Bossi talks to Meek about Frank's recruiting philosophy

[catzacker]

* - is there enough recruiting traffic to support a: "take a big or don't in 2011" thread?

I say yes

I second the idea of the discussion, not that there is enough traffic to support it.  We should take a big.  Or hope for a magical transfer.

[kso_FAN]

KSU fans love Irving for some reason.  I think he gets spared from deserved criticism more than any KSU player in recent memory.

Don't love Irving, but don't hate him either.  He's not going to be a star, but for whatever reason the staff likes him and he's going to play as long as he's at K-State.

Beggars can't be choosers.  We have no one that can handle the ball beyond him and Pullen.  And Pullen really isn't that great at it.  That's sufficient reason not to hate him.

Irving can't handle the ball.

Not any better than Russell, anyway.  Both are less than average at it so far, imo.  I have no faith, from what I have seen to date, that Russell or Irving will make a steady PG this year.

I think either are fine for what they'll be asked to do next year, and I'd prefer Irving to Russell handling the ball. 

But that is far from my biggest concern for those two; much more importantly can either improve their shot to be a legit threat from behind the arc and hit over 30%?  Russel's 21% and Irvings 24% are the biggest concerns I have with either at this point.

[chum1]

KSU fans love Irving for some reason.  I think he gets spared from deserved criticism more than any KSU player in recent memory.

Don't love Irving, but don't hate him either.  He's not going to be a star, but for whatever reason the staff likes him and he's going to play as long as he's at K-State.

Beggars can't be choosers.  We have no one that can handle the ball beyond him and Pullen.  And Pullen really isn't that great at it.  That's sufficient reason not to hate him.

Irving can't handle the ball.

Well, then he isn't absolutely horrible at it like everyone else on the team.  Either way, his ball handling will play a vital role on an otherwise very good team next year.  He might not be the best, but he's all we've got and we'll be much better for having him.

[yosh]

* - is there enough recruiting traffic to support a: "take a big or don't in 2011" thread?

I say yes

I second the idea of the discussion, not that there is enough traffic to support it.  We should take a big.  Or hope for a magical transfer.

Agreed.  Right now, if Judge leaves early, we'd be looking at going into the 12 class needing to fill basically the enitre frontcourt.

[yosh]

KSU fans love Irving for some reason.  I think he gets spared from deserved criticism more than any KSU player in recent memory.

Don't love Irving, but don't hate him either.  He's not going to be a star, but for whatever reason the staff likes him and he's going to play as long as he's at K-State.

Beggars can't be choosers.  We have no one that can handle the ball beyond him and Pullen.  And Pullen really isn't that great at it.  That's sufficient reason not to hate him.

Irving can't handle the ball.

Well, then he isn't absolutely horrible at it like everyone else on the team.  Either way, his ball handling will play a vital role on an otherwise very good team next year.  He might not be the best, but he's all we've got and we'll be much better for having him.

dunno....I think he might be absolutely horrible.  Not ready to say he's better than Russell...If Spradling and/or Myles aren't better (they most assuredly have to be) Pullen will handle for 40 mins against good pressure teams.  As far as I can see, Irving got minutes because he can fight through a pick.  He was beyond terrible everytime he had the ball in the postseason.

But that is far from my biggest concern for those two; much more importantly can either improve their shot to be a legit threat from behind the arc and hit over 30%?  Russel's 21% and Irvings 24% are the biggest concerns I have with either at this point.

Agreed.  We need the offguard position to just be efficient.  between Spradling, Russell, Irving & McGruder...just get a rotation of guys who can knockdown open looks and not turn it over.  The make-up of our team will be fairly similar to KU of last year.  We need a Reed-Morningstar-Taylor type of rotation to develop amoungst those guys.  Pullen is the PG.  Period.  He's going to want it, and none of those guys can beat him out for it.

[CNS]

Unless our Canadian has good vision, Pullz has to be our PG.  Jake sees very well.  Irving and Nick look like they have to think about dribbling.  I agree that Jake will be the man in pressure games, and prolly all others too.

[kso_FAN]

Unless our Canadian has good vision, Pullz has to be our PG.  Jake sees very well.  Irving and Nick look like they have to think about dribbling.  I agree that Jake will be the man in pressure games, and prolly all others too.

Yeah, it will be interesting to see how Myles fits in the mix.  I hope he's good enough to at least contribute.

