Courtney Messingham is a proven loser

[Houstoncat93]

zero rumors that he is done

Aren't the rumors exactly the opposite? (ie team was told he is staying)

[Shooter Jones]

Are there rumors out there that Mess is done or are we all assuming? Seeing rando vague tweets about it.

Just assuming at this point, similarly to the conversations that took place after each shitty season during Snyder's time. This is the style of play for Klieman (Snyder then), and skilled guys/WR's will not want to be apart of it. Especially if Howard is your plan moving forward.

I would assume if Mess feels pressure and ends of retiring or leaves, CK will just bring in someone very similar to him, because that's almost all he's ever known.

[ChiComCat]

I'm worried that co-coordinator with Klein has a lot less appeal than being the lone guy.  Additionally, Messingham catches all the crap for the offense but the fans give Klein a pass.  Those would be pretty big negatives to me if I'm a coordinator with other P5 interest.

I know MiR disagrees that CK was a factor but IMO Skylar did not develop well over his six years. Obviously injuries hurt but still.

Also Klein is not co-OC any more.

I didn't realize that he wasn't co-OC.  That makes me feel better.  I agree on Skylar.  I don't think he ever went through progressions well and was as bad at it as ever against Baylor.  The worst part about it against Baylor is that he was too injured to try to cover for it by running.  On the plus side, I think Klein has recruited Colorado pretty well.

[michigancat]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

My wetwillie trifecta would be Wells, Beaty, Held to replace Mess, Klein, and Ray.   

tbh I'd prefer 2 of the 3 be young hotshot recruiters (of which we seem to have none) if we replace three.

[catastrophe]

I trust Kleiman to make the right choice on where to put Klein. I don’t trust him to do the same with Mess.

[chum1]

I don't pretend to know anything about any of it, but I look at a guy like Klein and think he wouldn't have much to contribute to coaching beyond saying what he would do, which basically just amounts to being huge and fast.

[wetwillie]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

My wetwillie trifecta would be Wells, Beaty, Held to replace Mess, Klein, and Ray.   

tbh I'd prefer 2 of the 3 be young hotshot recruiters (of which we seem to have none) if we replace three.

Held definitely fits the criteria.  Beaty riding on his hover board probably still wouldn’t earn him a young hot shot tag tho.

[michigancat]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

My wetwillie trifecta would be Wells, Beaty, Held to replace Mess, Klein, and Ray.   

tbh I'd prefer 2 of the 3 be young hotshot recruiters (of which we seem to have none) if we replace three.

Held definitely fits the criteria.  Beaty riding on his hover board probably still wouldn’t earn him a young hot shot tag tho.

he's definitely not what I'd consider "young" but he's relatively new to D1. Why did he get fired? just to clean out the offensive staff?

[michigancat]

I trust Kleiman to make the right choice on where to put Klein. I don’t trust him to do the same with Mess.

I assume every D1 football coach would fire his mother if they thought it would help win football games

[catastrophe]

My concern is with his judgment in that department, not his ethics.

[michigancat]

My concern is with his judgment in that department, not his ethics.

if he can judge klein he can judge mess

[wetwillie]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

My wetwillie trifecta would be Wells, Beaty, Held to replace Mess, Klein, and Ray.   

tbh I'd prefer 2 of the 3 be young hotshot recruiters (of which we seem to have none) if we replace three.

Held definitely fits the criteria.  Beaty riding on his hover board probably still wouldn’t earn him a young hot shot tag tho.

he's definitely not what I'd consider "young" but he's relatively new to D1. Why did he get fired? just to clean out the offensive staff?

Yea you are right older than I thought, but yes the Nebraska AD forced Scott to fire his offensive assistants since that side of the ball had been lacking.

[Trim]

I trust Kleiman to make the right choice on where to put Klein. I don’t trust him to do the same with Mess.

I assume every D1 football coach would fire his mother if they thought it would help win football games

This will make for a good data point on the d1/d2 thing.

[yoga-like_abana]

Would take Beaty in a hot second

[MakeItRain]

I'm worried that co-coordinator with Klein has a lot less appeal than being the lone guy.  Additionally, Messingham catches all the crap for the offense but the fans give Klein a pass.  Those would be pretty big negatives to me if I'm a coordinator with other P5 interest.

I know MiR disagrees that CK was a factor but IMO Skylar did not develop well over his six years. Obviously injuries hurt but still.

