The Royals

[The Big Train]

I don't really want to argue about this all night, so I'll leave this here. Not much has research has been done on the subject, because it hasn't been tried out much over the years. The little data that is available suggests it's more likely to work than not.

http://www.billjamesonline.com/article1136/

i didnt read much of that but you do realize other than the nick swisher trial all of that happened over 25 years ago?  baseball isnt the same today as it was then.  im not trying to put you down im just saying willingham doesnt produce as many runs as he used to power wise, and you also confirmed that, so why would you put a guy who doesnt have much for power numbers anymore at leadoff?

hes 35, i would much rather he just try and drive people in than be the guy we have the most confidence to get on base.  you know why speed matters?  because the leadoff guy gets a single, then there is a ball down the right field line, a guy with speed has the potential to score, a power hitter/run producer doesnt.  now bo jackson is the exception to the rule but we will only ever see one bo jackson.  so speed does matter and a 35 year old should not be a leadoff

[bones129]

I don't really want to argue about this all night, so I'll leave this here. Not much has research has been done on the subject, because it hasn't been tried out much over the years. The little data that is available suggests it's more likely to work than not.

http://www.billjamesonline.com/article1136/

i didnt read much of that but you do realize other than the nick swisher trial all of that happened over 25 years ago?  baseball isnt the same today as it was then.  im not trying to put you down im just saying willingham doesnt produce as many runs as he used to power wise, and you also confirmed that, so why would you put a guy who doesnt have much for power numbers anymore at leadoff?

hes 35, i would much rather he just try and drive people in than be the guy we have the most confidence to get on base.  you know why speed matters?  because the leadoff guy gets a single, then there is a ball down the right field line, a guy with speed has the potential to score, a power hitter/run producer doesnt.  now bo jackson is the exception to the rule but we will only ever see one bo jackson.  so speed does matter and a 35 year old should not be a leadoff

TBT makes a good point about speed. Not only does a fast leadoff hitter have potential to score on a hit down the lines, he also has the potential to steal second (third, also) without the need for a sac bunt which gives up an out. I think the ideal leadoff hitter has to be a contact hitter, have plate discipline day-in and day-out, and good speed.

[ksupamplemousse]

So is hitting 1 run lead off HR's, guys with power should not be lead-offs

it would be a complete waste of a potential RBI producer having him be a leadoff, which is why batting Alex leadoff like they did the last couple years is also stupid

willingham doesnt produce as many runs as he used to power wise, and you also confirmed that, so why would you put a guy who doesnt have much for power numbers anymore at leadoff?

Your first argument and your reiteration of that argument was that Josh Willingham is a power hitting run producer, and his power would be wasted since nobody was on base. Your second argument is that Josh Willingham is no longer a power hitter, and that if a player doesn't put up power numbers then he shouldn't be hitting leadoff. Either I have a reading comprehension problem, or you're terribly confused.

[The Big Train]

So is hitting 1 run lead off HR's, guys with power should not be lead-offs

it would be a complete waste of a potential RBI producer having him be a leadoff, which is why batting Alex leadoff like they did the last couple years is also stupid

willingham doesnt produce as many runs as he used to power wise, and you also confirmed that, so why would you put a guy who doesnt have much for power numbers anymore at leadoff?

Your first argument and your reiteration of that argument was that Josh Willingham is a power hitting run producer, and his power would be wasted since nobody was on base. Your second argument is that Josh Willingham is no longer a power hitter, and that if a player doesn't put up power numbers then he shouldn't be hitting leadoff. Either I have a reading comprehension problem, or you're terribly confused.

you are basically telling me that we should put Mike Piazza as our leadoff, nobody put Mike Piazza as their leadoff at the tail end of his career

[Kat Kid]

Guys I just sung along with Don't Stop Believing. And liked it. A lot.

Is that what won to replace Friends in Low Places?  That is almost as bad as taking Sweet Caroline.  That is played at every Tigers game.  You guys know it references Detroit, right?

[bones129]

We want to be Division Champions. That said, getting into the playoffs is the threshold goal. Because Detroit and Oakland won tonight, we're tied with the A's in the WC. Seattle is a game back.

