Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....

[MakeItRain]

Just listened to the ESPN and CBS college basketball podcasts and a couple of interesting re-alignment notes.

-The CBS podcast talked about Creighton as a target for the Catholic 7 or The Big Priest as they called them.  That would hurt the valley in a big way.  The only other conference to lost their most profitable team to this point is the Big East.  The ESPN also talked about Creighton as a possibility to move.
-The ESPN podcast had Mike Brey & Jamie Dixon on and they told a couple of secrets they probably shouldn't have told:
  +Brey said that Notre Dame talked about breaking away with the catholic schools, and it first came up a couple of years ago.  They didn't because as great as it would have been for basketball it would have been a fiscal disaster for the rest of their Olympic sports.
  +After Pitt announced the move to the ACC Dixon and Brey talked about how Brey heard ND was next to the ACC.  This may throw some water on just how much the Big 12 was ever a player for ND
  +Dixon said that Depaul and Marquette were added to the Big East a decade ago when VT and BC left with the intent that the other catholic schools could easily band together and leave the Big East if need be and have the proper number of schools to maintain the auto bid.

[MadCat]

Just listened to the ESPN and CBS college basketball podcasts and a couple of interesting re-alignment notes.

-The CBS podcast talked about Creighton as a target for the Catholic 7 or The Big Priest as they called them.  That would hurt the valley in a big way.  The only other conference to lost their most profitable team to this point is the Big East.  The ESPN also talked about Creighton as a possibility to move.
-The ESPN podcast had Mike Brey & Jamie Dixon on and they told a couple of secrets they probably shouldn't have told:
  +Brey said that Notre Dame talked about breaking away with the catholic schools, and it first came up a couple of years ago.  They didn't because as great as it would have been for basketball it would have been a fiscal disaster for the rest of their Olympic sports.
  +After Pitt announced the move to the ACC Dixon and Brey talked about how Brey heard ND was next to the ACC.  This may throw some water on just how much the Big 12 was ever a player for ND
  +Dixon said that Depaul and Marquette were added to the Big East a decade ago when VT and BC left with the intent that the other catholic schools could easily band together and leave the Big East if need be and have the proper number of schools to maintain the auto bid.

Do you think they foresaw all the conference turmoil or do you think there was some dissent in the Big East?

[ManBearTurkey]

Currie went out of his way to note how we don't need a stinking Championship game in his letter over the weekend:

Looking Back at the Texas game- a National Impact for K-State
Obviously clinching the Big 12 Championship at home on December 1 with a decisive victory over the No. 18 Longhorns was an extremely special moment for the worldwide K-State Nation. Personally I felt that the energy and passion of our crowd was the very best I have experienced in my four years here and painted an incredible picture of LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium for the national TV audience. Did you see the awesome ABC TV shots from the overhead camera?
 
The K-State-Texas game also gave us an interesting snapshot of the national appetite for Big 12 football as well as some of the pros and cons of conference championship games.
 
Only the SEC Championship game, with its dedicated late afternoon time slot out-rated the K-State-Texas game. Our television rating of 3.3 beat the direct head-to-head competition of the Big 10 Championship game between Nebraska and Wisconsin (2.9 rating). The primetime Friday evening Pac-12 Championship between Stanford and UCLA scored a 3.0 rating while the Florida State - Georgia Tech ACC Championship rated a 1.2.
 
The Big Red fans of Wisconsin and Nebraska combined for a total announced attendance of 41,260 in Indianapolis' Lucas Oil Stadium, while the Pac-12 announced 31,622 for their championship game at Stanford's on-campus stadium.
 
Of course here at LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium a completely sold-out crowd of 50,912 created an incredible scene for the national audience. The image of Willie on the press-box as the fog rolled in is a lifetime one for our fans as well as the family celebration and wonderful moment of our captains hoisting the Big 12 Championship trophy high over their heads.
 

TL:DNR --

We had better ratings and attendance than everyone except the SEC. So those with championship games can eat spoiled meat goat. We are not going to expand just to get a championship game.

[MadCat]

Just think of how many people will be watching the Dillons Supperbowl with NC implications on the line! 

[Mr Bread]

Currie went out of his way to note how we don't need a stinking Championship game in his letter over the weekend:

Looking Back at the Texas game- a National Impact for K-State
Obviously clinching the Big 12 Championship at home on December 1 with a decisive victory over the No. 18 Longhorns was an extremely special moment for the worldwide K-State Nation. Personally I felt that the energy and passion of our crowd was the very best I have experienced in my four years here and painted an incredible picture of LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium for the national TV audience. Did you see the awesome ABC TV shots from the overhead camera?
 
The K-State-Texas game also gave us an interesting snapshot of the national appetite for Big 12 football as well as some of the pros and cons of conference championship games.
 
