Author Topic: What's your K-State FB outlook?  (Read 2455 times)

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Online Rage Against the McKee

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2021, 10:37:26 AM »
Northwestern has won Iowa's division twice since the last time Iowa won it.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2021, 10:55:18 AM »
People are pissed about Crawford because Iowa has been slapping us on the recruiting trail for the last few years, and then they come into KS, offer a kid that has multiple connections to our team, that we've been prioritizing very heavily for a long time, and he commits to Iowa without even taking a visit to Iowa City.  If we were ever going to get a recruit to choose us over Iowa*, Crawford (who is really good btw) fit that mold to a T. 

If CK/K-State is going to take that "next step," winning guys like Crawford seems imperative. 

All that said, the staff has done a decent job recovering after misses in the past (particularly with OL), and December is still a long ways off, so plenty of time to find a good DE.

And Iowa isn't the Big Ten's second best program right now gmab.  I would put Michigan, Penn State, and Wisconsin all above them. 

*I will say Rubley had an offer from Iowa

Brents was kind of a win over Iowa

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2021, 10:56:36 AM »
People are pissed about Crawford because Iowa has been slapping us on the recruiting trail for the last few years, and then they come into KS, offer a kid that has multiple connections to our team, that we've been prioritizing very heavily for a long time, and he commits to Iowa without even taking a visit to Iowa City.  If we were ever going to get a recruit to choose us over Iowa*, Crawford (who is really good btw) fit that mold to a T. 

If CK/K-State is going to take that "next step," winning guys like Crawford seems imperative. 

All that said, the staff has done a decent job recovering after misses in the past (particularly with OL), and December is still a long ways off, so plenty of time to find a good DE.

And Iowa isn't the Big Ten's second best program right now gmab.  I would put Michigan, Penn State, and Wisconsin all above them. 

*I will say Rubley had an offer from Iowa

Brents was kind of a win over Iowa
True, but a little different than "recruits" per se. 


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Offline Shooter Jones

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2021, 11:03:12 AM »
FWIW, I like CK and think he can be very successful here, but it's going to be hard to get to the next level unless K-State steps it up a notch on the recruiting trail.  Matt Campbell has excelled while getting mid-50s type classes, but that route is awful hard/rare.

I think you can be successful with recruiting classes around 50-60, as long as you are getting playmakers at the skilled positions that are most likely higher end recruits.

I'd say Breece Hall alone is worth multiple wins for ISU the last few years. Purdy has been solid as well.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2021, 11:22:02 AM »
FWIW, I like CK and think he can be very successful here, but it's going to be hard to get to the next level unless K-State steps it up a notch on the recruiting trail.  Matt Campbell has excelled while getting mid-50s type classes, but that route is awful hard/rare.

I think you can be successful with recruiting classes around 50-60, as long as you are getting playmakers at the skilled positions that are most likely higher end recruits.

I'd say Breece Hall alone is worth multiple wins for ISU the last few years. Purdy has been solid as well.
Like I said, not impossible, but pretty rare.  If you're consistently playing with a sizable talent gap (on paper), it's hard to consistently win.  I don't think it's controversial to say that it's easier to win if you elevate recruiting.


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Offline Shooter Jones

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2021, 11:49:03 AM »
I know, and you're absolutely right.

I just don't see K-State being a top tier program in the B12 with this staff as is. Obviously that could change, but my long term expectations have dropped a bit over the last year.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2021, 12:04:32 PM »
I can see them being peers (on-field results wise) with everyone but OU and Texas. But obviously would like to see recruiting improvement, especially when on-campus recruiting returns

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2021, 01:20:53 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

Offline wetwillie

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2021, 01:48:44 PM »
Farming cat fan!
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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #34 on: February 18, 2021, 01:52:19 PM »
Man
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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #35 on: February 18, 2021, 01:53:55 PM »
 :fatty:
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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #36 on: February 18, 2021, 02:27:10 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

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Offline Shooter Jones

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2021, 02:45:38 PM »
Northwestern dominated that division last season and any division bragging rights run through hilarious Ryan Field now.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2021, 04:11:48 PM »
The idea that Iowa is the 2nd best program in the big 10 is literally a laugh out loud type of statement.

To the question at hand, it's really hard to judge off of last year because we had so many injuries and guys out. If Skylar had stayed healthy, we certainly would have beaten Baylor and OSU. You'll be hard pressed to convince me otherwise with the crazy number of turnovers our backup QB had. We also would have won at least 2 OOC games had covid not done its thing. So, those two events right there take us to a 9 win season and a bowl appearance. Suddenly, things are looking pretty good for the cats.

