Israel - Hamas peace process

[Emo EMAW]

The US could end it by cutting off the money and restricting all travel.  But they will never do that.

Israel is much more important to humanity on a global scale than their opponents.  Worst case scenario it would be better to turn their local enemies to glass than to lose Israel. 

[Emo EMAW]

Not trolling, just having a little laugh at all the armchair generals who believe that Israel doesn't know the best way to go about this.

The "proportionate response" crowd (I think our venerable John Kerry has been playing that up a lot lately) is pretty absurd on its face. Does that mean Israel, instead of a targeted ground invasion, should just hurl rockets into Gaza without warning, the same as Hamas?

I would think that if Israel knew the best way to go about this, then the conflict would be over by now.

That's assuming that the best way to go about this would 1) end the conflict, and 2) not piss off people they can't risk pissing off. 

I've mentioned before that I believe that nothing that Israel is capable of doing by itself can end the conflict.  Still waiting for someone to suggest something (going on several pages now).

I asked if you thought Israel should do something about West Bank settlements. Not saying stopping and removing existing settlements would fix things, but maybe be a nice, fair step to some form of peace?

Ya Ima think on that one a bit and respond tomorrow.  If I didn't think you would take it the wrong way I would even say I might ponder it over a some brie and a nice glass of cabernet.   

[Dugout DickStone]

The US could end it by cutting off the money and restricting all travel.  But they will never do that.

Israel is much more important to humanity on a global scale than their opponents.  Worst case scenario it would be better to turn their local enemies to glass than to lose Israel.

said one Israeli to the other

[michigancat]

Not trolling, just having a little laugh at all the armchair generals who believe that Israel doesn't know the best way to go about this.

The "proportionate response" crowd (I think our venerable John Kerry has been playing that up a lot lately) is pretty absurd on its face. Does that mean Israel, instead of a targeted ground invasion, should just hurl rockets into Gaza without warning, the same as Hamas?

I would think that if Israel knew the best way to go about this, then the conflict would be over by now.

That's assuming that the best way to go about this would 1) end the conflict, and 2) not piss off people they can't risk pissing off. 

I've mentioned before that I believe that nothing that Israel is capable of doing by itself can end the conflict.  Still waiting for someone to suggest something (going on several pages now).

I asked if you thought Israel should do something about West Bank settlements. Not saying stopping and removing existing settlements would fix things, but maybe be a nice, fair step to some form of peace?

Ya Ima think on that one a bit and respond tomorrow.  If I didn't think you would take it the wrong way I would even say I might ponder it over a some brie and a nice glass of cabernet.   

I'm honestly not sure if this is the first time you've pondered Israeli settlements before or not. Congrats?

[Rage Against the McKee]

Not trolling, just having a little laugh at all the armchair generals who believe that Israel doesn't know the best way to go about this.

The "proportionate response" crowd (I think our venerable John Kerry has been playing that up a lot lately) is pretty absurd on its face. Does that mean Israel, instead of a targeted ground invasion, should just hurl rockets into Gaza without warning, the same as Hamas?

I would think that if Israel knew the best way to go about this, then the conflict would be over by now.

That's assuming that the best way to go about this would 1) end the conflict, and 2) not piss off people they can't risk pissing off. 

I've mentioned before that I believe that nothing that Israel is capable of doing by itself can end the conflict.  Still waiting for someone to suggest something (going on several pages now).

I asked if you thought Israel should do something about West Bank settlements. Not saying stopping and removing existing settlements would fix things, but maybe be a nice, fair step to some form of peace?

Ya Ima think on that one a bit and respond tomorrow.  If I didn't think you would take it the wrong way I would even say I might ponder it over a some brie and a nice glass of cabernet.   

Look at you, acting like a sophisticated adult.

[felix rex]

The US could end it by cutting off the money and restricting all travel.  But they will never do that.

Israel is much more important to humanity on a global scale than their opponents.  Worst case scenario it would be better to turn their local enemies to glass than to lose Israel.