Only the SEC Championship game, with its dedicated late afternoon time slot out-rated the K-State-Texas game. Our television rating of 3.3 beat the direct head-to-head competition of the Big 10 Championship game between Nebraska and Wisconsin (2.9 rating). The primetime Friday evening Pac-12 Championship between Stanford and UCLA scored a 3.0 rating while the Florida State - Georgia Tech ACC Championship rated a 1.2.
 
The Big Red fans of Wisconsin and Nebraska combined for a total announced attendance of 41,260 in Indianapolis' Lucas Oil Stadium, while the Pac-12 announced 31,622 for their championship game at Stanford's on-campus stadium.
 
Of course here at LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium a completely sold-out crowd of 50,912 created an incredible scene for the national audience. The image of Willie on the press-box as the fog rolled in is a lifetime one for our fans as well as the family celebration and wonderful moment of our captains hoisting the Big 12 Championship trophy high over their heads.
 

TL:DNR --

We had better ratings and attendance than everyone except the SEC. So those with championship games can eat spoiled meat goat. We are not going to expand just to get a championship game.

That Big Ten game was more of a joke than is typical.  The two teams ahead of Wisconsin were ineligible.  Would have probably been signficantly better (ratings-wise) with an undefeated Urban Meyer-led Ohio State (and possible NC implications on the line). 

[TheHamburglar]

Currie went out of his way to note how we don't need a stinking Championship game in his letter over the weekend:

Looking Back at the Texas game- a National Impact for K-State
Obviously clinching the Big 12 Championship at home on December 1 with a decisive victory over the No. 18 Longhorns was an extremely special moment for the worldwide K-State Nation. Personally I felt that the energy and passion of our crowd was the very best I have experienced in my four years here and painted an incredible picture of LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium for the national TV audience. Did you see the awesome ABC TV shots from the overhead camera?
 
The K-State-Texas game also gave us an interesting snapshot of the national appetite for Big 12 football as well as some of the pros and cons of conference championship games.
 
Only the SEC Championship game, with its dedicated late afternoon time slot out-rated the K-State-Texas game. Our television rating of 3.3 beat the direct head-to-head competition of the Big 10 Championship game between Nebraska and Wisconsin (2.9 rating). The primetime Friday evening Pac-12 Championship between Stanford and UCLA scored a 3.0 rating while the Florida State - Georgia Tech ACC Championship rated a 1.2.
 
The Big Red fans of Wisconsin and Nebraska combined for a total announced attendance of 41,260 in Indianapolis' Lucas Oil Stadium, while the Pac-12 announced 31,622 for their championship game at Stanford's on-campus stadium.
 
Of course here at LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium a completely sold-out crowd of 50,912 created an incredible scene for the national audience. The image of Willie on the press-box as the fog rolled in is a lifetime one for our fans as well as the family celebration and wonderful moment of our captains hoisting the Big 12 Championship trophy high over their heads.
 

TL:DNR --

We had better ratings and attendance than everyone except the SEC. So those with championship games can eat spoiled meat goat. We are not going to expand just to get a championship game.

That Big Ten game was more of a joke than is typical.  The two teams ahead of Wisconsin were ineligible.  Would have probably been signficantly better (ratings-wise) with an undefeated Urban Meyer-led Ohio State (and possible NC implications on the line).

We know that.  Our dumbass AD/Big 12 offices do not. 

[Mr Bread]

Currie went out of his way to note how we don't need a stinking Championship game in his letter over the weekend:

Looking Back at the Texas game- a National Impact for K-State
Obviously clinching the Big 12 Championship at home on December 1 with a decisive victory over the No. 18 Longhorns was an extremely special moment for the worldwide K-State Nation. Personally I felt that the energy and passion of our crowd was the very best I have experienced in my four years here and painted an incredible picture of LHC LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium for the national TV audience. Did you see the awesome ABC TV shots from the overhead camera?
 
The K-State-Texas game also gave us an interesting snapshot of the national appetite for Big 12 football as well as some of the pros and cons of conference championship games.
 
Only the SEC Championship game, with its dedicated late afternoon time slot out-rated the K-State-Texas game. Our television rating of 3.3 beat the direct head-to-head competition of the Big 10 Championship game between Nebraska and Wisconsin (2.9 rating). The primetime Friday evening Pac-12 Championship between Stanford and UCLA scored a 3.0 rating while the Florida State - Georgia Tech ACC Championship rated a 1.2.
 
The Big Red fans of Wisconsin and Nebraska combined for a total announced attendance of 41,260 in Indianapolis' Lucas Oil Stadium, while the Pac-12 announced 31,622 for their championship game at Stanford's on-campus stadium.
 