We'll know a lot about the direction of the program after this season. If we finish with 7-8 wins, then we'll know that something will have to change if we're going to be able to grab another gear, so to speak. If we get 9 or 10 total wins, then I think you step back and let Klieman do his thing. 

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2021, 04:18:46 PM »
I'd be thrilled if we won 8 games next year fwiw.


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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #40 on: February 18, 2021, 04:19:57 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

You know what farmer, you're right. Iowa is certainly trending up, but Wisconsin undoubtedly has the edge right now. DLew can GTFOOMF with Michigan and Penn State, of course they historically better but both are undoubtedly in shambles right now and no one would be surprised if they both had new coaches this time next year. Has Michigan ever even won their division?

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2021, 04:47:35 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

You know what farmer, you're right. Iowa is certainly trending up, but Wisconsin undoubtedly has the edge right now. DLew can GTFOOMF with Michigan and Penn State, of course they historically better but both are undoubtedly in shambles right now and no one would be surprised if they both had new coaches this time next year. Has Michigan ever even won their division?

I mean James Franklin has two more 11-win seasons in 7 than Ferentz has in 22. But even then, I think Iowa will almost always be a level below Penn State and Michigan in the eyes of recruits regardless of coach.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2021, 05:11:58 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

You know what farmer, you're right. Iowa is certainly trending up, but Wisconsin undoubtedly has the edge right now. DLew can GTFOOMF with Michigan and Penn State, of course they historically better but both are undoubtedly in shambles right now and no one would be surprised if they both had new coaches this time next year. Has Michigan ever even won their division?

I mean James Franklin has two more 11-win seasons in 7 than Ferentz has in 22. But even then, I think Iowa will almost always be a level below Penn State and Michigan in the eyes of recruits regardless of coach.

Iowa had a higher ranked class than Penn State this year, but I'm not going to front, Iowa isn't recruiting as well as I thought they did. For some reason I thought they have had top 15 classes lately, I was wrong.

Nevertheless, the fact that they are recruiting in the mid 30's to mid 20's and producing all of the NFL talent that they are is incredibly impressive and I'm sure the recruits are impressed by it too. I'm shocked they actually signed any black dudes at all in this latest class, but the kids are buying what they are selling.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2021, 05:14:16 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

You know what farmer, you're right. Iowa is certainly trending up, but Wisconsin undoubtedly has the edge right now. DLew can GTFOOMF with Michigan and Penn State, of course they historically better but both are undoubtedly in shambles right now and no one would be surprised if they both had new coaches this time next year. Has Michigan ever even won their division?
I wouldn't be surprised if Iowa had a new coach this time next year either fwiw -- then again, Ferentz isn't as old as I originally thought, so who knows.  Also, didn't Iowa have a pretty scandalous racial reckoning last summer?  I don't remember the details at all but it seemed like not that long ago Ferentz/Iowa was in hot water PR-wise.

I also think "in shambles" is a little overboard regarding Michigan, and a lot overboard regarding Penn State.  It's very possible I missed something, but other than having a disappointing covid season, what's going on at Penn State that would put them in shambles?

And I'm not saying Iowa is garbage or anything -- far from it.  They're a really good program. But I still think they're in that third tier of Big 10 programs (even today), below Ohio State, who is alone, and then probably Michigan, Wisconsin, and Penn State.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2021, 05:17:34 PM by DQ12 »


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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2021, 05:24:08 PM »
The larger point is the belief that we are constantly getting our asses kicked in recruiting is stupid, especially given we just landed the second highest profile high school recruit in high school history.

Unless there is anyone who can point to something specifically this kid has said that our staff screwed up, melting down about some three star tweener, guy has like four different positions listed, from Lansing who we actually offered and recruited , is really stupid. I get the meltdowns when we were losing kids we were barely recruiting, I did it for years. Hopefully Breece Hall is the last in state kid we can lose our crap over not landing because the staff didn't try hard enough. Those people at KSO, and frankly some here, need to understand that just because the staff really wants a kid, and we really love K-State, doesn't mean that they are going to end up here. I spent mu whole life convinced that I was going to OU, a girl is the reason I ended up at K-State and it turned out to be the second best thing that ever happened to me. If that girl wanted to go to Pitt St., I was going to Pitt St.