Also Klein is not co-OC any more.

I mean it's ludicrous that Skylar didn't develop, just a preposterous notion. Let's just forget about the fact that under Snyder he couldn't win the job from Alex Delton. He had a month to know he was going to be the starter for that Cactus Bowl game and was 3-7 for 27 yards, 1 interception, and 5 carries for 4 yards. Just a complete horror show. So I'm going to not include the his numbers from his two Snyder years.

Here are his numbers in 2019:
177/297 60%
2315 yds
12 tds
5 ints
Passer rating of 135.0
178 yards per game
13.0 yards per completion
7.7 yards per attempt
 
After he came back from his injury he was praised across the board for how different he looks, a complete passer, here are those numbers since his injury
129/187 69%
1614 yards
9 tds
2 ints
Passer rating of 155.8
230.5 ypg
12.5 ypc
8.6 ypa

He's miles and miles and miles better now than when he got here. The notion that he now would have trouble beating Alex Delton out is silly.

Furthermore, the notion that a quarterback coach's role is to simply show linear improvement for each and every quarterback on the roster seems absurd to me. These guys don't start at the same place. Asking a QB coach to get Will Howard to even in the same neighborhood as Blake Shapen is dumb. I'd assume the larger role of the QB coach is with regard to the gameplan and the helping the QBs to understand the playbook.

[MakeItRain]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

How do you figure? Did he land some big fishes at A&M that I'm unaware of.

I think it would be silly to give a wide receivers coach who hasn't worked in three years the keys to a P5 offense.

[MakeItRain]

My concern is with his judgment in that department, not his ethics.

if he can judge klein he can judge mess

He was college roommates with mess, it's significantly different. Not saying that he wouldn't fire his buddy, but he's known mess for 35 years, he's worked with Klein for 3.

Also I know I said this but if mess leaves, he isn't retiring, he's only 55.

I also contend that there is no way that Klieman told the team that mess is coming back, it makes no sense. The need to tell the team he's coming back indicates that he definitely shouldn't be coming back and telling the team as such would just make whatever reason he needs to tell them, even worse.

[wetwillie]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

How do you figure? Did he land some big fishes at A&M that I'm unaware of.

I think it would be silly to give a wide receivers coach who hasn't worked in three years the keys to a P5 offense.

I don’t think making him the WR coach is exactly handing him the keys

[stunted]

if he doesn't have it in him to fire mess, it's over for him. but ksu embraced the culture of hiring their best buds, so we kind of deserve it.

[MakeItRain]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

How do you figure? Did he land some big fishes at A&M that I'm unaware of.

I think it would be silly to give a wide receivers coach who hasn't worked in three years the keys to a P5 offense.

I don’t think making him the WR coach is exactly handing him the keys

Ah, I thought y'all were talking about the OC. Is he accomplished enough as a recruiter to be excited to hire a 51 year old WR coach who hasn't worked in 3 years?

[yoga-like_abana]

if he doesn't have it in him to fire mess, it's over for him. but ksu embraced the culture of hiring their best buds, so we kind of deserve it.

Yep. And Gene doesn't have the stones to tell him Mess has to go

[stunted]

if he doesn't have it in him to fire mess, it's over for him. but ksu embraced the culture of hiring their best buds, so we kind of deserve it.

Yep. And Gene doesn't have the stones to tell him Mess has to go

FAMILY

[wetwillie]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

How do you figure? Did he land some big fishes at A&M that I'm unaware of.

I think it would be silly to give a wide receivers coach who hasn't worked in three years the keys to a P5 offense.

I don’t think making him the WR coach is exactly handing him the keys

Ah, I thought y'all were talking about the OC. Is he accomplished enough as a recruiter to be excited to hire a 51 year old WR coach who hasn't worked in 3 years?

I think he worked in some capacity at Texas in 2019.  Would think his Texas HS recruiting ties are still decent as well.

[michigancat]

if he doesn't have it in him to fire mess, it's over for him. but ksu embraced the culture of hiring their best buds, so we kind of deserve it.

Yep. And Gene doesn't have the stones to tell him Mess has to go

gene fired the most legendary coach in KSU history

[Shooter Jones]

What would you guys think about David Beaty on this offensive staff.

I like it quite a bit because I think he's a decent recruiter

How do you figure? Did he land some big fishes at A&M that I'm unaware of.

A couple, yeah.