Of course here at LHC LHC LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium a completely sold-out crowd of 50,912 created an incredible scene for the national audience. The image of Willie on the press-box as the fog rolled in is a lifetime one for our fans as well as the family celebration and wonderful moment of our captains hoisting the Big 12 Championship trophy high over their heads.
 

TL:DNR --

We had better ratings and attendance than everyone except the SEC. So those with championship games can eat spoiled meat goat. We are not going to expand just to get a championship game.

That Big Ten game was more of a joke than is typical.  The two teams ahead of Wisconsin were ineligible.  Would have probably been signficantly better (ratings-wise) with an undefeated Urban Meyer-led Ohio State (and possible NC implications on the line).

We know that.  Our dumbass AD/Big 12 offices do not.

Learfield!

[Ira Hayes]

On the subject of: "How important is college basketball?":

Stewart Mandel ?@slmandel
Why are there so many bowls? Overnight ratings from Sat: New Mexico Bowl (ESPN): 1.9. Butler upsets No. 1 Indiana (CBS): 1.5.

 

[GoodForAnother]

On the subject of: "How important is college basketball?":

Stewart Mandel ?@slmandel
Why are there so many bowls? Overnight ratings from Sat: New Mexico Bowl (ESPN): 1.9. Butler upsets No. 1 Indiana (CBS): 1.5.

 

To be fair, the New Mexico Bowl kicked ass.

[Panjandrum]

On the subject of: "How important is college basketball?":

Stewart Mandel ?@slmandel
Why are there so many bowls? Overnight ratings from Sat: New Mexico Bowl (ESPN): 1.9. Butler upsets No. 1 Indiana (CBS): 1.5.

 

To be fair, the New Mexico Bowl kicked ass.

Yeah, but I had no idea IU/Butler were even playing.  I was actually watching the FCS playoffs, and I saw how close the game was on Twitter, so I switched over in OT.

I'm very much an outlier on this site, but I generally only watch KSU and select Big 12 basketball games before January.  After that, I'll watch games from other conferences.  Until then, I'm pretty much dedicated football.

So, I guess there are probably a lot of other people like me.

[GoodForAnother]

On the subject of: "How important is college basketball?":

Stewart Mandel ?@slmandel
Why are there so many bowls? Overnight ratings from Sat: New Mexico Bowl (ESPN): 1.9. Butler upsets No. 1 Indiana (CBS): 1.5.

 

To be fair, the New Mexico Bowl kicked ass.

Yeah, but I had no idea IU/Butler were even playing.  I was actually watching the FCS playoffs, and I saw how close the game was on Twitter, so I switched over in OT.

I'm very much an outlier on this site, but I generally only watch KSU and select Big 12 basketball games before January.  After that, I'll watch games from other conferences.  Until then, I'm pretty much dedicated football.

So, I guess there are probably a lot of other people like me.

I'm the same way re: basketball before January, and actually did the same thing as you on Saturday...was watching the NM bowl and saw that IU/Butler was close on the bottom line and watched the last few minutes.

[Ira Hayes]

Fact is that more people watched Arizona play Nevada in football than watched the top ranked college basketball team in the nation.

As the two previous posters indicated, it is probably because the last few minutes are the only interesting part of a basketball game. What a shitty sport.

[EllRobersonisInnocent]

I only watch sporting events that I bet on.....which is most games on tv

[MakeItRain]

There's absolutely no surprise that the bowl game got a better rating than that basketball, literally none.  There are many more college football fans than college basketball fans, that qualifies as the no crap statement of the year.  If there is a surprise it is that the ratings were relatively close.  That speaks to the bloated nature of bowl season much more than it says anything about college basketball.

[deputy dawg]

Listened to Blair Kerkhoff on 810 via podcast, and he said he heard that basketball makes up about 15% of the payments stemming from the TV contracts.  This may have been observed somewhere in the billion+ pages of this thread, but that sounds remarkably low. 

Question:  Is there revenue sources OUTSIDE of ESPN/Fox contracts where BB revenue flows to individual schools, or is BB only worth 15%?

[Pete]

Listened to Blair Kerkhoff on 810 via podcast, and he said he heard that basketball makes up about 15% of the payments stemming from the TV contracts.  This may have been observed somewhere in the billion+ pages of this thread, but that sounds remarkably low. 

Question:  Is there revenue sources OUTSIDE of ESPN/Fox contracts where BB revenue flows to individual schools, or is BB only worth 15%?

The NCAA tourney makes a rough ridin' fortune, but the NCAA keeps a bunch of it. 

[TheHamburglar]

Listened to Blair Kerkhoff on 810 via podcast, and he said he heard that basketball makes up about 15% of the payments stemming from the TV contracts.  This may have been observed somewhere in the billion+ pages of this thread, but that sounds remarkably low. 

