesn't suck. That said I agree that you don't need a playmaker at QB to win in D-I, what you need is a reliable QB who gives his receivers an opportunity to make plays the overwhelming majority of the time. Meier simply isn't capable of doing that and it's going to start costing us wins very soon.
Incapable or haven't been able to?
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If he'd had this type of start to a season prior to his shoulder surgery it might have been a matter of time until he got on track but he's looked terrible and terribly inconsistent both times I've seen him this year. I'm sticking with incapable because he just isn't the same.
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Playing QB takes a good offensive line to do good things. I agree that Meier is showing average at best skillz right now, but I've seen him do better, and I'm not so sure it's a system thing.
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Most of the time he's getting 3 seconds or more to throw which should be enough but even when he gets the ball off there's not much zip or touch on most of the passes.
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Doesn't have to be. He's shown a range of throwing power from soft touch to drilling it.
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The only pass with much zip on it yesterday was to someone standing about 5 yards away. Downfield they were all floaters and, often as not, nowhere near the intended target.
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I'll watch the tape tomorrow and count. I don't remember it that way, but I remember some nice touch passes in there.
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Even a blind pig gets lucky sometimes MJ.
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1. This needs to be said. This team is well coached. I hate that I am so wrong about this and maybe it will change once we face some better teams, but there is better special teams, a better D (with a seemingly bigger emphasis on big plays) and an entirely different attitude/atmosphere than we have seen in some time. The special teams is exactly what I remember those KSU teams on recent vintage (game changing, always a threat forcing teams to think/gameplan it every game.
Agreed.
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Playing QB takes a good offensive line to do good things. I agree that Meier is showing average at best skillz right now, but I've seen him do better, and I'm not so sure it's a system thing.
Meier's problems weren't O-line problems. He way over threw his recievers the majority of the game. And the Fox announcers kept saying that the pass kept "sailing" on him. THose weren't "sailing" passes, just bad passes, plain and simple. I really wish Prince would have worked with, and tried to keep Evridge in camp, and not run him out of school. Now the team has to either deal with a damaged QB in Meier, who's showing his wear, or an untested, true freshman. Wow, alot of options there.
The defense played awesome against a subpar Marshall team. And if K-State wants any kind of respectablity after the Louisville game, they better play as good, or better, since the offense sputtered as bad as it did against a below average Marshall defense.
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Playing QB takes a good offensive line to do good things. I agree that Meier is showing average at best skillz right now, but I've seen him do better, and I'm not so sure it's a system thing.
Meier's problems weren't O-line problems. He way over threw his recievers the majority of the game. And the Fox announcers kept saying that the pass kept "sailing" on him. THose weren't "sailing" passes, just bad passes, plain and simple. I really wish Prince would have worked with, and tried to keep Evridge in camp, and not run him out of school. Now the team has to either deal with a damaged QB in Meier, who's showing his wear, or an untested, true freshman. Wow, alot of options there.
The defense played awesome against a subpar Marshall team. And if K-State wants any kind of respectablity after the Louisville game, they better play as good, or better, since the offense sputtered as bad as it did against a below average Marshall defense.
Meier, like most QB's aren't going to throw perfect passes everytime, especially when they are being rushed. Not many QB's in the NFL can throw perfect passes every time.
Like I told AzCat, I'll watch the tape tomorrow and count. Then I'll let you know.
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Doesn't have to be. He's shown a range of throwing power from soft touch to drilling it.
Have to disagree with you on this MJ, I would say that at best he has average arm strength for a D1 quarterback. Realistically he falls in the below average percentile. I've asked this question before and never really gotten an answer: Could Dylan Meier start for a National Championship contending team... No. So what exactly should se expect from him... exactly what he is, MEDIOCRE.
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Doesn't have to be. He's shown a range of throwing power from soft touch to drilling it.
Have to disagree with you on this MJ, I would say that at best he has average arm strength for a D1 quarterback. Realistically he falls in the below average percentile. I've asked this question before and never really gotten an answer: Could Dylan Meier start for a National Championship contending team... No. So what exactly should se expect from him... exactly what he is, MEDIOCRE.
I never said he was a championship QB. All I've said is that's he average. My issue is with people who say he has a "noodle" arm. I also suggest that he's still getting comfortable in this system. All QB's have to get reps in their system to become effective. This is his first year in this system and he'll get better. Whether he gets to play on a championship team, remains to be seen.
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Doesn't have to be. He's shown a range of throwing power from soft touch to drilling it.
Have to disagree with you on this MJ, I would say that at best he has average arm strength for a D1 quarterback. Realistically he falls in the below average percentile. I've asked this question before and never really gotten an answer: Could Dylan Meier start for a National Championship contending team... No. So what exactly should se expect from him... exactly what he is, MEDIOCRE.
You know, people said the same thing about Josh Heupel when OU won the NC in 2000. He didn't have the greatest arm strength, especially toward the end of the year. However, he was a very smart QB and was very accurate. He knew right where to put the ball and when to let it go. It's not so much about the arm strength as much as it is about the mind strength.
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I'm curious what you need to be successful at the D-1 level if you don't need a playmaking quarterback leading the charge? What do Chad May, Matt Miller, Michael Bishop, Jonathan Beasley and Ell Roberson not have in commom with Dylan Meier? Dylan-PLEASE prove me wrong! Please look at the top teams annually in college football and let me know who doesn't have a quarterback that makes plays.
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I'm curious what you need to be successful at the D-1 level if you don't need a playmaking quarterback leading the charge? What do Chad May, Matt Miller, Michael Bishop, Jonathan Beasley and Ell Roberson not have in commom with Dylan Meier? Dylan-PLEASE prove me wrong! Please look at the top teams annually in college football and let me know who doesn't have a quarterback that makes plays.
All of those QB's struggled their first few games in Snyder's new system.
Then look what happened. This isn't an issue where Dylan should just be the best QB right off the bat. It takes time. Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field.
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Josh Heupel has already been mentioned.
Game 1:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11629
Game 2:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11673
Game 3:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11655
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My only point is that for Kansas State to "compete for championships" you must have a playmaker at quarterback. I want Dylan to be that playmaker but he is in his 5th year in the system and there are no signs of it yet. For anyone to think that we will win consistently at KSU without a playmaker at QB is just not real bright.
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Josh Heupel has already been mentioned.
Game 1:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11629
Game 2:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11673
Game 3:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11655
He didn't win a championship that year. Far from it. Of course, he was in Mike Leach's offense too.
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"Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field."
Michael Bishop.
September 27, 1997 Kansas State 58 Bowling Green O
Of course, he was surrounded by Eric Hickson, Mike Lawrence, Darnell McDonald and an experienced O-Line (Weiner, Jacox, Young-all still in the NFL).
Defense wasn't bad either. Howard, Simoneau, Ochs, Kelly, Chapman etc.
It should be noted the game before that (Ohio) was essentially an Illinois State like escape, and the game after that a horrible loss to Nebraska.
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I really enjoy all the excuses people give for Meier. The guy is a marginal Big 12 QB. His arm is marginal and all that's missing from his release is a crow-hop. He's not throwin the ball at a receiver's feet or throwing it to the other team (a Meier family tradition it seems) because he's not comfortable in the sytem, he's doing these things because he's a marginal QB. Which is fine as I didn't expect anything more out of him and if the defense continues to play at the level it plays, we should stay in a lot of ball games.
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I really enjoy all the excuses people give for Meier. The guy is a marginal Big 12 QB. His arm is marginal and all that's missing from his release is a crow-hop. He's not throwin the ball at a receiver's feet or throwing it to the other team (a Meier family tradition it seems) because he's not comfortable in the sytem, he's doing these things because he's a marginal QB. Which is fine as I didn't expect anything more out of him and if the defense continues to play at the level it plays, we should stay in a lot of ball games.
I don't think anyone is making excuses for Meier. I think people are just too presumptuous that he's not the type of QB we need in our system when you consider.. he's 3-0 right now as the starter. Yes, it's been ugly, but again, this is a team game.
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Josh Heupel has already been mentioned.
Game 1:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11629
Game 2:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11673
Game 3:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11655
He didn't win a championship that year. Far from it. Of course, he was in Mike Leach's offense too.
You said: Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field.
Nothing about championships. He did turn around a program that hadn't been to a bowl in five years.
Should Heupel lighting it up not count because it was under Leach's system?
LMK.
I could also name plenty of true freshmen that had awesome first seasons, such as Chad Henne and Phillip Rivers.
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Josh Heupel has already been mentioned.