[kim carnes]

Alright, this has gone far enough, I am going to fight kat kid

[bones129]

Alright, this has gone far enough, I am going to fight kat kid

 

[ksupamplemousse]

So is hitting 1 run lead off HR's, guys with power should not be lead-offs

it would be a complete waste of a potential RBI producer having him be a leadoff, which is why batting Alex leadoff like they did the last couple years is also stupid

willingham doesnt produce as many runs as he used to power wise, and you also confirmed that, so why would you put a guy who doesnt have much for power numbers anymore at leadoff?

Your first argument and your reiteration of that argument was that Josh Willingham is a power hitting run producer, and his power would be wasted since nobody was on base. Your second argument is that Josh Willingham is no longer a power hitter, and that if a player doesn't put up power numbers then he shouldn't be hitting leadoff. Either I have a reading comprehension problem, or you're terribly confused.

you are basically telling me that we should put Mike Piazza as our leadoff, nobody put Mike Piazza as their leadoff at the tail end of his career

We already know that not many slower guys have been leadoff hitters in their careers, saying that one particular slow guy wasn't a leadoff hitter doesn't do much to prove your point. I'm done with this for the evening though. I already ran the numbers, Willingham wouldn't have provided a net benefit this year most likely, even if he would have taken all of Aoki's ABs in the leadoff spot (he also wouldn't have hurt the offense either). The leadoff hitter in my dream lineup would not have been a difference maker, I was just hoping that this debate would generate more in-depth analysis than "leadoff guys should be fast" and "you can't hit 2 run homers with nobody on base".

[Dr Rick Daris]

Alright, this has gone far enough, I am going to fight kat kid

the very next time i see him i will punch him as hard as i can twice. once for me and a second time for you. i have half a mind to walk over to his house right now.

[kso_FAN]

Guys I just sung along with Don't Stop Believing. And liked it. A lot.

Is that what won to replace Friends in Low Places?  That is almost as bad as taking Sweet Caroline.  That is played at every Tigers game.  You guys know it references Detroit, right?

Yes, they change the lyrics on the screen to "we're going to beat Detroit".

[star seed 7]

 

[bones129]

So, k-p-m said The leadoff hitter in my dream lineup would not have been a difference maker,

Guess that's all I need to know. Guess leadoff hitters are meaningless.

[Kat Kid]

Guys I just sung along with Don't Stop Believing. And liked it. A lot.

Is that what won to replace Friends in Low Places?  That is almost as bad as taking Sweet Caroline.  That is played at every Tigers game.  You guys know it references Detroit, right?

Yes, they change the lyrics on the screen to "we're going to beat Detroit".

That is more embarrassing than friends in low places.  As a Kstate fan I embrace Harley Day and have become proud of the house we've built.  If we started playing playing jump around every 4th quarter it would be lame.

[ksupamplemousse]

So, k-p-m said The leadoff hitter in my dream lineup would not have been a difference maker,

Guess that's all I need to know. Guess leadoff hitters are meaningless.

No, the Royals just don't have any good hitters (sarcasm...kinda).

[kim carnes]

Take it somewhere else you clowns

[bones129]

Take it somewhere else you clowns

wut

[bones129]

We win Sunday. Good night, all.

[TownieCat]

It's a great day to retake first place...

[Kat Kid]

Am attending Friday and Saturday with Tigers hat and what is left of my sports emotions from Thursday night.

[8manpick]

Will take. eff, might as well mix it up at this point, unless you want to score 2 again

[Phil Titola]

Playoff chase baseball is a lot of emotional work.  Effing Cleveland.

[kso_FAN]

Playoff chase baseball is a lot of emotional work.  Effing Cleveland.

I haven't followed a lot of playoff baseball, but 25+ years of being a sports fan has taught me that when you put yourself in position to rely on other teams winning, it often turns out badly.

[Phil Titola]

Playoff chase baseball is a lot of emotional work.  Effing Cleveland.

I haven't followed a lot of playoff baseball, but 25+ years of being a sports fan has taught me that when you put yourself in position to rely on other teams winning, it often turns out badly.

right, I more mean the daily grind.  In football and basketball, at least you have some off days.  I'm not really expecting Cleveland to do much for us....thats next weekend fun.

[j-dub]

so long as we keep winning 2 out of 3 in our non-detroit series. and take 2, if not 3 from detroit head to head - we will win the division.

i know that's obvious, but we really do control our own destiny. beat detroit and don't give up ground in the other series, and we got this.