[steve dave]

Unless our Canadian has good vision, Pullz has to be our PG.  Jake sees very well.  Irving and Nick look like they have to think about dribbling.  I agree that Jake will be the man in pressure games, and prolly all others too.

Yeah, when Irving has the ball I cringe.  He acts like he wants nothing to do with actually touching it.  

[DILLIGAF]

Unless our Canadian has good vision, Pullz has to be our PG.  Jake sees very well.  Irving and Nick look like they have to think about dribbling.  I agree that Jake will be the man in pressure games, and prolly all others too.

Yeah, it will be interesting to see how Myles fits in the mix.  I hope he's good enough to at least contribute.

We have serious trouble with a press at times and Denis was the only thing that kept them from completely pulling our pants down again and again when facing one.  God help us if Myles isn't capable of filling that role.   That's unless Frank decided to use some of our length in help now that he can't just rely on Denis, he gave our guards no help in the past.   

[chum1]

If Spradling and/or Myles aren't better (they most assuredly have to be) Pullen will handle for 40 mins against good pressure teams.  As far as I can see, Irving got minutes because he can fight through a pick.

Spralding is too big to expect that.  Maybe we hit the lottery with Myles.  Pullen can’t carry the team against pressure like Clemente could.  Irving wasn't in there solely because he's a defensive stopper.  He was truly the second option at PG behind Clemente, not Pullen.  There's no one else.

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.  And Frank loves Irving.

[CNS]

Unless our Canadian has good vision, Pullz has to be our PG.  Jake sees very well.  Irving and Nick look like they have to think about dribbling.  I agree that Jake will be the man in pressure games, and prolly all others too.

Yeah, it will be interesting to see how Myles fits in the mix.  I hope he's good enough to at least contribute.

We have serious trouble with a press at times and Denis was the only thing that kept them from completely pulling our pants down again and again when facing one.  God help us if Myles isn't capable of filling that role.   That's unless Frank decided to use some of our length in help now that he can't just rely on Denis, he gave our guards no help in the past.   

Frank will def have to emphasize parts of the game this year that he didn't have to last year.  You are absolutely right re: the press break, which will no doubt be an emphasis.  I think Frank relied on Denis to handle things like that, and chose to prioritize other things.

We didn't see any real organized press break last year.  We definitely will this year, unless our Canadian is amazing.

[CNS]

If Spradling and/or Myles aren't better (they most assuredly have to be) Pullen will handle for 40 mins against good pressure teams.  As far as I can see, Irving got minutes because he can fight through a pick.

Spralding is too big to expect that.  Maybe we hit the lottery with Myles.  Pullen can’t carry the team against pressure like Clemente could.  Irving wasn't in there solely because he's a defensive stopper.  He was truly the second option at PG behind Clemente, not Pullen.  There's no one else.

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.  And Frank loves Irving.

You can't put a shitty ball handler at PG just because Jake is better at the 2.

[michigancat]

I think Spradling will be good at dribbling because he's white and did a bunch of pistol pete drills.

[chum1]

Why do people think Irving is a shitty ball handler?  He played in 33 games, 10 min per, and had 15 TOs.

[kso_FAN]

Why do people think Irving is a shitty ball handler?  He played in 33 games, 10 min per, and had 15 TOs.

Had the same question. 

[michigancat]

Why do people think Irving is a shitty ball handler?  He played in 33 games, 10 min per, and had 15 TOs.

fairly high TO Rate + really low Usage rate.

When he was in the game, Pullen or Clem were pretty much always at the 1.

[steve dave]

All I ever remember him doing is getting the ball passed to him and, if he wasn't wide open, immediately looking for someone to pass it to in a very panicky way. When he was forced to dribble he also looked very pannicky.  Could be a good ballhandler and just has very low confidence and very high freeking-out-iness.  This is VHBBIQ analysis from VHBBIQ poster sd so don't try to break it down unless you have the skills to pay the bills. 

[sys]

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.

this is the most Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) phog/gpc/goEMAW talking point available for 2010-2011.  just because pullen is good at hitting 3s coming off picks doesn't mean he's not a pg.  he's been a pg his entire life, until he was moved to the combo pg slot to accommodate clemente.  and even then, for those of you with better memories than hypocephalic badgers, most posters, both emaw and anti-emaw, bitched that martin was a Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) for not having the two reversed until the midpoint of clemente's senior year.