Game 1:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11629
Game 2:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11673
Game 3:
http://www.soonersports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_LANG=C&SPID=190&SPORT_TAB_SEL=03&DB_OEM_ID=300&SPSID=2469&ATCLID=11655
He didn't win a championship that year. Far from it. Of course, he was in Mike Leach's offense too.
You said: Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field.
Nothing about championships. He did turn around a program that hadn't been to a bowl in five years.
Should Heupel lighting it up not count because it was under Leach's system?
LMK.
I could also name plenty of true freshmen that had awesome first seasons, such as Chad Henne and Phillip Rivers.
No, Stoops turned that program around, and it was stocked with talent. Heuppel was brought in from Snow College to go with Leach's system to get it turned around.
The names you mentioned all had GREAT supporting casts in players and talent and coaching to get them going. There is a lot more to it than just assuming the QB can make the program great. It's a team game. Heuppel was put in a system that he was familiary with. Meier is learning a new one. We go back to that recruiting thing about getting kids to fit your system.
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Kingsbury?
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Kingsbury?
Who's that?
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Kliff.
Game 2: 450 yards
http://texastech.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/090200aab.html
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So it's about yardage now?
I'm not following you here.
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So it's about yardage now?
I'm not following you here.
Did Kingsbury not "light it up"?
You challenged someone to name qb's that lit it up in a new system by game 3...Kliff fits the bill.
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Kingsbury?
Wow. He had *mastered* the system so much in the next two games he threw 2 TD passes and 5 interceptions. Game #3 TT beat North Texas by a mere Touchdown.
Game #3 Box score
http://members.door.net/nbclumber/2000-NCAA/2000FB-History/Game-03-box.htm
Clearly, that's *lighting it up*
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Also, I don't think Dylan would look good in any system right now.
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So it's about yardage now?
I'm not following you here.
Did Kingsbury not "light it up"?
You challenged someone to name qb's that lit it up in a new system by game 3...Kliff fits the bill.
OK, so he lit it up by the third game. How many more? You got a lot of work to do.
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Also, I don't think Dylan would look good in any system right now.
There's no way to know unless he played in them.
The point still stands. He is trying to learn a new system. Of all the QB's you've mentioned (very few I might add) none of them mastered their system in the first year to be so successful other than maybe going to a bowl game. At this point, there is nothing to suggest that Dylan couldn't get us there either.
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So it's about yardage now?
I'm not following you here.
Did Kingsbury not "light it up"?
You challenged someone to name qb's that lit it up in a new system by game 3...Kliff fits the bill.
OK, so he lit it up by the third game. How many more? You got a lot of work to do.
WTF? More QB's to name?
Also, I don't think Dylan would look good in any system right now.
There's no way to know unless he played in them.
The point still stands. He is trying to learn a new system. Of all the QB's you've mentioned (very few I might add) none of them mastered their system in the first year to be so successful other than maybe going to a bowl game. At this point, there is nothing to suggest that Dylan couldn't get us there either.
Going to a bowl game would be incredibly successful for this team, and Dylan. I just believe there is more to suggest he won't get us to a bowl game. I realize there's a new system, but I don't think he would be running Bill's offense any better.
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If it takes at least a year to get comfortable with the system, then why are we training a senior who's going to be gone next year, instead of starting the guy who's going to be back? Next year we just get to go through this all over again with Freeman?
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If it takes at least a year to get comfortable with the system, then why are we training a senior who's going to be gone next year, instead of starting the guy who's going to be back? Next year we just get to go through this all over again with Freeman?
Not sure. I wonder that myself.
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"I could also name plenty of true freshmen that had awesome first seasons, such as Chad Henne and Phillip Rivers."
Chad Henne, mastering the offense by the 3rd game of his first season...11-24 2 TDs and 3 INTs vs. San Diego State
Rivers there might be a better case for.
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Going to a bowl game would be incredibly successful for this team, and Dylan. I just believe there is more to suggest he won't get us to a bowl game. I realize there's a new system, but I don't think he would be running Bill's offense any better.
I think you're just being a negative nelly. No way you can offer anything to suggest that Meier couldn't get us to a bowl game.
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Colt McCoy - 38/59 6TD 1INT with a QB rating of 159.5.
Fact is that a QB will show his true colors pretty quickly. The biggest adjustment coming into the college game is the speed of the opposing teams and as the examples above show, lots of frosh not only adjust to that but also pick up their new systems and don't traverse a years-long learning curve to reach top form. Meier's a mediocre (at best) QB with a weak arm who often makes questionable decisions. He isn't that good, he's never been that good, and he'll never be that good.
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Colt McCoy - 38/59 6TD 1INT with a QB rating of 159.5.
Fact is that a QB will show his true colors pretty quickly. The biggest adjustment coming into the college game is the speed of the opposing teams and as the examples above show, lots of frosh not only adjust to that but also pick up their new systems and don't traverse a years-long learning curve to reach top form. Meier's a mediocre (at best) QB with a weak arm who often makes questionable decisions. He isn't that good, he's never been that good, and he'll never be that good.
With all those people he has with a supporting cast, and playing RICE of all teams.
Good one. He didn't do so well against OSU.
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I think you're just being a negative nelly. No way you can offer anything to suggest that Meier couldn't get us to a bowl game.
Meier will show us that himself next weekend.
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Meier's not a freshman MJ and he had a piss poor game against a I-AA team. McCoy had a poor game ... against the #1 team in the nation while starting his 2nd game as a freshman. See any relevant differences there?
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"I could also name plenty of true freshmen that had awesome first seasons, such as Chad Henne and Phillip Rivers."
Chad Henne, mastering the offense by the 3rd game of his first season...11-24 2 TDs and 3 INTs vs. San Diego State
Rivers there might be a better case for.
He went 25-40 for 240 @Notre Dame the previous week.
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"Colt McCoy - 38/59 6TD 1INT with a QB rating of 159.5."
Colt had a year under his belt as a redshirt.
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And how many years does Meier have under his belt?
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In this system (you KNOW the answer to this question!) less than a year. 3 total games.
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Meier's not a freshman MJ and he had a piss poor game against a I-AA team. McCoy had a poor game ... against the #1 team in the nation while starting his 2nd game as a freshman. See any relevant differences there?
Meier is in the first year of a new system, one that is different than the one he was in.
The biggest difference is the supporting cast. I agree that Meier is a not the best QB, but do you think Colt would do well in one system and then go into another system and just get it by the second or third game?
I'm not disputing Meier is not a great QB. What I'm disputing is the idea that he is incapable of leading us to a bowl game, or that he doesn't have the talent to do so.
The evidence is supported by the fact that relevance is clearly in the supporting cast unit and how it works. Also note, Dylan is not responsible for the RUN game, which is an essential part of the system. Also note, that Dylan was recruited into an option QB system.
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Reading defenses is reading defenses, hitting receivers is hitting receivers. He's allegedly a bright kid, he shouldn't be having this much trouble being effective against inferior competition unless he just flat out sucks as a quarterback. Don't get me wrong, I think he'd be a fine starting QB ... for Pitt State, Fort Hays or the like, but in the Big XII? Give me a break. :rolleyes:
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If we make it to a bowl game this year, and right now I'd think that at worst there's a coin-flip chance that we will, it will be because of excellent play on defense and special teams. The entire offense is a writeoff this year, starting with the QB.
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Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
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"He went 25-40 for 240 @Notre Dame the previous week."
Dylan Meier: 19-35 for 256 yards. Both had 1 TD and 1 INT.
So, fun with numbers.
Yards per completion:
Henne: 9.6
Meier: 13.4
Yards per attempt:
Henne: 6 yards
Meier: 7.3
Yes, yes...I know. Notre Dame vs. Marshall. Sure, I'll give you that if you give me that Henne had a pretty good route runner by the name of Braylon Edwards account for half of his completions and more than half his yardage. Heck, I would take 3-4 UM WRs that year above anyone currently on the Cats roster. Quincy Morgan isn't suiting up in Purple in 2006.
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If we make it to a bowl game this year, and right now I'd think that at worst there's a coin-flip chance that we will, it will be because of excellent play on defense and special teams. The entire offense is a writeoff this year, starting with the QB.
Amazing. If we don't go to a bowl game, it's because of Dylan, and if we do, it won't be because of him. Or even the offense.
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Reading defenses is reading defenses, hitting receivers is hitting receivers. He's allegedly a bright kid, he shouldn't be having this much trouble being effective against inferior competition unless he just flat out sucks as a quarterback. Don't get me wrong, I think he'd be a fine starting QB ... for Pitt State, Fort Hays or the like, but in the Big XII? Give me a break. :rolleyes:
Yes, but so is being able to see down the field when you're not running for your life, and having protection to do so.
