Let's talk about Elon Musk

[DQ12]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

[steve dave]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I think all extremely nationalistic cultures are evil

[wetwillie]

USA! USA!

[Rage Against the McKee]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I heard someone call a Tesla a swasticar today and that made me chuckle.

[Pete]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I think all extremely nationalistic cultures are evil

Some of the super nationalistic cultures never have a chance to cross the line into bad stuff, just due to fortunate circumstances. Bermuda seems pretty nationalistic. They wouldn’t even let Oprah buy a house there because here parents weren’t Bermudian, and I a dude I worked with married a gal from Bermuda had a kid and when they got divorced they kicked his ass out of the country.

[Pete]

I don't know if you all watched the full clip but he also talked about the importance of "German values and culture" and the danger of losing that through "multiculturalism that dilutes everything". He stopped himself just short of keeping the bloodline clean.

The "we shouldn't feel guilty for sins of, oddly specifically, our parents and grandparents and great-grandparents" was also bad, but felt less specifically tied to Nazi ideology.

What sins do you suppose were committed by the grandparents and great-grandparents of the German people? Were they bad about leaving the water running when they brushed their teeth?

Point taken.

However, I wonder if you dudes have ever attributed any positives to the culture of Germany? I sure have.

Is it your opinion that positive cultural attributes are eternal and immutable?

Pete is turning into affable dax ...

I reject your labels! I’m probably still more liberal on many things than SD or Limestone, for example. I have made the decision to order off of the ala cart menu instead of the offered combo meals.

[chum1]

Seems like a good synopsis to me

Dr. Philip Low  3rd+
Chairman, CEO & Founder, NeuroVigil; iBrain Inventor; Cambridge Declaration on Consciousness Author.

4d  Edited
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I have known Elon Musk at a deep level for 14 years, well before he was a household name. We used to text frequently. He would come to my birthday party and invite me to his parties. He would tell me everything about his women problems. As sons of highly accomplished men who married venuses, were violent and lost their fortunes, and who were bullied in high school, we had a number of things in common most people cannot relate to. We would hang out together late in Los Angeles. He would visit my San Diego lab. He invested in my company.

Elon is not a Nazi, per se.

He is something much better, or much worse, depending on how you look at it.

Nazis believed that an entire race was above everyone else.

Elon believes he is above everyone else. He used to think he worked on the most important problems. When I met him, he did not presume to be a technical person — he would be the first to say that he lacked the expertise to understand certain data. That happened later. Now, he believes he has all the solutions.

All his talk about getting to Mars to “maintain the light of consciousness” or about “free speech absolutism” is actually BS Elon knowingly feeds people to manipulate them. Everything Elon does is about acquiring and consolidating power. That is why he likes far right parties, because they are easier to control. That is also why he gave himself $56 Billion which could have gone to the people actually doing the work and innovations he is taking credit for at Tesla. His lust for power is also why he did xAI and Neuralink, to attempt to compete with OpenAI and NeuroVigil, respectively, despite being affiliated with them. Unlike Tesla and Twitter, he was unable to conquer those companies and tried to create rivals. I fired him with cause in December 2021 when he tried to undermine NV.

Elon did two Nazi salutes.

He did them for five main reasons:

1. He was concerned that the “Nazi wing” of the MAGA movement, under the influence of Steve Bannon, would drive him away from Trump, somewhere in the Eisenhower Executive Office Building, rather than in the West Wing which is where he wants to be. He was already feeling raw over the fact that Trump did not follow his recommendation for Treasury Secretary and that the Senate also did not pick his first choice;

2. He was upset that he had had to go to Israel and Auschwitz to make up for agreeing with a Nazi sympathizer online and wanted to reclaim his “power” just like when he told advertisers to “go eff yourself”. This has nothing to do with Asperger’s;

3. There are some Jews he actually hates: Sam Altman is amongst them;

4. He enjoys a good thrill and knew exactly what he was doing;

5. His narcissistic self was hoping the audience would reflect his abject gesture back to him, thereby showing complete control and dominion over it, and increasing his leverage over Trump. That did not happen.

Bottom line: Elon is not a Nazi but he did give two Nazi Salutes, which is completely unacceptable.