[kso_FAN]

When you compare Irving to Russell and McGruder, plus Clemente's first year and Pullen's first year, its really hard to see he's absolutely terrible OR any good.  About all I can say is that in a limited role he did pretty much what he was asked to do.  Again, the biggest concern that comes through is hitting shots, same with Russell.  Granted, not a ton of assists, but I think he was asked to not do too much.  

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=denis-clemente&denis-clemente=2008-2009&jacob-pullen=2007-2008&p1=rodney-mcgruder&p2=martavious-irving&p3=nick-russell&p4=jacob-pullen

[kso_FAN]

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.

this is the most Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) phog/gpc/goEMAW talking point available for 2010-2011.  just because pullen is good at hitting 3s coming off picks doesn't mean he's not a pg.  he's been a pg his entire life, until he was moved to the combo pg slot to accommodate clemente.  and even then, for those of you with better memories than hypocephalic badgers, most posters, both emaw and anti-emaw, bitched that martin was a Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) for not having the two reversed until the midpoint of clemente's senior year.

Good points.  Its always fun to go back and look at recruiting of these guys.

http://kansasstate.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=604862
 

Jacob Pullen
Jacob Pullen
6-foot-1, 175-pound point guard
Maywood, Ill.
Three-star rating, No. 13 prospect in Illinois
The book on Pullen: A true point guard, Pullen stuck with his commitment to K-State despite offers from Iowa State, Marquette, Miami (Fla.), Notre Dame, Purdue, South Carolina and Xavier, among others. Pullen, who averaged 21 points, eight assists and five steals per contest, was present for Madness in Manhattan and was thrilled with the event at Bramlage. "It was great. It was a beautiful atmosphere," he said. "I could fall in love with this quick. I'm in a rush to get here now. I might run here from graduation in my cap and gown straight here."

[catzacker]

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.

this is the most Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) phog/gpc/goEMAW talking point available for 2010-2011.  just because pullen is good at hitting 3s coming off picks doesn't mean he's not a pg.  he's been a pg his entire life, until he was moved to the combo pg slot to accommodate clemente.  and even then, for those of you with better memories than hypocephalic badgers, most posters, both emaw and anti-emaw, bitched that martin was a Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) for not having the two reversed until the midpoint of clemente's senior year.

I kind of agree with this.  Denis and jake's jr year A/T were both 1.3.  denis' ended up being 2.1 last year.  jake will need to make that same jump.  that being said, imo, it's going to be easier for denis to make that jump (with jake playing along side him) than it will be for jake to make that jump with fracking irving and russell playing along side him.  we'll see if the frontcourt picks up the slack as well.

[chum1]

Are people actually assuming that Pullen will play PG next year?  That's not where he's best.

this is the most Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) phog/gpc/goEMAW talking point available for 2010-2011.  just because pullen is good at hitting 3s coming off picks doesn't mean he's not a pg.

No, it's his lack of point guard skills mean that.  He's not the greatest ball handler and not a good passer.  Pullen is a HS 1, college 2, and not an NBA player at all.  Very typical.

[sys]

No, it's his lack of point guard skills mean that.  He's not the greatest ball handler and not a good passer.  Pullen is a HS 1, college 2, and not an NBA player at all.  Very typical.

remember when jeffrey attacked clemente for not being a good ball handler, and pissclams got excited because he hated clemente?  fun times in embarrassing moments for elite posters.

[Dr Rick Daris]

No, it's his lack of point guard skills mean that.  He's not the greatest ball handler and not a good passer.  Pullen is a HS 1, college 2, and not an NBA player at all.  Very typical.

remember when jeffrey attacked clemente for not being a good ball handler, and pissclams got excited because he hated clemente?  fun times in embarrassing moments for elite posters.

remember when clams told me that kstate would be better w/out clemente? good times.

http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=432.0

[chum1]

No, it's his lack of point guard skills mean that.  He's not the greatest ball handler and not a good passer.  Pullen is a HS 1, college 2, and not an NBA player at all.  Very typical.

remember when jeffrey attacked clemente for not being a good ball handler, and pissclams got excited because he hated clemente?  fun times in embarrassing moments for elite posters.

So, Frank will have Pullen push the ball up the floor so that he can kick it out to Irving?  Or maybe he is going to either change his philsophy or his love of Irving?