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"He went 25-40 for 240 @Notre Dame the previous week."
Dylan Meier: 19-35 for 256 yards. Both had 1 TD and 1 INT.
So, fun with numbers.
Yards per completion:
Henne: 9.6
Meier: 13.4
Yards per attempt:
Henne: 6 yards
Meier: 7.3
Yes, yes...I know. Notre Dame vs. Marshall. Sure, I'll give you that if you give me that Henne had a pretty good route runner by the name of Braylon Edwards account for half of his completions and more than half his yardage. Heck, I would take 3-4 UM WRs that year above anyone currently on the Cats roster. Quincy Morgan isn't suiting up in Purple in 2006.
Not just vs. Notre Dame...at Notre Dame...as a TRUE FRESHMAN. Also, don't act like Moreira and Nelson weren't making plays for Dylan.
Do you think Chad Henne as a frosh was worse than Dylan right now?
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"He went 25-40 for 240 @Notre Dame the previous week."
Dylan Meier: 19-35 for 256 yards. Both had 1 TD and 1 INT.
So, fun with numbers.
Yards per completion:
Henne: 9.6
Meier: 13.4
Yards per attempt:
Henne: 6 yards
Meier: 7.3
Yes, yes...I know. Notre Dame vs. Marshall. Sure, I'll give you that if you give me that Henne had a pretty good route runner by the name of Braylon Edwards account for half of his completions and more than half his yardage. Heck, I would take 3-4 UM WRs that year above anyone currently on the Cats roster. Quincy Morgan isn't suiting up in Purple in 2006.
Not just vs. Notre Dame...at Notre Dame...as a TRUE FRESHMAN. Also, don't act like Moreira and Nelson weren't making plays for Dylan.
Do you think Chad Henne as a frosh was worse than Dylan right now?
Both games, both QB's won their game.
And yet, one is still worse than the other.
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How is Henne's performance more masterful and/or "lighting it up" than Meier? PLEASE EXPLAIN THAT.
Now back to your regularly scheduled excuse.
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"He went 25-40 for 240 @Notre Dame the previous week."
Dylan Meier: 19-35 for 256 yards. Both had 1 TD and 1 INT.
So, fun with numbers.
Yards per completion:
Henne: 9.6
Meier: 13.4
Yards per attempt:
Henne: 6 yards
Meier: 7.3
Yes, yes...I know. Notre Dame vs. Marshall. Sure, I'll give you that if you give me that Henne had a pretty good route runner by the name of Braylon Edwards account for half of his completions and more than half his yardage. Heck, I would take 3-4 UM WRs that year above anyone currently on the Cats roster. Quincy Morgan isn't suiting up in Purple in 2006.
Not just vs. Notre Dame...at Notre Dame...as a TRUE FRESHMAN. Also, don't act like Moreira and Nelson weren't making plays for Dylan.
Do you think Chad Henne as a frosh was worse than Dylan right now?
Both games, both QB's won their game.
And yet, one is still worse than the other.
Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
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MJ - That "running for his life" BS has gone by the wayside. KSU is tied for 4th fewest sacks allowed in D-I with 0.67 per game. Try to keep up and stop swinging from Dylan's nutsack, it's probably the only part of his body that's not injured already.
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How is Henne's performance more masterful and/or "lighting it up" than Meier? PLEASE EXPLAIN THAT.
Now back to your regularly scheduled excuse.
Is Meier better than Henne?
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MJ - That "running for his life" BS has gone by the wayside. KSU is tied for 4th fewest sacks allowed in D-I with 0.67 per game. Try to keep up and stop swinging from Dylan's nutsack, it's probably the only part of his body that's not injured already.
That's the best you could come up with, some kind of retarded remark about his testicles?
Come on, man, he throws a lot out of the pocket and on the run, and the reason it is so low is because he does throw it before getting sacked. And in many cases, there is a receiver there to catch it. Yeah, he sometimes throws it at their shoelaces, or over their heads, but that says he's not going to take the sack. Pretty smart play, I would think.
:jerkoff:
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
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How is Henne's performance more masterful and/or "lighting it up" than Meier? PLEASE EXPLAIN THAT.
Now back to your regularly scheduled excuse.
Is Meier better than Henne?
Henne is in his third year in his system. Meier is in his first. I think it's pretty obvious how it all looks.
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MJ - fact is that many college QBs are able to effectively deliver the ball in the time Dylan has. Do you think KSU is the only team in the college game that occasionally moves the pocket or rolls their QB out. Nice try with the straw man but no dice, KSU does nothing that every other college team doesn't do and Dylan doesn't deliver catchable balls as often as most D-I QBs do. He's just subpar.
If you want to try another angle, try this one: KSU is #98 in passing efficiency against Marshall (#72 in pass efficiency D), Florida Atlantic (#86 in pass efficiency D), and I-AA Illinois State, all of whom have greatly inflated their defensive stats against our offense (in other words they're actually worse than their rankings indicate). It's sad that you're defending this.
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Fact is, few if any college QB's go from one system to another and manage to grasp it quickly.
Check out NU's QB Joe Dailey. He had a real good time grasping a Nebraska option system to the West Coast didn't he?
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Dylan "China Doll" Meier isn't and never has been a true option QB and KSU never ran an option offense to anything like the extent Nebraska did. Personally I think the "it takes time to pick up a new system" excuse is just that much more BS. Before the first game we were told that the new offense wasn't that complicated and that the team hadn't had a tough time picking it up at all. Now, following dismal performances by our allegedly brainy QB, it's suddenly difficult? Please.
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
I would appreciate the same from you.
I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
Here's why Henne's performance was more impressive:
1) @Notre Dame vs. Marshall (home). That's really all you need.
Either way, this is nitpicking. The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well. I provided several examples of QB's in new systems that performed quite well. Apparently they weren't valid because they don't mirror KSU's situation exactly. Dylan is performing as well as any QB could possibly perform under the circumstances.
Also, I think some of you are trying to insinuate that my criticism of Dylan makes me "anti-Prince". That's not the case at all...I think the staff is doing a great job with playcalling and is putting Dylan in a position to make plays...I think a decent QB could make more plays than Dylan, which would put us in a better position to win.
I'm actually very happy with the work of the staff so far.
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
I would appreciate the same from you.
I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
Here's why Henne's performance was more impressive:
1) @Notre Dame vs. Marshall (home). That's really all you need.
Either way, this is nitpicking. The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well. I provided several examples of QB's in new systems that performed quite well. Apparently they weren't valid because they don't mirror KSU's situation exactly. Dylan is performing as well as any QB could possibly perform under the circumstances.
Also, I think some of you are trying to insinuate that my criticism of Dylan makes me "anti-Prince". That's not the case at all...I think the staff is doing a great job with playcalling and is putting Dylan in a position to make plays...I think a decent QB could make more plays than Dylan, which would put us in a better position to win.
I'm actually very happy with the work of the staff so far.
The point I made was that it's hard for QB's to change into systems that are different can hardly be expected to just be better at it and master it within a few short games. What you showed were QB's who had better supporting casts. What you all seem to forget is that the QB is not the ONLY participant in this system. Everyone on the OFFENSE changes. It takes some time to get up to snuff and master the system for everyone. Henne came into a system where the other principles knew it. Heuppel came into a new system as well as the entire team, and he did eventually master it because the next year, they won the NC, they didn't do it their first year except to a bowl and they lost there. That isn't the same as Kingsbury, because Leach's system didn't result in Kingsbury competing for a championship because his defense sucked badly and Leach didn't care. Leach figures he can just out-score anyone. Henne had a bad start in his freshman year, went 3-3. Meier could do the same. The closest analogy to Meier is Joe Dailey from Nebraska. We all know what happened there.
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
I would appreciate the same from you.
I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
Here's why Henne's performance was more impressive:
1) @Notre Dame vs. Marshall (home). That's really all you need.
Either way, this is nitpicking. The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well. I provided several examples of QB's in new systems that performed quite well. Apparently they weren't valid because they don't mirror KSU's situation exactly. Dylan is performing as well as any QB could possibly perform under the circumstances.
Also, I think some of you are trying to insinuate that my criticism of Dylan makes me "anti-Prince". That's not the case at all...I think the staff is doing a great job with playcalling and is putting Dylan in a position to make plays...I think a decent QB could make more plays than Dylan, which would put us in a better position to win.
I'm actually very happy with the work of the staff so far.