Acting like this or any staff are failures because they unsuccessfully tried to get a 17 year old kid to go somewhere is really clownish.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #45 on: February 18, 2021, 05:51:44 PM »
Not historically, but right now. If they aren't then who is? It sure in the hell isn't Michigan or Michigan State. Iowa has definitely passed Wisconsin and Penn State, again currently not historically. I know it's hard to fathom but there isn't another program that is recruiting as good as they are, producing more NFL talent, and winning as much as they have been the last decade or so. If y'all have data that proves me wrong, then do so, otherwise you're just saying "Iowa? Nah, can't be Iowa," without a damn thing to back that up.

Wisconsin has won the West Division (formerly Leaders Division :lol:) 6 times in the last decade. Most recently in 2019. Iowa hasn't won that same division since 2016 and that was the only time in the last decade. Also, Wisconsin is 7-3 against Iowa in the last 10 meetings.

You know what farmer, you're right. Iowa is certainly trending up, but Wisconsin undoubtedly has the edge right now. DLew can GTFOOMF with Michigan and Penn State, of course they historically better but both are undoubtedly in shambles right now and no one would be surprised if they both had new coaches this time next year. Has Michigan ever even won their division?
I wouldn't be surprised if Iowa had a new coach this time next year either fwiw -- then again, Ferentz isn't as old as I originally thought, so who knows.  Also, didn't Iowa have a pretty scandalous racial reckoning last summer?  I don't remember the details at all but it seemed like not that long ago Ferentz/Iowa was in hot water PR-wise.

I also think "in shambles" is a little overboard regarding Michigan, and a lot overboard regarding Penn State.  It's very possible I missed something, but other than having a disappointing covid season, what's going on at Penn State that would put them in shambles?

And I'm not saying Iowa is garbage or anything -- far from it.  They're a really good program. But I still think they're in that third tier of Big 10 programs (even today), below Ohio State, who is alone, and then probably Michigan, Wisconsin, and Penn State.

Yeah Ferentz had and still has the racism cloud over the program, there is still a pending lawsuit. He always had the support of his AD and most of the fan base, and it seemingly has not effected their recruiting, at all. If Ferentz retires it will be because he comes down with some previously unknown health ailment.

Michigan is definitely in shambles. No one there likes their coach, there's all kind of mess with the athletic director. They've never won the division. I know that Ohio State has had a stranglehold on the division but Michigan State has won it or tied for it 5 times. They seem to be stuck in okay mode and have been there since the mid 90's. I won't check, but I'm willing to bet they have around the same amount of wins as Nebraska since they shared the national championship.

Penn State is only in shambles because they are lunatics and perhaps slightly racist. They are always talking about that dude's job. How do you know if you should be looking over your shoulder? If your boss has to tell your fans that she has your back.

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/psu/2021/01/26/Penn-State-athletic-director-Sandy-Barbour-firmly-backs-James-Franklin/stories/202101260165

For the record I can't stand Iowa, but I do think they have a tendency to be underrated, and as a fan of a school that is perpetually underrated I am a bit sensitive about that.

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #46 on: February 18, 2021, 10:06:44 PM »
8 wins would be incredible


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Offline wetwillie

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #47 on: February 18, 2021, 10:44:00 PM »
The larger point is the belief that we are constantly getting our asses kicked in recruiting is stupid, especially given we just landed the second highest profile high school recruit in high school history.

Unless there is anyone who can point to something specifically this kid has said that our staff screwed up, melting down about some three star tweener, guy has like four different positions listed, from Lansing who we actually offered and recruited , is really stupid. I get the meltdowns when we were losing kids we were barely recruiting, I did it for years. Hopefully Breece Hall is the last in state kid we can lose our crap over not landing because the staff didn't try hard enough. Those people at KSO, and frankly some here, need to understand that just because the staff really wants a kid, and we really love K-State, doesn't mean that they are going to end up here. I spent mu whole life convinced that I was going to OU, a girl is the reason I ended up at K-State and it turned out to be the second best thing that ever happened to me. If that girl wanted to go to Pitt St., I was going to Pitt St.

Acting like this or any staff are failures because they unsuccessfully tried to get a 17 year old kid to go somewhere is really clownish.

They are doing a phenomenal job finding lightly recruited talent that goes under the radar and getting fantastic production out of them early. 

(Vaughn, Portier, Duke are already proven. Warner, Mozee , Aniduke have been mentioned as likely to impress this year) also Devrin Weathers appears to be a really solid pickup for 2021


Outside of Rubley they have gotten their ballsacks tazed off for virtually all their top targets.

