So...LSU

[MakeItRain]

A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different, other than the fact that all people involved at LSU won't get fired like they did at Baylor.

This is gross

https://twitter.com/USATODAY/status/1328293986721738754

[MakeItRain]

https://twitter.com/careschroeder/status/1328388147831582723

[MakeItRain]

https://twitter.com/brooklenmicah/status/1328358981157474305

https://twitter.com/karlicarpenter_/status/1328549459781947392

[wetwillie]

I’m good with burning that university to the ground as well

[Trim]

A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.

[MakeItRain]

A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.

That's always what a lot of the outrage was about, but people were too scared to admit it.

[Institutional Control]

I'm fine with Orgeron going to Italy to coach before finally settling into a west Louisiana high school coaching position.

[Rage Against the McKee]

LSU should lose its football program, imo.

[michigancat]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

[wetwillie]

I still remember Daris being super defensive about Kendall not getting punished for his fathers actions which I thought was strange but I was pretty much eff em ban em all at that point.

[star seed 7]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

This pretty much covers it for me.

Didn’t Baylor keep having problems even after everyone was fired?

[MakeItRain]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

[MakeItRain]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Didn’t Baylor keep having problems even after everyone was fired?

Do they still have an environment that doesn't take women's safety as seriously as they should? I dunno probably.

Did they have any publicized issues covering up rapes after they fired the AD, President, football coach, and cleaning out the title IX office? No, they did not.

[420seriouscat69]

Baylor had a 2003 scandal as well, with basketball players killing one another, drugs, and coach cover ups. BTW, that documentary is on Showtime right now. Totally forgot about half that story.

But yes, if LSU is scum AF, ban them too. I don't think anyone started a thread about it, because it's an out of conference story.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

It is a football problem, though. When an institution values football or any other activity above the safety and welfare of its students (or children in the case of Penn State), then that activity is a major problem and it needs to be eliminated. Baylor, Penn State, and LSU should not have football programs, and major conferences should want nothing to do with them. Without that sort of action, we can just expect to see this sort of behavior continue at other schools.

[MakeItRain]

Baylor had a 2003 scandal as well, with basketball players killing one another, drugs, and coach cover ups. BTW, that documentary is on Showtime right now. Totally forgot about half that story.

But yes, if LSU is scum AF, ban them too. I don't think anyone started a thread about it, because it's an out of conference story.

Baylor didn't have a scandal with Dave Bliss. They found out what he did and immediately fired him.

[MakeItRain]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

It is a football problem, though. When an institution values football or any other activity above the safety and welfare of its students (or children in the case of Penn State), then that activity is a major problem and it needs to be eliminated. Baylor, Penn State, and LSU should not have football programs, and major conferences should want nothing to do with them. Without that sort of action, we can just expect to see this sort of behavior continue at other schools.

In the case of Baylor and LSU football players contributed to a larger campus wide issue. Both had very high profile cases of women raped by non athletes but the universities didn't act to protect the women raped or other women on the campus. Football culture is in many cases, toxic at big schools, but dismissing this as a football issue gives a lot of people cover as someone else's issue. When football players are committing these crimes, it's usually a black man assaulting a white woman, and too a lot of people, that's dog bites man. The issue of these campuses not taking these assaults seriously is largely a factor of white men being allowed, unchecked, to violate women. Did you see the tweets I posted? The Student Body President has no say over athletics at LSU.

[Gooch]

A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.

That's always what a lot of the outrage was about, but people were too scared to admit it.

link=topic=42384.msg2027665#msg2027665 date=1605641413]
I still remember Daris being super defensive about Kendall not getting punished for his fathers actions which I thought was strange but I was pretty much eff em ban em all at that point.
[/quote]
The finger taping is enough on its own for him to be cancelled.

[michigancat]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

I mean Baylor was a pretty prolonged affair - the news first broke with Ukwuachu in August 2015 and Briles didn't get fired until May 2016. So there was a lot of time for it to brew. https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/15745248/line-events-rise-dismissal-baylor-bears-coach-art-briles

it's also kind of interesting to see the actual discussion ramp up starting in that August:

https://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=29421.225

I won't belabor this further but I don't disagree with anything you're saying about rape culture on American college campuses.

[ChiComCat]

It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting. 

[MakeItRain]

I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

I mean Baylor was a pretty prolonged affair - the news first broke with Ukwuachu in August 2015 and Briles didn't get fired until May 2016. So there was a lot of time for it to brew. https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/15745248/line-events-rise-dismissal-baylor-bears-coach-art-briles

it's also kind of interesting to see the actual discussion ramp up starting in that August:

https://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=29421.225

I won't belabor this further but I don't disagree with anything you're saying about rape culture on American college campuses.

FWIW, it looks like the LSU story has a similar timeframe. I understand not reading the story, it's very long, but they've contacted LSU and Coach O and wrote about this previously.

Louisiana has a very short statute of limitations with regard to charges of this nature, and it appears that they are just attempting to run out the clock.

[Rage Against the McKee]

It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting.

I just don't get the sense that universities go out of their way to cover up crimes of this nature when the offenders aren't athletes. There was no racial component to Jerry Sandusky raping boys in the showers at Penn State, and I also think the university probably would have cared at least a little bit about boys getting raped on their campus if the rapist wasn't one of their football coaches. Maybe I'm wrong about that, though.

[pissclams]

i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

[pissclams]

a more politically correct way to say it would be, agree to disagree!

[MakeItRain]

It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting.

I just don't get the sense that universities go out of their way to cover up crimes of this nature when the offenders aren't athletes.

Well documented cases at Baylor and LSU notwithstanding, it's been happening on a large scale since at least the 90's. The federal crime reporting laws had to be changed because schools were fudging stats to show that campuses only had one or two assaults a year, this was widespread, including at K-State, we on the black student union attempted more than once to get the K-State Police to release the actual numbers.

Instead of facing the problem head on and being proactive, schools would rather act as if they don't have predators walking around on their campuses, it's harder to recruit non student athletes, and to keep school donors happy if you say, "we have a problem with sexual assaults on this campus and we need to fix it." That's not an island a university president wants to be on.

There's plenty of research showing that schools still have little to no interest in fixing this.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/survey-finds-evidence-of-widespread-sexual-violence-at-33-universities/2019/10/14/bd75dcde-ee82-11e9-b648-76bcf86eb67e_story.html?outputType=amp

https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/ac-cn-cns-sexual-assaults-20190817-vocwixliuvanjotl3lx2dekz74-story.html?outputType=amp

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/01/why-the-prevalence-of-campus-sexual-assault-is-so-hard-to-quantify/427002/

I actually somewhat back what ChiComCat said, I actually have more promise that football programs can clean their house, before the larger universities. I believe most coaches aren't like Art Briles and apparently Coach O and will boot a football player who's proven to be a danger to the community.

Worth noting that the Department of Education, isn't helpful here
https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2020/08/14/betsy-devoss-controversial-new-rule-campus-sexual-assault-goes-into-effect/