The point I made was that it's hard for QB's to change into systems that are different can hardly be expected to just be better at it and master it within a few short games. What you showed were QB's who had better supporting casts. What you all seem to forget is that the QB is not the ONLY participant in this system. Everyone on the OFFENSE changes. It takes some time to get up to snuff and master the system for everyone. Henne came into a system where the other principles knew it. Heuppel came into a new system as well as the entire team, and he did eventually master it because the next year, they won the NC, they didn't do it their first year except to a bowl and they lost there. That isn't the same as Kingsbury, because Leach's system didn't result in Kingsbury competing for a championship because his defense sucked badly and Leach didn't care. Leach figures he can just out-score anyone. Henne had a bad start in his freshman year, went 3-3. Meier could do the same. The closest analogy to Meier is Joe Dailey from Nebraska. We all know what happened there.
Heupel's offense performed beautifully from day 1. New system for everyone. I would be thrilled if Dylan replicated Heupel's 7-5 season.
Kingsbury is another great example of a new offensive system working beautifully...not sure how Leach's poor defense proves this wrong.
Henne went 10-3 and led Michigan to the Rose Bowl.
I don't recall Solich sending Dailey out in five-wide, no huddle situations regularly. I don't remember Dailey attempting 40+ passes in a game...Dylan did every conference game he was healthy. You act like Dylan has never been asked to do anything but run the option and hand off to I-backs. That is simply not the case. He is not being asked to do anything much more difficult (passing wise) than he was under Snyder.
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
I would appreciate the same from you.
I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
Here's why Henne's performance was more impressive:
1) @Notre Dame vs. Marshall (home). That's really all you need.
Either way, this is nitpicking. The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well. I provided several examples of QB's in new systems that performed quite well. Apparently they weren't valid because they don't mirror KSU's situation exactly. Dylan is performing as well as any QB could possibly perform under the circumstances.
Also, I think some of you are trying to insinuate that my criticism of Dylan makes me "anti-Prince". That's not the case at all...I think the staff is doing a great job with playcalling and is putting Dylan in a position to make plays...I think a decent QB could make more plays than Dylan, which would put us in a better position to win.
I'm actually very happy with the work of the staff so far.
The point I made was that it's hard for QB's to change into systems that are different can hardly be expected to just be better at it and master it within a few short games. What you showed were QB's who had better supporting casts. What you all seem to forget is that the QB is not the ONLY participant in this system. Everyone on the OFFENSE changes. It takes some time to get up to snuff and master the system for everyone. Henne came into a system where the other principles knew it. Heuppel came into a new system as well as the entire team, and he did eventually master it because the next year, they won the NC, they didn't do it their first year except to a bowl and they lost there. That isn't the same as Kingsbury, because Leach's system didn't result in Kingsbury competing for a championship because his defense sucked badly and Leach didn't care. Leach figures he can just out-score anyone. Henne had a bad start in his freshman year, went 3-3. Meier could do the same. The closest analogy to Meier is Joe Dailey from Nebraska. We all know what happened there.
Heupel's offense performed beautifully from day 1. New system for everyone. I would be thrilled if Dylan replicated Heupel's 7-5 season.
Kingsbury is another great example of a new offensive system working beautifully...not sure how Leach's poor defense proves this wrong.
Henne went 10-3 and led Michigan to the Rose Bowl.
I don't recall Solich sending Dailey out in five-wide, no huddle situations regularly. I don't remember Dailey attempting 40+ passes in a game...Dylan did every conference game he was healthy. You act like Dylan has never been asked to do anything but run the option and hand off to I-backs. That is simply not the case. He is not being asked to do anything much more difficult (passing wise) than he was under Snyder.
Beautifully is so subjective it's almost hillarious that you use that word in your attempt to downplay Meier at every turn. No, those offenses had it's ups and downs throughout the season. You go back and look again.
Solich wasn't the coach when Dailey started. Callahan was. Dailey played sparingly but was heir to Jamal Lord when Solich was canned.
Again, I know this is hard for you to grasp so I will say it again. Dylan is not the QB you want him to be, and I accept that, but he is also capable of becoming a QB to get us to a bowl game and you have not shown anything that says he can't. Period. All you do is keep jumping back to the stats of other QB's who've done "beautiful" but reality doesn't support that.
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Look Rusty, if you won't answer the questions just say you WON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.
I would appreciate the same from you.
I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
Here's why Henne's performance was more impressive:
1) @Notre Dame vs. Marshall (home). That's really all you need.
Either way, this is nitpicking. The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well. I provided several examples of QB's in new systems that performed quite well. Apparently they weren't valid because they don't mirror KSU's situation exactly. Dylan is performing as well as any QB could possibly perform under the circumstances.
Also, I think some of you are trying to insinuate that my criticism of Dylan makes me "anti-Prince". That's not the case at all...I think the staff is doing a great job with playcalling and is putting Dylan in a position to make plays...I think a decent QB could make more plays than Dylan, which would put us in a better position to win.
I'm actually very happy with the work of the staff so far.
The point I made was that it's hard for QB's to change into systems that are different can hardly be expected to just be better at it and master it within a few short games. What you showed were QB's who had better supporting casts. What you all seem to forget is that the QB is not the ONLY participant in this system. Everyone on the OFFENSE changes. It takes some time to get up to snuff and master the system for everyone. Henne came into a system where the other principles knew it. Heuppel came into a new system as well as the entire team, and he did eventually master it because the next year, they won the NC, they didn't do it their first year except to a bowl and they lost there. That isn't the same as Kingsbury, because Leach's system didn't result in Kingsbury competing for a championship because his defense sucked badly and Leach didn't care. Leach figures he can just out-score anyone. Henne had a bad start in his freshman year, went 3-3. Meier could do the same. The closest analogy to Meier is Joe Dailey from Nebraska. We all know what happened there.
Heupel's offense performed beautifully from day 1. New system for everyone. I would be thrilled if Dylan replicated Heupel's 7-5 season.
Kingsbury is another great example of a new offensive system working beautifully...not sure how Leach's poor defense proves this wrong.
Henne went 10-3 and led Michigan to the Rose Bowl.
I don't recall Solich sending Dailey out in five-wide, no huddle situations regularly. I don't remember Dailey attempting 40+ passes in a game...Dylan did every conference game he was healthy. You act like Dylan has never been asked to do anything but run the option and hand off to I-backs. That is simply not the case. He is not being asked to do anything much more difficult (passing wise) than he was under Snyder.
Beautifully is so subjective it's almost hillarious that you use that word in your attempt to downplay Meier at every turn. No, those offenses had it's ups and downs throughout the season. You go back and look again.
Solich wasn't the coach when Dailey started. Callahan was. Dailey played sparingly but was heir to Jamal Lord when Solich was canned.
Again, I know this is hard for you to grasp so I will say it again. Dylan is not the QB you want him to be, and I accept that, but he is also capable of becoming a QB to get us to a bowl game and you have not shown anything that says he can't. Period. All you do is keep jumping back to the stats of other QB's who've done "beautiful" but reality doesn't support that.
Seriously, your Dailey argument makes no sense whatsoever. A much better argument would be Brandon Streetor at Clemson under Bowden.
You haven't shown a thing that says Dylan CAN get us to a bowl game...Has a team that failed to score an offensive TD against a I-AA team ever gone to a bowl game?
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"I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
No, I was dealing with mj's comment.
The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well.
I'll let mj tell me what point he was trying to make.
Here is exactly what he said at points in his argument....
"Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field"
...and that's what I have argued for. That IS the argument. Not auxiliary questions you want to throw at myself. That's changing the subject. Let's stay focused.
You came back with Kliff Kingsbury...based on one games performance. One game, to me, does not indicate mastery and I followed up with an argument why. Including multiple games. You completely looked past that, or did not respond.
You pointed out Rivers & Henne. I took issue with Henne, pointing out his game 3 stats. I believe those to be pedestrian. Please note, the 3rd game also fits with "game 3" mentioned by mj. Your response to my Henne comment was to point out how well he did in game 2 of that season. So, I did a statistical breakdown of that *masterful* performance you were claiming versus the performance being critiqued here (Marshall). No response from you about that, simply an attempt to change the subject.
"Either way, this is nitpicking. "
Nitpicking you wanted to do!
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Seriously, your Dailey argument makes no sense whatsoever. A much better argument would be Brandon Streetor at Clemson under Bowden.
You haven't shown a thing that says Dylan CAN get us to a bowl game...Has a team that failed to score an offensive TD against a I-AA team ever gone to a bowl game?
It makes perfect sense. Dailey was an option QB under Solich. He started in Callahan's WCO offense, and the team went 5-6. The year before, the team went 10-3. They switched systems, one that was primarily run to the WCO. You're just ignoring it. Perhaps someone else can help you out in history and figure it out.
