The Royals

[millertime]

How much time between salvy giving the signal and the pitch being delivered? It just seems unfeasible to relay the signal effectively without a guy at second.

With nobody on base, there wouldn't be much time but the hitter could still peek up there when the pitcher is early in his windup. If the pitcher is in the stretch, there is plenty of time to relay.

Like some dude in centerfield?  It just seems like something that would be overtly obvious to everyone on the field where the hitter was.looking.   and also obvious if someone in the crowd was making signals

Possibly, There's many ways to do it. When I was coaching a high school team one summer, I could see signs from every single catcher from coaching first or third base. Occasionally I'd tell my team that if I said their number when they were in the box they were getting an offspeed pitch. It was almost too easy so I didn't do it often.

[steve dave]

usually it would be like a guy in center field who would take his hat off if a fastball is coming and that's the only sign. not like signalling every type of pitch and location. I mean, knowing a fastball is coming is a big advantage against a lot of pitchers (not the ones that only throw 100 mph fastballs every pitch but normal pitchers with good change ups and breaking stuff). it wouldn't take much time at all to signal that. or like a hotel across the street would pull the blinds back for a fastball or something. they aren't relaying high amounts of information. from second base it would be easier to signal multiple pitches quickly and easily.

[Phil Titola]

I think its fine if your own player is catching signs... But if they are deploying "fans" in the stands to do this, that's over the line.

[WildcatNkilt]

MLB should allow earpieces for the pitcher and catcher.  That would fix all signal stealing problems.  (I do realize the batter could possibly hear the catcher) 

[sys]

if you read the story on when toronto was busted for the signaling a few years back, it was a guy dressed in white stationed in the centerfield stands positioned to be directly over the pitcher's head from the batter's perspective.  he'd stand up and raise his hands on fastballs.  so the batter didn't even have to move his eyes from the pitcher, much less move his head.

[TownieCat]

CF3, get in here in clean this up. This isn't the Tornoto Blue Jays Sign Stealing Thread.

[TownieCat]

[Asteriskhead]

I'd rather focus on how big of an idiot Gregg Zaun is, how he shouldn't have a job as a media personality because he's an old, dumb, fat, racist eff, and how I'd really like to kick his ass from in front of the George Brett statue at the K all the way down I-70 to Legends so he can broadcast T-Bones' games.

[Cartierfor3]

The Blue Jays are basically the Raiders of baseball and everyone knows it. Gregg Zaun is just a meathead. He would've ended up a small town cop if not for baseball, and I'm sure he's the type of Dad who tells his kids to not back down from fights and is probably a very road raged driver. I don't take his comments too seriously, and neither should anyone else. He hadn't crossed my mind in like 10 years. He was a forgettable average backup catcher. Who cares what he thinks?

As for the sign stealing, its already been weighed in on plenty, including analysis from our high level baseball insider WackyCat08. My take is this: Having some dude wave his arms to signal pitches from the stands, is unethical, and the Blue Jays know it. Its different than stealing signs from 2nd IMO. If they are doing that, then MLB should take action and punish/fine/suspend the manager.

/signstealing

[Asteriskhead]

The Blue Jays are basically the Raiders of baseball and everyone knows it. Gregg Zaun is just a meathead. He would've ended up a small town cop if not for baseball, and I'm sure he's the type of Dad who tells his kids to not back down from fights and is probably a very road raged driver. I don't take his comments too seriously, and neither should anyone else. He hadn't crossed my mind in like 10 years. He was a forgettable average backup catcher. Who cares what he thinks?

As for the sign stealing, its already been weighed in on plenty, including analysis from our high level baseball insider WackyCat08. My take is this: Having some dude wave his arms to signal pitches from the stands, is unethical, and the Blue Jays know it. Its different than stealing signs from 2nd IMO. If they are doing that, then MLB should take action and punish/fine/suspend the manager.

/signstealing

the vast majority of us disagree with his sentiments, but allowing him to spout off his bullshit without reproach only reinforces that type of behavior and thought process for that small, but vocal and idiotic minority. Certainly, Yordano shouldn't have taken to social media to voice his displeasure with Bautista, but you know damn well that Zaun wouldn't have felt the need to say those sort of things on television about/to a white ballplayer. Not discussing this type of bullshit only allows the institutional racism that exists within baseball to perpetuate.