[LickNeckey]

I would add that he has found support and addulation among the far right through twitter

the idea that his actions were not intended to pander to that base feels ridiculous

[DQ12]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

OK -- I think the culture that dominated Germany in the 1930s and 40s was evil.  I think that culture (distinct from modern day German culture) was evil.  If you want to lump all "German" culture together, you can, but I'm not doing that.  I'm talking specifically about cultures during specific periods in a specific place.  One is better than the other, in my view.  One is more evil than the other. 

If you reject morally loaded words like "good" and "evil," OK.  But if you can't say that "the culture that gave rise to the holocaust" is any better or worse, morally, than any other culture, then I'd say you have a very interesting world-view.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

OK -- I think the culture that dominated Germany in the 1930s and 40s was evil.  I think that culture (distinct from modern day German culture) was evil.  If you want to lump all "German" culture together, you can, but I'm not doing that.  I'm talking specifically about cultures during specific periods in a specific place.  One is better than the other, in my view.  One is more evil than the other. 

If you reject morally loaded words like "good" and "evil," OK.  But if you can't say that "the culture that gave rise to the holocaust" is any better or worse, morally, than any other culture, then I'd say you have a very interesting world-view.

I don't think any culture is any more or less susceptible to putting Nazis in charge than any other culture is.

[chum1]

I don't think any culture is any more or less susceptible to putting Nazis in charge than any other culture is.

Yeah, I feel like a lot of people foolishly assume that Nazi Germany couldn't happen here. That sort of thing is the simply the result of regular, old human behavior.

[nicname]

Some cultures, especially historically, are definitely evil. Most tbh.

[DQ12]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

OK -- I think the culture that dominated Germany in the 1930s and 40s was evil.  I think that culture (distinct from modern day German culture) was evil.  If you want to lump all "German" culture together, you can, but I'm not doing that.  I'm talking specifically about cultures during specific periods in a specific place.  One is better than the other, in my view.  One is more evil than the other. 

If you reject morally loaded words like "good" and "evil," OK.  But if you can't say that "the culture that gave rise to the holocaust" is any better or worse, morally, than any other culture, then I'd say you have a very interesting world-view.

I don't think any culture is any more or less susceptible to putting Nazis in charge than any other culture is.

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture.  If you're making a comment on "human nature," sure ("It could happen again here...if the culture changed someday.").  But if culture A promotes gas chambers or slavery or child sacrifice, I think that culture is morally/ethically worse than culture B, which doesn't do those things (and instead prioritizes other things, like improving infant mortality rates, and literacy, and art, for example).  I don't know how you could say that those two hypothetical cultures are morally equivalent. 

Again, if you reject the concepts of morality or ethics, then that's OK. I disagree, but whatever.

But if you do think some things are more ethical or moral than others, I don't know why you couldn't make the same judgments on particular cultures.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

OK -- I think the culture that dominated Germany in the 1930s and 40s was evil.  I think that culture (distinct from modern day German culture) was evil.  If you want to lump all "German" culture together, you can, but I'm not doing that.  I'm talking specifically about cultures during specific periods in a specific place.  One is better than the other, in my view.  One is more evil than the other. 

If you reject morally loaded words like "good" and "evil," OK.  But if you can't say that "the culture that gave rise to the holocaust" is any better or worse, morally, than any other culture, then I'd say you have a very interesting world-view.

I don't think any culture is any more or less susceptible to putting Nazis in charge than any other culture is.

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture.  If you're making a comment on "human nature," sure ("It could happen again here...if the culture changed someday.").  But if culture A promotes gas chambers or slavery or child sacrifice, I think that culture is morally/ethically worse than culture B, which doesn't do those things (and instead prioritizes other things, like improving infant mortality rates, and literacy, and art, for example).  I don't know how you could say that those two hypothetical cultures are morally equivalent. 

Again, if you reject the concepts of morality or ethics, then that's OK. I disagree, but whatever.

But if you do think some things are more ethical or moral than others, I don't know why you couldn't make the same judgments on particular cultures.

It's happened twice now.

[DQ12]

Cultures aren't good or evil.

You don't think cultures are evil?  I, for one, take the chiefs and bold position of thinking Nazi culture was evil.

I would split the hair that Nazism is an ideology that existed within the German culture, just like it exists within present-day American culture.