Besides, what does it matter if he didn't score an offensive touchdown against a I-AA team? We still won the game. Unless you can show he hasn't progressed since then, then you're just ignoring reality. He had a better offensive production against Marshall than he did against a much weaker Florida Atlantic team. Seems to me, he's heading in the right direction.
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"We still won the game."
THERE YOU GO AGAIN! Completely missing the point. This isn't about winning games...it's all about statistics and feelings.
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"I asked you if you thought Meier was better than Henne, and you responded with your "why was game 2 of Chad Henne's career more impressive than game 3 of Year 5 of Dylan Meier's career."
No, I was dealing with mj's comment.
I replied anyway.
The point MJ was trying to make is that QB's in a new system never do well.
I'll let mj tell me what point he was trying to make.
Here is exactly what he said at points in his argument....
"Name a QB that came into a system in his first year, mastered it by game 3 and was lighting up the field"
...and that's what I have argued for. That IS the argument. Not auxiliary questions you want to throw at myself. That's changing the subject. Let's stay focused.
You came back with Kliff Kingsbury...based on one games performance. One game, to me, does not indicate mastery and I followed up with an argument why. Including multiple games. You completely looked past that, or did not respond.
You pointed out Rivers & Henne. I took issue with Henne, pointing out his 3 game stats. I believe those to be pedestrian. Please note, the 3rd game also fits with "game 3" mentioned by mj. Your response to my Henne comment was to point out how well he did in game 2 of that season. So, I did a statistical breakdown of that *masterful* performance versus the performance being critiqued here (Marshall). No response from you about that, simply an attempt to change the subject.
Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
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Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
Heupel was an exception. How many others switched systems and became successful like Heuppel and his 7-5 season?
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Seriously, your Dailey argument makes no sense whatsoever. A much better argument would be Brandon Streetor at Clemson under Bowden.
You haven't shown a thing that says Dylan CAN get us to a bowl game...Has a team that failed to score an offensive TD against a I-AA team ever gone to a bowl game?
It makes perfect sense. Dailey was an option QB under Solich. He started in Callahan's WCO offense, and the team went 5-6. The year before, the team went 10-3. They switched systems, one that was primarily run to the WCO. You're just ignoring it. Perhaps someone else can help you out in history and figure it out.
Dylan was not an option quarterback under Bill Snyder. Dylan had multiple games that he attempted 40+ passes. Changing from Prince's system to Prince's system is not nearly as drastic as changing from Solich's to Callahan's. If anything, Dylan was asked to make more difficult passing plays under Snyder's system. Dylan should be much better prepared to run Prince's system than Dailey running Callahan's.
Besides, what does it matter if he didn't score an offensive touchdown against a I-AA team? We still won the game. Unless you can show he hasn't progressed since then, then you're just ignoring reality. He had a better offensive production against Marshall than he did against a much weaker Florida Atlantic team. Seems to me, he's heading in the right direction.
Likewise, if you don't consider Dylan's performance against ISU (and FAU) a bad sign, you're also ignoring reality. I hope he is heading in the right direction. We'll see.
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Seriously, your Dailey argument makes no sense whatsoever. A much better argument would be Brandon Streetor at Clemson under Bowden.
You haven't shown a thing that says Dylan CAN get us to a bowl game...Has a team that failed to score an offensive TD against a I-AA team ever gone to a bowl game?
It makes perfect sense. Dailey was an option QB under Solich. He started in Callahan's WCO offense, and the team went 5-6. The year before, the team went 10-3. They switched systems, one that was primarily run to the WCO. You're just ignoring it. Perhaps someone else can help you out in history and figure it out.
Dylan was not an option quarterback under Bill Snyder. Dylan had multiple games that he attempted 40+ passes. Changing from Prince's system to Prince's system is not nearly as drastic as changing from Solich's to Callahan's. If anything, Dylan was asked to make more difficult passing plays under Snyder's system. Dylan should be much better prepared to run Prince's system than Dailey running Callahan's.
How many games did he have 40+ attempts? He only had 220 attempts all year in 2004, the year he played 10 games.
Changing systems may not have been as drastic, but Snyder's system had a lot more to it than Prince's does, and the decision making process is very different. When you've learned a system for 4 years, why is it that you believe it would be an easier transition? I don't know what you expect out of Dylan, but it's clear you're expecting something he didn't do under Snyder's system either. However, what is true, is that he's progressing under Prince's system. Are you saying he isn't?
Besides, what does it matter if he didn't score an offensive touchdown against a I-AA team? We still won the game. Unless you can show he hasn't progressed since then, then you're just ignoring reality. He had a better offensive production against Marshall than he did against a much weaker Florida Atlantic team. Seems to me, he's heading in the right direction.
Likewise, if you don't consider Dylan's performance against ISU (and FAU) a bad sign, you're also ignoring reality. I hope he is heading in the right direction. We'll see.
It was the first and the second game he showed improvement. The third game showed he's grasping and moving forward. Our running game, lack thereof is more critical than the issue of Meier. You can't blame him for an ineffective running game.
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Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
Heupel was an exception. How many others switched systems and became successful like Heuppel and his 7-5 season?
Rivers.
Kingsbury.
Henne.
Streetor/Dantzler.
Shaun Hill (maryland)
Suggs (Ga. Tech)
Tuiasosopo (Wash)
David Greene (GA)
Chris Leak
Clint Stoerner (ark)
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Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
Heupel was an exception. How many others switched systems and became successful like Heuppel and his 7-5 season?
Rivers.
Kingsbury.
Henne.
Streetor/Dantzler.
Shaun Hill (maryland)
Suggs (Ga. Tech)
Tuiasosopo (Wash)
David Greene (GA)
Chris Leak
Clint Stoerner (ark)
Rather than just throw out names, why don't you demonstrate WHY those are relevant to the discussion.
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Seriously, your Dailey argument makes no sense whatsoever. A much better argument would be Brandon Streetor at Clemson under Bowden.
You haven't shown a thing that says Dylan CAN get us to a bowl game...Has a team that failed to score an offensive TD against a I-AA team ever gone to a bowl game?
It makes perfect sense. Dailey was an option QB under Solich. He started in Callahan's WCO offense, and the team went 5-6. The year before, the team went 10-3. They switched systems, one that was primarily run to the WCO. You're just ignoring it. Perhaps someone else can help you out in history and figure it out.
Dylan was not an option quarterback under Bill Snyder. Dylan had multiple games that he attempted 40+ passes. Changing from Prince's system to Prince's system is not nearly as drastic as changing from Solich's to Callahan's. If anything, Dylan was asked to make more difficult passing plays under Snyder's system. Dylan should be much better prepared to run Prince's system than Dailey running Callahan's.
How many games did he have 40+ attempts? He only had 220 attempts all year in 2004, the year he played 10 games.
Changing systems may not have been as drastic, but Snyder's system had a lot more to it than Prince's does, and the decision making process is very different. When you've learned a system for 4 years, why is it that you believe it would be an easier transition? I don't know what you expect out of Dylan, but it's clear you're expecting something he didn't do under Snyder's system either. However, what is true, is that he's progressing under Prince's system. Are you saying he isn't?
He attempted 40 passes vs. atm, OU, and tech. In many of his ten games, he played less than a half.
I don't think his problems have anything to do with the system...I think it is mostly physical. I didn't watch the first two games, so I can't comment on his decision making in those games compared with Marshall. I thought his decision making was somewhat questionable against Marshall...not horrible...he just missed too many open receivers.
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Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
Heupel was an exception. How many others switched systems and became successful like Heuppel and his 7-5 season?
Rivers.
Kingsbury.
Henne.
Streetor/Dantzler.
Shaun Hill (maryland)
Suggs (Ga. Tech)
Tuiasosopo (Wash)
David Greene (GA)
Chris Leak
Clint Stoerner (ark)
Rather than just throw out names, why don't you demonstrate WHY those are relevant to the discussion.
All of those are QB's that switched systems and "became successful", which is what you requested.
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Did I really have to go any further than Heupel?
Heupel was an exception. How many others switched systems and became successful like Heuppel and his 7-5 season?
Rivers.
Kingsbury.
Henne.
Streetor/Dantzler.
Shaun Hill (maryland)
Suggs (Ga. Tech)
Tuiasosopo (Wash)
David Greene (GA)
Chris Leak
Clint Stoerner (ark)
Rather than just throw out names, why don't you demonstrate WHY those are relevant to the discussion.
All of those are QB's that switched systems and "became successful", which is what you requested.
Last chance. Let's see why you believe they "became successful". Each one. Go ahead.