Question:  Is there revenue sources OUTSIDE of ESPN/Fox contracts where BB revenue flows to individual schools, or is BB only worth 15%?

Depends on the school/conference.  KU's Tier 3 basketball revenue is well above 15% of their Big12 TV payout.

Another data point: In the Big East contract that they turned down last year the basketball only schools would have got $2.43MM per year and the football schools would have got an additional $11.37MM for a total of $13.8MM.  In that contract, BB was worth 17.6% of the total money for the full FB/BB members.  Also, the current expiring contract they have pays the BB only schools $1.5MM and full FB/BB schools $3.125MM.  That makes BB worth 48% of the current contract for the full members.  Shows you which sport is gaining momentum and which is not.

[Pete]

Listened to Blair Kerkhoff on 810 via podcast, and he said he heard that basketball makes up about 15% of the payments stemming from the TV contracts.  This may have been observed somewhere in the billion+ pages of this thread, but that sounds remarkably low. 

Question:  Is there revenue sources OUTSIDE of ESPN/Fox contracts where BB revenue flows to individual schools, or is BB only worth 15%?

Depends on the school/conference.  KU's Tier 3 basketball revenue is well above 15% of their Big12 TV payout.

Another data point: In the Big East contract that they turned down last year the basketball only schools would have got $2.43MM per year and the football schools would have got an additional $11.37MM for a total of $13.8MM.  In that contract, BB was worth 17.6% of the total money for the full FB/BB members.  Also, the current expiring contract they have pays the BB only schools $1.5MM and full FB/BB schools $3.125MM.  That makes BB worth 48% of the current contract for the full members.  Shows you which sport is gaining momentum and which is not.

Did I read that right, did you just suggest that basketball was gaining in momentum and you are using the Big East as the evidence for this?  If so, then that's Apples and Oranges in my opinion.  The Big East football schools are stink on fire.  They are moving south in value as quality teams leave, and basketball (by merely standing still with good teams) is moving north simply from a proportional standpoint.

That "super duper yowza wowza great basketball conference" the basketball schools are going to form won't bring more than $3M per school, and probably more like $2M per school.   Meanwhile, ACC schools (the poorest of the remaining big 5 conferences) are getting $17M and it escalates (albeit slowly) every year for the next 14.

[ChiComCat]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

[Pete]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

Oh.

Then I did NOT read that right.  Sorry, TheHamburglar.

[TheHamburglar]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

Oh.

Then I did NOT read that right.  Sorry, TheHamburglar.

Yeah, I worded that funny with their current contract not being their most recent offer. They currently have 48% and turned down an extrnsion offer that put it 17%.

[Pete]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

Oh.

Then I did NOT read that right.  Sorry, TheHamburglar.

Yeah, I worded that funny with their current contract not being their most recent offer. They currently have 48% and turned down an extrnsion offer that put it 17%.

It's going to be very, very fun to watch what they get in their fancy new fabricated conference.   

[TheHamburglar]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

Oh.

Then I did NOT read that right.  Sorry, TheHamburglar.

Yeah, I worded that funny with their current contract not being their most recent offer. They currently have 48% and turned down an extrnsion offer that put it 17%.

It's going to be very, very fun to watch what they get in their fancy new fabricated conference.

I know SBNation is very hit and miss, but this is a Villinova write up from a guy that seems to know what he is talking about with tournament money factored in.

http://www.vuhoops.com/big-east/2012/12/17/3773760/can-we-afford-this-catholic-7-villanova-conference-change-big-east

[Pete]

I think he meant the opposite, Pete.  As in, they currently get 48% and that will go down to 17%

Oh.

Then I did NOT read that right.  Sorry, TheHamburglar.

Yeah, I worded that funny with their current contract not being their most recent offer. They currently have 48% and turned down an extrnsion offer that put it 17%.

It's going to be very, very fun to watch what they get in their fancy new fabricated conference.

I know SBNation is very hit and miss, but this is a Villinova write up from a guy that seems to know what he is talking about with tournament money factored in.

http://www.vuhoops.com/big-east/2012/12/17/3773760/can-we-afford-this-catholic-7-villanova-conference-change-big-east

Ya, that 2.8-3.8 number that they throw out INCLUDES the NCAA tourney money, it's not just TV.  LOL, they are going to get buried.

Television revenue could be less than $1 million per year, but optimistic estimates place it at least slightly over $1 million, while the NCAA tournament revenues are expected to decrease in the short term.

[Chico]

Ya, that 2.8-3.8 number that they throw out INCLUDES the NCAA tourney money, it's not just TV.  LOL, they are going to get buried.

Agreed Pete.  The Catholic 7 are going to have to somehow find another revenue source for this to work. At this point, even opening up a theme park should be under consideration or they will end up merging with CUSA in 3-5 years.