I'm guessing this has all been some admirable parody now and am giving you credit for reeling me in. A tip o' the cap to you, good sir.

[michigancat]

The US could end it by cutting off the money and restricting all travel.  But they will never do that.

Israel is much more important to humanity on a global scale than their opponents.  Worst case scenario it would be better to turn their local enemies to glass than to lose Israel.

I'm guessing this has all been some admirable parody now and am giving you credit for reeling me in. A tip o' the cap to you, good sir.

yeah

[Emo EMAW]

Not trolling, just having a little laugh at all the armchair generals who believe that Israel doesn't know the best way to go about this.

The "proportionate response" crowd (I think our venerable John Kerry has been playing that up a lot lately) is pretty absurd on its face. Does that mean Israel, instead of a targeted ground invasion, should just hurl rockets into Gaza without warning, the same as Hamas?

I would think that if Israel knew the best way to go about this, then the conflict would be over by now.

That's assuming that the best way to go about this would 1) end the conflict, and 2) not piss off people they can't risk pissing off. 

I've mentioned before that I believe that nothing that Israel is capable of doing by itself can end the conflict.  Still waiting for someone to suggest something (going on several pages now).

I asked if you thought Israel should do something about West Bank settlements. Not saying stopping and removing existing settlements would fix things, but maybe be a nice, fair step to some form of peace?

Ya Ima think on that one a bit and respond tomorrow.  If I didn't think you would take it the wrong way I would even say I might ponder it over a some brie and a nice glass of cabernet.   

I'm honestly not sure if this is the first time you've pondered Israeli settlements before or not. Congrats?

I mean I know what my visceral reaction is.  Sometimes that's good enough.  Here's the crux of my pondering:  if the UN recognizes the State of Palestine, why don't they do anything about the settlements?  They must either 1) not actually recognize it as a sovereign state, or 2) not see anything wrong with the settlements.  I guess bonus #3 is they DNGAF. 

[michigancat]

just gonna assume you're trolling

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

Haven't they evicted West Bank settlements something like several dozen times? Doesn't seem to be working...

But even if Israel were to cede control of the entire West Bank, do you really in your heart of hearts believe that that would make a damned bit of difference in ending Palestinian aggression?

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

Not really worth its own thread, but is anyone ever astonished that John "I fought honorably in Vietnam but my comrades committed war crimes" Kerry is our Secretary of State? The guy has the personality and intelligence of a block of wood. http://freebeacon.com/national-security/kerry-to-mother-of-fallen-idf-soldier-hows-your-day/

[DQ12]

Israel is much more important to humanity on a global scale than their opponents.  Worst case scenario it would be better to turn their local enemies to glass than to lose Israel.

This one is the best one.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

This thread is a clinic on the socratic method of bbs'ing.

[felix rex]

This presser is an appropriately emblematic clusterfuck.

[michigancat]

This presser is an appropriately emblematic clusterfuck.

which one?

[felix rex]

The US/Egypt/UN/Arab League one. It ended 20 minutes or so ago.

[felix rex]

They had 11 hours to set up, and the sound guys still had the mics mumped up. Kerry's kept cutting out and Ban Ki-moon kept coughing into his. And we had 20 minutes of bonus negotiation over who got to use each podium. Kerry is tall, so the Egyptian FM wanted the thickest, shortest podium so he'd look taller, and Al Araby didn't want to stand next to Kerry because he's already short and then he also got stuck with the tall podium. For some reason, the flag situation became such an issue that multiple staff were called in to resolve it (Al Araby was a late surprise arrival, so digging up his flag and a stand to boot was apparently a crisis). As a result, the super bored press that was stuck in the room started tweeting pics of the changing flag arrangements and trying to interpret some meaning (they didn't notice that Al Araby's was on a stool to match the height or that the UN flag "hood ornament" thing was scotch taped to the top of the pole, because it wouldn't stay).