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Bowl games.
Each one.
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
You disagree?
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
You disagree?
It wasn't about disagreeing. It was about showing us who mastered their system. To you, it's a bowl game. I don't consider that mastering a system because a team with a great defense, good special teams and an OK offense can get to a bowl game.
That says nothing of the QB. But for you, that's how you get around trying to work at proving a point.
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He attempted 40 passes vs. atm, OU, and tech.
Only Tech & ATM did he have over 40 attempts.
Ohh, and Tuiasosopo did not play in a bowl game as a freshman. Pretty sure that's the case for Stoerner as well. Did Suggs even play in the bowl they went to his first season at GT?
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
You disagree?
It wasn't about disagreeing. It was about showing us who mastered their system. To you, it's a bowl game. I don't consider that mastering a system because a team with a great defense, good special teams and an OK offense can get to a bowl game.
That says nothing of the QB. But for you, that's how you get around trying to work at proving a point.
It's too late for me to go through every one...but we went over kingsbury and Henne...Dantzler and Streeter combined for over 3000 yards and went to a bowl with a D that gave up 330 yards/ game.
What point am I trying to make other than I wish we had a QB with more physical talent than DM?
He attempted 40 passes vs. atm, OU, and tech.
Only Tech & ATM did he have over 40 attempts.
True, I looked at total stats...forgot about Webb's 3 attempts. Dylan only had 38.
Ohh, and Tuiasosopo did not play in a bowl game as a freshman. Pretty sure that's the case for Stoerner as well. Did Suggs even play in the bowl they went to his first season at GT?
First season in a new system.
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
You disagree?
It wasn't about disagreeing. It was about showing us who mastered their system. To you, it's a bowl game. I don't consider that mastering a system because a team with a great defense, good special teams and an OK offense can get to a bowl game.
That says nothing of the QB. But for you, that's how you get around trying to work at proving a point.
It's too late for me to go through every one...but we went over kingsbury and Henne...Dantzler and Streeter combined for over 3000 yards and went to a bowl with a D that gave up 330 yards/ game.
What point am I trying to make other than I wish we had a QB with more physical talent than DM?
Dantzler and Streeter also played in an ACC Conference that really wasn't that good and not against the best competition.
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Bowl games.
Each one.
You're pathetic.
You disagree?
It wasn't about disagreeing. It was about showing us who mastered their system. To you, it's a bowl game. I don't consider that mastering a system because a team with a great defense, good special teams and an OK offense can get to a bowl game.
That says nothing of the QB. But for you, that's how you get around trying to work at proving a point.
It's too late for me to go through every one...but we went over kingsbury and Henne...Dantzler and Streeter combined for over 3000 yards and went to a bowl with a D that gave up 330 yards/ game.
What point am I trying to make other than I wish we had a QB with more physical talent than DM?
Dantzler and Streeter also played in an ACC Conference that really wasn't that good and not against the best competition.
Bad competition makes it easier to win/compile good stats?
oh.
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I can see why now you didn't want to go over your names.
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Suggs just cracks me up. A.J. Suggs? Why not use Reggie Bush as the better example of success? Or, if you are really big on remembering Suggs, how about the QB that beat him out at Tennessee before he transfered to GT...Casey Clausen? He fits the requirements a lot better than Marques Tuiasosopo...who really played in one game for Washington his freshman year. Casey was undefeated before running into the K-State buzzsaw.
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I can see why now you didn't want to go over your names.
Lame.
Suggs just cracks me up. A.J. Suggs? Why not use Reggie Bush as the better example of success? Or, if you are really big on remembering Suggs, how about the QB that beat him out at Tennessee before he transfered to GT...Casey Clausen? He fits the requirements a lot better than Marques Tuiasosopo...who really played in one game for Washington his freshman year. Casey was undefeated before running into the K-State buzzsaw.
We aren't talking about true freshmen...we're talking about players in their first year in a new system. Washington went to a bowl under Tuiasasopo his senior year, which was also Neuheisel's first year. Heck, Mike Moschetti picked up Gary Barnett's new system well enough to go to a bowl in 99, too. Suggs led GaTech to a bowl in 2002, which was Chan Gailey's first season.
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Snyder's system had a lot more to it than Prince's does, and the decision making process is very different.
Bullcrap. If, as you've asserted, Snyder's system was far more complicated and Meier was able to master it sufficiently that Snyder put him on the field it's asinine to argue that he's having trouble because he's not able to master the far simpler system that's in place now. The part he's having trouble with is the part where he drops back, runs through his progression, and (most importantly) delivers a catchable ball. He seems to know the plays, he seems to locate receivers (the part he'd be having trouble with if, as you allege it was the new system that were responsible for his poor performance), but he's not able to consistently deliver catchable balls. Do you even watch football?
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Dantzler and Streeter also played in an ACC Conference that really wasn't that good and not against the best competition.
And Meier has played against: an FAU team that would piss down their leg looking at a good Kansas 5A HS squad and a couple of other cupcakes from about as far from the shining center of the college football universe as you can possibly get. If the QBs Rusty is discussing piled up stats because they were playing in an inferior major conference Meier should be throwing for 500+ YPG against the rubes we've been seeing this year.
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I don't see how this thread has gotten this long. Meier is a subpar/average QB. It seems as though the argument is whether KSU will make it to a bowl game inspite of Meier or whether KSU will make it to a bowl game because of our defense and special teams. Instead of trying to find examples of QB's that did well in a new system, how about we evaluate Meier's play within this system? Has the "system" really lead to the error in judgment or some awful throws Meier has made? It'd be one thing if receivers were consistently going one way while Meier was throwing another way, or if DM was having trouble getting us aligned or making an audible....these things aren't happening (which is a good thing). The errors DM is/has made aren't due to a "new system". He's just a marginal QB. If we make it to a bowl game, it'll be because of 2 things: our defense and our special teams. That isn't "not given DM credit" it's simply understanding that DM isn't going to go out and be a play maker with his arm, and quite honestly, he shouldn't be asked to.
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I don't see how this thread has gotten this long. Meier is a subpar/average QB. It seems as though the argument is whether KSU will make it to a bowl game inspite of Meier or whether KSU will make it to a bowl game because of our defense and special teams. Instead of trying to find examples of QB's that did well in a new system, how about we evaluate Meier's play within this system? Has the "system" really lead to the error in judgment or some awful throws Meier has made? It'd be one thing if receivers were consistently going one way while Meier was throwing another way, or if DM was having trouble getting us aligned or making an audible....these things aren't happening (which is a good thing). The errors DM is/has made aren't due to a "new system". He's just a marginal QB. If we make it to a bowl game, it'll be because of 2 things: our defense and our special teams. That isn't "not given DM credit" it's simply understanding that DM isn't going to go out and be a play maker with his arm, and quite honestly, he shouldn't be asked to.
Exactly.
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Holy crap.
Since when does Mj get to assign homework assignments for people and then not offer up any original research himself to back up any of his claims?
wtf.
nice work Rusty.
My feelings are kind of like what was expressed two posts up.
Dylan isn't a game breaker. He is Trent Dilfer. Our O need not turn it over, our D/ST will consistently keep us in/set up our O, we need to convert TD in RZ and stop settling for so many FG. We don't need to have 80 yrd TDs like we used to. Well, we may need to but we won't see that so just stop thinking about it. In short, I think about every intangible goes our way this year. We look like we can consistently win the TO battle, make smart game planning/in-game adjustments, have more passion on the sideline and do "the little things" to win games (assuming the flag fest saturday was an aberration) I think this formula will result in the following:
ville: 25% chance of victory
Baylor: 60% chance of victory
Ok St.: 80% chance of victory
Nebraska: 40% chance of victory
Missouri: 35% chance of victory
Iowa State: 45% chance of victory
Colorado: 55% chance of victory
Texas 20% chance of victory
ku: 50% chance of victory
I think we can get to 7 wins. I really do. I never imagined this after Illy State. &@#% optimism right in its ass.
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Dylan isn't a game breaker. He is Trent Dilfer. Our O need not turn it over, our D/ST will consistently keep us in/set up our O, we need to convert TD in RZ and stop settling for so many FG. We don't need to have 80 yrd TDs like we used to. Well, we may need to but we won't see that so just stop thinking about it. In short, I think about every intangible goes our way this year. We look like we can consistently win the TO battle, make smart game planning/in-game adjustments, have more passion on the sideline and do "the little things" to win games (assuming the flag fest saturday was an aberration)
Exactly.
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Dylan isn't Trent Dilfer, if he were we'd be thinking "Big XII Championship" right now rather than "we might win 6".