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2021  Devin Neal, Jaylin Noel, Brody Brecht, Thomas Fidone, Beau Stephens, Tyler Maro, Arden Walker , Seth Malcom , Myles Purchase, Matthew Langlois, Beau Freyler



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Offline bucket

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #48 on: February 18, 2021, 10:48:05 PM »
The larger point is the belief that we are constantly getting our asses kicked in recruiting is stupid, especially given we just landed the second highest profile high school recruit in high school history.

Unless there is anyone who can point to something specifically this kid has said that our staff screwed up, melting down about some three star tweener, guy has like four different positions listed, from Lansing who we actually offered and recruited , is really stupid. I get the meltdowns when we were losing kids we were barely recruiting, I did it for years. Hopefully Breece Hall is the last in state kid we can lose our crap over not landing because the staff didn't try hard enough. Those people at KSO, and frankly some here, need to understand that just because the staff really wants a kid, and we really love K-State, doesn't mean that they are going to end up here. I spent mu whole life convinced that I was going to OU, a girl is the reason I ended up at K-State and it turned out to be the second best thing that ever happened to me. If that girl wanted to go to Pitt St., I was going to Pitt St.

Acting like this or any staff are failures because they unsuccessfully tried to get a 17 year old kid to go somewhere is really clownish.

They are doing a phenomenal job finding lightly recruited talent that goes under the radar and getting fantastic production out of them early. 

(Vaughn, Portier, Duke are already proven. Warner, Mozee , Aniduke have been mentioned as likely to impress this year) also Devrin Weathers appears to be a really solid pickup for 2021


Outside of Rubley they have gotten their ballsacks tazed off for virtually all their top targets.

2020 Turner Corcoran, Hayden Pauls, Ky Thomas, Daniel Jackson , Sayvion Williams, Ersery, Alex Conn, Jacob Gamble , Yahya Black , Lanell Carr, Korie Black

2021  Devin Neal, Jaylin Noel, Brody Brecht, Thomas Fidone, Beau Stephens, Tyler Maro, Arden Walker , Seth Malcom , Myles Purchase, Matthew Langlois, Beau Freyler

Personally, I've felt he's going to have to establish himself for a few years before the in-state guys become expected commits. He had an excellent first year, but it'd still be difficult for me to get excited about a guy from North Dakota after a year.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: What's your K-State FB outlook?
« Reply #49 on: February 18, 2021, 11:08:03 PM »
The larger point is the belief that we are constantly getting our asses kicked in recruiting is stupid, especially given we just landed the second highest profile high school recruit in high school history.

Unless there is anyone who can point to something specifically this kid has said that our staff screwed up, melting down about some three star tweener, guy has like four different positions listed, from Lansing who we actually offered and recruited , is really stupid. I get the meltdowns when we were losing kids we were barely recruiting, I did it for years. Hopefully Breece Hall is the last in state kid we can lose our crap over not landing because the staff didn't try hard enough. Those people at KSO, and frankly some here, need to understand that just because the staff really wants a kid, and we really love K-State, doesn't mean that they are going to end up here. I spent mu whole life convinced that I was going to OU, a girl is the reason I ended up at K-State and it turned out to be the second best thing that ever happened to me. If that girl wanted to go to Pitt St., I was going to Pitt St.

Acting like this or any staff are failures because they unsuccessfully tried to get a 17 year old kid to go somewhere is really clownish.

They are doing a phenomenal job finding lightly recruited talent that goes under the radar and getting fantastic production out of them early. 

(Vaughn, Portier, Duke are already proven. Warner, Mozee , Aniduke have been mentioned as likely to impress this year) also Devrin Weathers appears to be a really solid pickup for 2021


Outside of Rubley they have gotten their ballsacks tazed off for virtually all their top targets.

2020 Turner Corcoran, Hayden Pauls, Ky Thomas, Daniel Jackson , Sayvion Williams, Ersery, Alex Conn, Jacob Gamble , Yahya Black , Lanell Carr, Korie Black

2021  Devin Neal, Jaylin Noel, Brody Brecht, Thomas Fidone, Beau Stephens, Tyler Maro, Arden Walker , Seth Malcom , Myles Purchase, Matthew Langlois, Beau Freyler

I honestly don't know but is missing out on let's say 10 of your initial top 20 targets yearly unusual for most schools outside of the top 15 or 20 classes?