And that's the just the stupid presser crap that "trickled up" from the support staff.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[michigancat]

that's a great report, felix

[felix rex]

Anyway, back to more important things: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/25/a-new-facebook-page-dedicated-to-the-idf-is-being-flooded-with-sexy-selfies.html

"Most of the pictures feature women with 'I <3 IDF' emblazoned on various body parts, but the page celebrated 15,000 likes by featuring a photo of a girl who had written 'eff Hamas'on her butt cheeks."

[felix rex]

that's a great report, felix

I take my role as the goEMAW foreign correspondent very, very srsly

[felix rex]

Also, to clarify, this was technically a UN press conference. However, as soon as Ban delivered his initial remarks, he literally dropped the mic and his entire entourage split 10 minutes into a 45 minute press conference. His aides told us "he had a plane to catch". Srsly. That's what they told us.

[michigancat]

Anyway, back to more important things: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/25/a-new-facebook-page-dedicated-to-the-idf-is-being-flooded-with-sexy-selfies.html

"Most of the pictures feature women with 'I <3 IDF' emblazoned on various body parts, but the page celebrated 15,000 likes by featuring a photo of a girl who had written 'eff Hamas'on her butt cheeks."

what a wacky world we live in

[Cartierfor3]

The US could end it by cutting off the money and restricting all travel.  But they will never do that.

This wouldn't end it long term IMO

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

Here are some helpful Hamas talking points. http://www.memri.org/report/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/8076.htm

Following are excerpts from the guidelines:

"Anyone killed or martyred is to be called a civilian from Gaza or Palestine, before we talk about his status in jihad or his military rank. Don't forget to always add 'innocent civilian' or 'innocent citizen' in your description of those killed in Israeli attacks on Gaza.

"Begin [your reports of] news of resistance actions with the phrase 'In response to the cruel Israeli attack,' and conclude with the phrase 'This many people have been martyred since Israel launched its aggression against Gaza.' Be sure to always perpetuate the principle of 'the role of the occupation is attack, and we in Palestine are fulfilling [the role of] the reaction.'

"Beware of spreading rumors from Israeli spokesmen, particularly those that harm the home front. Be wary regarding accepting the occupation's version [of events]. You must always cast doubts on this [version], disprove it, and treat it as false.

"Avoid publishing pictures of rockets fired into Israel from [Gaza] city centers. This [would] provide a pretext for attacking residential areas in the Gaza Strip. Do not publish or share photos or video clips showing rocket launching sites or the movement of resistance [forces] in Gaza.

"To the administrators of news pages on Facebook: Do not publish close-ups of masked men with heavy weapons, so that your page will not be shut down [by Facebook] on the claim that you are inciting violence. In your coverage, be sure that you say: 'The locally manufactured shells fired by the resistance are a natural response to the Israeli occupation that deliberately fires rockets against civilians in the West Bank and Gaza'..."

Additionally, the interior ministry prepared a series of suggestions specifically for Palestinian activists who speak to Westerners via social media. The ministry emphasizes that conversations with them should be conducted differently from conversations with other Arabs. It stated:

- "When speaking to the West, you must use political, rational, and persuasive discourse, and avoid emotional discourse aimed at begging for sympathy. There are elements with a conscience in the world; you must maintain contact with them and activate them for the benefit of Palestine. Their role is to shame the occupation and expose its violations.

- "Avoid entering into a political argument with a Westerner aimed at convincing him that the Holocaust is a lie and deceit; instead, equate it with Israel's crimes against Palestinian civilians.

- "The narrative of life vs. the narrative of blood: [When speaking] to an Arab friend, start with the number of martyrs. [But when speaking] to a Western friend, start with the number of wounded and dead. Be sure to humanize the Palestinian suffering. Try to paint a picture of the suffering of the civilians in Gaza and the West Bank during the occupation's operations and its bombings of cities and villages.

- "Do not publish photos of military commanders. Do not mention their names in public, and do not praise their achievements in conversations with foreign friends!"

[Kat Kid]

Hamas uses propaganda?  Whoa, if true.