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Dylan isn't Trent Dilfer, if he were we'd be thinking "Big XII Championship" right now rather than "we might win 6".
Dude, give it up. This team just isn't that good. So far we've exceeded expectations, the defense and special teams have been pleasant surprises and we might actually have a shot at beating Lousieville.
Why the &@#% are you so worried about Meier? He is what he is, there is not a good reason to run Freeman out there IMHO and I don't really see what the other options are. I guess we could dissect and debate exactly how good he is, but what's the &@#%ing point? There is literally NO alternative.
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My point remains on Suggs.
Dude was such a *master* of the Georgia Tech offense he went 2-7 in that bowl game he *led* them to (completely forgeting DeMarcus Bilbo are we?) and was being lauded by the Georgia Tech media mid-season.
http://chronicle.augusta.com/stories/092802/gat_124-5186.shtml
Clearly, he was lighting it up! With a peformance like that I would be surprised if, back then I would have asked you, you would have called him subpar/average. Now you're lauding him? LOL!
But keep changing your claim and sooner or later I'm sure it will all work out. You've produced names for, what, 10 QBs in the last 9 years?
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My point remains on Suggs.
Dude was such a *master* of the Georgia Tech offense he wen't 2-7 in that bowl game he *led* them to (completely forgeting DeMarcus Bilbo are we?) and was being lauded by the Georgia Tech media.
http://chronicle.augusta.com/stories/092802/gat_124-5186.shtml
Clearly, he was lighting it up! With a peformance like that I would be surprised if, back then I would have asked you, you would have called him subpar/average. Now you're lauding him? LOL!
But keep changing your claim and sooner or later I'm sure it will all work out. You've produced names for, what, 10 QBs in the last 9 years?
Take of Suggs, then. Focus on Moschetti, who led CU to 62 points in his bowl game in his first year under Barnett. Or Heupel. Or Rivers. Or Streeter. Or Leak.
What are you arguing, anyway?
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You'll do just about anything to talk up anyone else, but always find a way to talk down Dylan Meier.
A.J. Suggs. LOL! You proudly put him on the list. Why the change now?
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You'll do just about anything to talk up anyone else, but always find a way to talk down Dylan Meier.
So...what are you arguing? I am arguing that it's possible for QB's to perform well in their first year in a new system. I think I've provided enough examples to pretty much prove that it happens quite a bit.
A.J. Suggs. LOL! You proudly put him on the list. Why the change now?
He was a bad example. I was wrong about him. I should have used Jeff Smoker (Michigan St.) or Derek Anderson (4000 yards at Oregon St.)
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Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
Zac Taylor
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Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
Zac Taylor
Cory Ross scored a rushing TD.
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Dylan Meier is on par with Brian Kavannah, K-State 96. Meier was probably a notch above pre-injury, but that seems to be about what he is now. In fact, this team looks like it could be a lot like that one (though the defense for that team was better), that team just had the fortune of playing in a pretty bad league and no opponents of Louisville's caliber in the OOC. If Meier can have a season on par with what Kavannah did that year and we can continue to get solid defense and special teams play, we'll go bowling.
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Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
Zac Taylor
Cory Ross scored a rushing TD.
Yes, he did. Is this what you consider "leading a team to an offensive touchdown?" Or do you just not want to lose the argument?
1st and 10 at UM 30 Ron Whitcomb sacked by Jay Moore and Bo Ruud at the MMA 24 for a loss of 6 yards. 0 3
2nd and 16 at UM 24 MAINE PENALTY 5 yard delay of game ACCEPTED.
2nd and 21 at UM 19 Ron Whitcomb sacked by Ty Steinkuhler and Kevin Smith at the MMA 10 for a loss of 9 yards.
3rd and 30 at UM 10 Timeout NEBRASKA, clock 03:55.
3rd and 30 at UM 10 Chris Legree rush for 3 yards to the MMA 13.
4th and 27 at UM 13 Rocco Navarro punt for 50 yards, returned by Terrence Nunn for 62 yards to the MMA 1.
DRIVE TOTALS: Maine drive: 3 plays -17 yards, 01:31 Maine PUNT
Nebraska at 2:46 UM NEB
1st and Goal at UM 1 Cory Ross rush for 1 yard for a TOUCHDOWN. 0 9
Jordan Congdon extra point MISSED.
Jordan Congdon kickoff for 50 yards returned by Arel Gordon for no gain to the MMA 15.
If Yamon would have stepped out at the one I guess you would be quite pleased with Meier's performance.
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Dylan Meier is on par with Brian Kavannah, K-State 96. Meier was probably a notch above pre-injury, but that seems to be about what he is now. In fact, this team looks like it could be a lot like that one (though the defense for that team was better), that team just had the fortune of playing in a pretty bad league and no opponents of Louisville's caliber in the OOC. If Meier can have a season on par with what Kavannah did that year and we can continue to get solid defense and special teams play, we'll go bowling.
Honesty, I hate it when people say the conference sucked when we were going 6-2 in league play year after year
Hell, CU and NU were two top 10 teams. BYU finished in the top 5. AtM wasn't bad either.
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Can anyone name a QB that failed to lead his team to an offensive touchdown against a I-AA opponent and led his team to a bowl game?
Zac Taylor
Cory Ross scored a rushing TD.
Yes, he did. Is this what you consider "leading a team to an offensive touchdown?" Or do you just not want to lose the argument?
1st and 10 at UM 30 Ron Whitcomb sacked by Jay Moore and Bo Ruud at the MMA 24 for a loss of 6 yards. 0 3
2nd and 16 at UM 24 MAINE PENALTY 5 yard delay of game ACCEPTED.
2nd and 21 at UM 19 Ron Whitcomb sacked by Ty Steinkuhler and Kevin Smith at the MMA 10 for a loss of 9 yards.
3rd and 30 at UM 10 Timeout NEBRASKA, clock 03:55.
3rd and 30 at UM 10 Chris Legree rush for 3 yards to the MMA 13.
4th and 27 at UM 13 Rocco Navarro punt for 50 yards, returned by Terrence Nunn for 62 yards to the MMA 1.
DRIVE TOTALS: Maine drive: 3 plays -17 yards, 01:31 Maine PUNT
Nebraska at 2:46 UM NEB
1st and Goal at UM 1 Cory Ross rush for 1 yard for a TOUCHDOWN. 0 9
Jordan Congdon extra point MISSED.
Jordan Congdon kickoff for 50 yards returned by Arel Gordon for no gain to the MMA 15.
You win. Congrats.
EDIT: j/k. You don't win. Taylor was an exception. How many others did the same thing?
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Dylan isn't Trent Dilfer, if he were we'd be thinking "Big XII Championship" right now rather than "we might win 6".
Dude, give it up. This team just isn't that good. So far we've exceeded expectations, the defense and special teams have been pleasant surprises and we might actually have a shot at beating Lousieville.
Why the &*$@! are you so worried about Meier? He is what he is, there is not a good reason to run Freeman out there IMHO and I don't really see what the other options are. I guess we could dissect and debate exactly how good he is, but what's the &*$@!ing point? There is literally NO alternative.
The Meier situation is frustrating precisely because the rest of the team has looked pretty decent. If we had a decent quarterback, we would be a much better team. Meier is a serious weak link. Why not bitch about it? That there is no alternative to Meier just gives us even more reason to bitch.
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You win. Congrats.
EDIT: j/k. You don't win. Taylor was an exception.
I was so close.
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Meier is a decent QB.
Chum, how would you rate the big 12 qbs?
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The Meier situation is frustrating precisely because the rest of the team has looked pretty decent. If we had a decent quarterback, we would be a much better team. Meier is a serious weak link. Why not bitch about it? That there is no alternative to Meier just gives us even more reason to bitch.
Do you understand that we have played three games against teams that are supposed to have inferior talent and we have rushed (as a team) for more than 100 yards exactly one time?
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Meier is a decent QB.
Chum, how would you rate the big 12 qbs?
I don't have a clue how the conference QBs should be rated. There are a lot of bad ones. That's for sure. It's also very frustrating not to be good in a league that is so lousy.
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Meier is a decent QB.
Chum, how would you rate the big 12 qbs?
I don't have a clue how the conference QBs should be rated. There are a lot of bad ones. That's for sure. It's also very frustrating not to be good in a league that is so lousy.
Thanks. :blank:
Look at other quarterbacks, Meier is "decent" compared to them.
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Do you understand that we have played three games against teams that are supposed to have inferior talent and we have rushed (as a team) for more than 100 yards exactly one time?
Another indictment of Meier. The pass should set up the run.
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Meier is a decent QB.