[Cartierfor3]

The Blue Jays are basically the Raiders of baseball and everyone knows it. Gregg Zaun is just a meathead. He would've ended up a small town cop if not for baseball, and I'm sure he's the type of Dad who tells his kids to not back down from fights and is probably a very road raged driver. I don't take his comments too seriously, and neither should anyone else. He hadn't crossed my mind in like 10 years. He was a forgettable average backup catcher. Who cares what he thinks?

As for the sign stealing, its already been weighed in on plenty, including analysis from our high level baseball insider WackyCat08. My take is this: Having some dude wave his arms to signal pitches from the stands, is unethical, and the Blue Jays know it. Its different than stealing signs from 2nd IMO. If they are doing that, then MLB should take action and punish/fine/suspend the manager.

/signstealing

the vast majority of us disagree with his sentiments, but allowing him to spout off his bullshit without reproach only reinforces that type of behavior and thought process for that small, but vocal and idiotic minority. Certainly, Yordano shouldn't have taken to social media to voice his displeasure with Bautista, but you know damn well that Zaun wouldn't have felt the need to say those sort of things on television about/to a white ballplayer. Not discussing this type of bullshit only allows the institutional racism that exists within baseball to perpetuate.

He was defending another guy from the Dominican roidhead. He might be a racist, I have no idea, but nothing he said IMO was racially charged.

[Asteriskhead]

The Blue Jays are basically the Raiders of baseball and everyone knows it. Gregg Zaun is just a meathead. He would've ended up a small town cop if not for baseball, and I'm sure he's the type of Dad who tells his kids to not back down from fights and is probably a very road raged driver. I don't take his comments too seriously, and neither should anyone else. He hadn't crossed my mind in like 10 years. He was a forgettable average backup catcher. Who cares what he thinks?

As for the sign stealing, its already been weighed in on plenty, including analysis from our high level baseball insider WackyCat08. My take is this: Having some dude wave his arms to signal pitches from the stands, is unethical, and the Blue Jays know it. Its different than stealing signs from 2nd IMO. If they are doing that, then MLB should take action and punish/fine/suspend the manager.

/signstealing

the vast majority of us disagree with his sentiments, but allowing him to spout off his bullshit without reproach only reinforces that type of behavior and thought process for that small, but vocal and idiotic minority. Certainly, Yordano shouldn't have taken to social media to voice his displeasure with Bautista, but you know damn well that Zaun wouldn't have felt the need to say those sort of things on television about/to a white ballplayer. Not discussing this type of bullshit only allows the institutional racism that exists within baseball to perpetuate.

He was defending another guy from the Dominican roidhead. He might be a racist, I have no idea, but nothing he said IMO was racially charged.

He was talking down to a black ballplayer for not having what he thought was proper tact. It is fairly easy to say racially charged things without using slurs. His tirade's entire purpose was to put the uppity black ballplayer back in his place.

[8manpick]

That seems to be reading way more into it than necessary. Seemed like a veteran ball player putting a young ball player back in his place to me.

[Asteriskhead]

I don't think he uses that platform to reprimand a white ballplayer in such a manner. You guys are entitled to your opinions.

[kso_FAN]

That seems to be reading way more into it than necessary. Seemed like a veteran ball player putting a young ball player back in his place to me.

Yeah, Zaun just went over the top by basically challenging Yordano to a fight.

[WildcatNkilt]

That seems to be reading way more into it than necessary. Seemed like a veteran ball player putting a young ball player back in his place to me.

Yeah, Zaun just went over the top by basically challenging Yordano to a fight.

In a WWE kind of way.

[kso_FAN]

Meh, Zaun seems like a typical color guy for a baseball network; white journeyman player who says crazy stuff a lot. See Hud.

[Asteriskhead]

Meh, Zaun seems like a typical color guy for a baseball network; white journeyman player who says crazy stuff a lot. See Hud.

There's a substantial difference between Hud's dumbassery and Zaun's behavior. That's a disingenuous comparison.

[Dr Rick Daris]

somebody on the radio said it this morning and it's a pretty good comparo. zaun is basically afflecks character from dazed and confused.

[kso_FAN]

BTW, I love Hud. I don't think Hud would go as far as Zaun, but they are more similar than different. JMHO.

[TownieCat]

We need a bounce back start from Dick tonight to calm the waters and refocus everyone on the rest of the season. WGAF about Greggg Zaun...

[kso_FAN]

https://twitter.com/mlb/status/628644151337181184

[joda]

Twitter right now

[8manpick]

Holy crap the Detroit KatKids fired their GM after all those trades last week

[TownieCat]

Zobz batting 2nd, Moose batting 6th