OK -- I think the culture that dominated Germany in the 1930s and 40s was evil.  I think that culture (distinct from modern day German culture) was evil.  If you want to lump all "German" culture together, you can, but I'm not doing that.  I'm talking specifically about cultures during specific periods in a specific place.  One is better than the other, in my view.  One is more evil than the other. 

If you reject morally loaded words like "good" and "evil," OK.  But if you can't say that "the culture that gave rise to the holocaust" is any better or worse, morally, than any other culture, then I'd say you have a very interesting world-view.

I don't think any culture is any more or less susceptible to putting Nazis in charge than any other culture is.

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture.  If you're making a comment on "human nature," sure ("It could happen again here...if the culture changed someday.").  But if culture A promotes gas chambers or slavery or child sacrifice, I think that culture is morally/ethically worse than culture B, which doesn't do those things (and instead prioritizes other things, like improving infant mortality rates, and literacy, and art, for example).  I don't know how you could say that those two hypothetical cultures are morally equivalent. 

Again, if you reject the concepts of morality or ethics, then that's OK. I disagree, but whatever.

But if you do think some things are more ethical or moral than others, I don't know why you couldn't make the same judgments on particular cultures.

It's happened twice now.

[chum1]

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture. 

What has only happened once? Autocracy? Imperialism? Ethnic cleansing? To my knowledge, there are many examples of all the bad stuff that happened in Nazi Germany.

[DQ12]

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture. 

What has only happened once? Autocracy? Imperialism? Ethnic cleansing? To my knowledge, there are many examples of all the bad stuff that happened in Nazi Germany.

I'm specifically talking about "putting nazis in charge." 

Regardless, has every culture equally promoted/endorsed the "bad stuff" you're talking about?  If not, why not?

[CNS]

Some cultures are primed more to accept the things that can be manipulated by evil people into evil movements.  The evil is working on a phycological level, imo, to subconsciously force acceptance and adherence of certain things that people normally wouldn't accept via propaganda.  This is why we all have experiences where someone who we thought had their crap together turned out to follow an unexpected wild movement.  Maga, for example.  Harris is a demon, for example. 

Great example:  I have known a guy for 16 years who is a highly educated maintenance engineer.  He deals with extremely highly technical equipment.  He is 1 semester short of having an actual ME bachelors.  About 2 yrs ago, he got comfortable enough in one of our conversations to explain to me why the earth is flat. 

[chum1]

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture. 

What has only happened once? Autocracy? Imperialism? Ethnic cleansing? To my knowledge, there are many examples of all the bad stuff that happened in Nazi Germany.

I'm specifically talking about "putting nazis in charge." 

Regardless, has every culture equally promoted/endorsed the "bad stuff" you're talking about?  If not, why not?

Oh, so totalitarianism, then? Yes, there are many, many examples.

I have no idea why you're asking dumb questions about why everything isn't exactly the same all of the time.

[LickNeckey]

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jan/26/elon-musk-peter-thiel-apartheid-south-africa

[chum1]

I love knowing that there were DQ12s in the Weimar Republic who were like, "nothing bad is going to happen here," while Hitler was busy consolidating power.

[DQ12]

Well, to my knowledge, that's only ever happened in one culture. 

What has only happened once? Autocracy? Imperialism? Ethnic cleansing? To my knowledge, there are many examples of all the bad stuff that happened in Nazi Germany.

I'm specifically talking about "putting nazis in charge." 

Regardless, has every culture equally promoted/endorsed the "bad stuff" you're talking about?  If not, why not?

Oh, so totalitarianism, then? Yes, there are many, many examples.

I have no idea why you're asking dumb questions about why everything isn't exactly the same all of the time.

I'm asking these questions because I think it's insane to say that no cultures are any better or worse than any others, when it seems obvious to me that we have pretty clear evidence that that's not the case. 

You acknowledging that authoritarianism is "bad" ought to prove the point, given that not every culture has engaged in authoritarianism.

[DQ12]

I love knowing that there were DQ12s in the Weimar Republic who were like, "nothing bad is going to happen here," while Hitler was busy consolidating power.

Whoa, whoa, whoa.  I'm the opposite.  I think that the Weimar Republic evolved into what it did is a damning indictment of the Weimar Republic's culture.  Had it not evolved into that, I wouldn't think so little of it.

[star seed 7]

Dlew is Jon lithgow in footloose. All that damn fun and dancing led to the nazis!