Chum, how would you rate the big 12 qbs?
I don't have a clue how the conference QBs should be rated. There are a lot of bad ones. That's for sure. It's also very frustrating not to be good in a league that is so lousy.
Thanks. :blank:
Look at other quarterbacks, Meier is "decent" compared to them.
PASS EFFICIENCY Team Cl G Att Cmp Int Pct. Yds TD Eff.
------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Reid,Bobby.......... OSU SO 3 51 28 3 54.9 518 7 173.7
2. Taylor, Zac......... NU SR 3 72 49 1 68.1 604 7 167.8
3. McCoy, Colt......... UT FR 3 59 38 1 64.4 456 6 159.5
4. McGee, Stephen...... TAMU SO 3 62 43 0 69.4 502 3 153.3
5. Daniel, Chase....... MU SO 3 108 72 1 66.7 762 7 145.5
6. Thompson, Paul...... OU SR 3 80 48 3 60.0 673 5 143.8
7. Meyer,Bret.......... ISU JR 3 77 46 1 59.7 589 3 134.3
8. Harrell, Graham..... TTU SO 3 148 97 2 65.5 922 7 130.8
9. Bell, Shawn......... BU SR 3 136 87 4 64.0 830 6 123.9
10.Meier, Dylan........ KSU SR 3 81 44 3 54.3 544 3 115.6
I think saying Dylan is the 10th best starting QB in the B12 is fair.
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Meier is a decent QB.
Chum, how would you rate the big 12 qbs?
I don't have a clue how the conference QBs should be rated. There are a lot of bad ones. That's for sure. It's also very frustrating not to be good in a league that is so lousy.
Thanks. :blank:
Look at other quarterbacks, Meier is "decent" compared to them.
I wasn't speaking in terms relative to the horrible Big XII conference. I don't care if all of the conference QBs suck. I want ours to be good.
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Belch. That is pretty bad
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Fatty, good point about 96. The big thing is that I don't think there are as many "gimmees" now as there were then though. ku, ISU, MU, and OSU were all pretty dreadful that year; all probably worse than any Big 12 team this year, and Cinci and Rice were probably both worse than Marshall. Tech and aTm were pretty decent, and NU and CU were very good teams. I do think this year's team could've made a run at 9-2 with that schedule though, and I think 7-5 is the ceiling for our current schedule.
Again, I don't think this year's defense was on par with that one, but I do think offensively and special teams wise these teams are pretty close.
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Dylan Meier is on par with Brian Kavannah, K-State 96. Meier was probably a notch above pre-injury, but that seems to be about what he is now. In fact, this team looks like it could be a lot like that one (though the defense for that team was better), that team just had the fortune of playing in a pretty bad league and no opponents of Louisville's caliber in the OOC. If Meier can have a season on par with what Kavannah did that year and we can continue to get solid defense and special teams play, we'll go bowling.
I tried making the Kav comparison in another thread. I think it's pretty spot on.
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Do you understand that we have played three games against teams that are supposed to have inferior talent and we have rushed (as a team) for more than 100 yards exactly one time?
Another indictment of Meier. The pass should set up the run.
We should be able to line up a twelve year old at QB and run for at least 100 yards against I-AA opponents.
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Rushing offense - 9th:
RUSHING OFFENSE G Att Yds Avg TD Yds/G
--------------------------------------------------------
1. Texas............... 3 118 714 6.1 7 238.0
2. Texas A&M........... 3 125 671 5.4 12 223.7
Missouri............ 3 122 671 5.5 6 223.7
4. Oklahoma State...... 3 128 647 5.1 9 215.7
5. Nebraska............ 3 134 581 4.3 8 193.7
6. Oklahoma............ 3 107 531 5.0 5 177.0
7. Kansas.............. 3 111 518 4.7 6 172.7
8. Iowa State.......... 3 114 467 4.1 7 155.7
9. Kansas State........ 3 85 364 4.3 4 121.3
10.Colorado............ 3 109 314 2.9 2 104.7
11.Texas Tech.......... 3 56 279 5.0 2 93.0
12.Baylor.............. 3 42 57 1.4 0 19.0
YPC isn't that bad.
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Do you understand that we have played three games against teams that are supposed to have inferior talent and we have rushed (as a team) for more than 100 yards exactly one time?
Another indictment of Meier. The pass should set up the run.
We should be able to line up a twelve year old at QB and run for at least 100 yards against I-AA opponents.
I agree. Our running game has the capacity to improve. How many should we be able to throw for against a I-AA opponent? Will Meier ever be the guy to do that?
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I can't believe you all are arguing over Meier's mediocrity.
I want our QB to be good too, but if Meier played every game the way he played the last two, it'd be perfectly fine in my book. What I'm really upset with is the running game. It was non existant. We have crappy blocking from the O-line and T-gun goes down too easily. He never breaks free, but can occasionally power his way to an extra yard or two. He's more like a fullback, IMO.
The blame belongs to our O-line. But it'd be nice if we had a back who could break some tackles and get free more than once a game too.
Dylan is improving from game to game. He overthrew the passes at the marshall game - but at least he wasn't overthrowing them. What this says to me is he has recognized that he was underthrowing and put a little extra force behind his throws to make sure he didn't do that anymore. Unfortunately, he was putting too much behind them at the Marshall game. He needs to tone it down. But at least he recognized that change was needed in how he was throwing the ball and is improving.
I'm still pissed at our line for their crappy runblocking, and our backs for never being able to get ANYTHING more than 2 yards. We HAVE to have a running game for our offense to be succesful.
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Rushing offense - 9th:
RUSHING OFFENSE G Att Yds Avg TD Yds/G
--------------------------------------------------------
1. Texas............... 3 118 714 6.1 7 238.0
2. Texas A&M........... 3 125 671 5.4 12 223.7
Missouri............ 3 122 671 5.5 6 223.7
4. Oklahoma State...... 3 128 647 5.1 9 215.7
5. Nebraska............ 3 134 581 4.3 8 193.7
6. Oklahoma............ 3 107 531 5.0 5 177.0
7. Kansas.............. 3 111 518 4.7 6 172.7
8. Iowa State.......... 3 114 467 4.1 7 155.7
9. Kansas State........ 3 85 364 4.3 4 121.3
10.Colorado............ 3 109 314 2.9 2 104.7
11.Texas Tech.......... 3 56 279 5.0 2 93.0
12.Baylor.............. 3 42 57 1.4 0 19.0
YPC isn't that bad.
Considering that the only teams we are ahead of use the spread offense? That's horrible.
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I can't believe you all are arguing over Meier's mediocrity.
I want our QB to be good too, but if Meier played every game the way he played the last two, it'd be perfectly fine in my book. What I'm really upset with is the running game. It was non existant. We have crappy blocking from the O-line and T-gun goes down too easily. He never breaks free, but can occasionally power his way to an extra yard or two. He's more like a fullback, IMO.
The blame belongs to our O-line. But it'd be nice if we had a back who could break some tackles and get free more than once a game too.
Dylan is improving from game to game. He overthrew the passes at the marshall game - but at least he wasn't overthrowing them. What this says to me is he has recognized that he was underthrowing and put a little extra force behind his throws to make sure he didn't do that anymore. Unfortunately, he was putting too much behind them at the Marshall game. He needs to tone it down. But at least he recognized that change was needed in how he was throwing the ball and is improving.
I'm still pissed at our line for their crappy runblocking, and our backs for never being able to get ANYTHING more than 2 yards. We HAVE to have a running game for our offense to be succesful.
We're 11th in pass efficiency...9th in rushing. Also 9th in YPC.
Rushing offense - 9th:
RUSHING OFFENSE G Att Yds Avg TD Yds/G
--------------------------------------------------------
1. Texas............... 3 118 714 6.1 7 238.0
2. Texas A&M........... 3 125 671 5.4 12 223.7
Missouri............ 3 122 671 5.5 6 223.7
4. Oklahoma State...... 3 128 647 5.1 9 215.7
5. Nebraska............ 3 134 581 4.3 8 193.7
6. Oklahoma............ 3 107 531 5.0 5 177.0
7. Kansas.............. 3 111 518 4.7 6 172.7
8. Iowa State.......... 3 114 467 4.1 7 155.7
9. Kansas State........ 3 85 364 4.3 4 121.3
10.Colorado............ 3 109 314 2.9 2 104.7
11.Texas Tech.......... 3 56 279 5.0 2 93.0
12.Baylor.............. 3 42 57 1.4 0 19.0
YPC isn't that bad.
Considering that the only teams we are ahead of use the spread offense? That's horrible.
4.3 YPC is not horrible.