Kansas City things

[The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

for me, its the cost that the money could have been used somewhere else (i know theres a billion hoops to jump through for stuff) that would benefit the city more than a streetcar. i believe its a shiny new toy the city wants to brag about that doesnt offer much tangible benefit to the citizens.

[420seriouscat69]

You mean the construction of it was a clusterfuck?

Yes. I imagine it will be more clustery when it's up and going too.

Why?

Well, it will be on the street, where traffic is. Ppl wil clog up at the stops, etc. I was talking about how hard it already is to get to cosentinos from my place right now. My grocery store and gym. Between all the one way streets, concerts at the midland, the convention center, dumb downtown drivers that don't know where they're going, buses, and now the rail, it will be manic down there. However, I guess that's what you get for living downtown.

[Dub]

You mean the construction of it was a clusterfuck?

Yes. I imagine it will be more clustery when it's up and going too.

Why?

Well, it will be on the street, where traffic is. Ppl wil clog up at the stops, etc. I was talking about how hard it already is to get to cosentinos from my place right now. My grocery store and gym. Between all the one way streets, concerts at the midland, the convention center, dumb downtown drivers that don't know where they're going, buses, and now the rail, it will be manic down there. However, I guess that's what you get for living downtown.

Yeah, that's just called living in a city.

[The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep]

fanning, i think youre looking at this a little too microscopically

[Dub]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

for me, its the cost that the money could have been used somewhere else (i know theres a billion hoops to jump through for stuff) that would benefit the city more than a streetcar. i believe its a shiny new toy the city wants to brag about that doesnt offer much tangible benefit to the citizens.

But if it's strictly paid through a specific sales tax (and eventual fares if they build out a rail) then what's the problem?

['taterblast]

i live downtown so i think it's cool and will use it.

if i didn't live downtown i would have to drive downtown anyway so what's the point?

[Phil Titola]

Streetcar funding breakdown
37M in federal transportation funding... I mean this could be used for other transportation projects in kc or around the country
Remaining 70 million comes from property and sales tax within the TDD... And a fee on surface parking lots. Not general city finds that could be used for other things.

[Dub]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

It's a foot in the door approach to a rail system, which is more convenient than a bus system.  Denver has now low speed/high speed rail, Mall Ride (Basically our version of streetcar) and a complex bus system that travels every block it seems and all are highly used.

[Phil Titola]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

Which one said that?

[star seed 7]

A good portion of the riders will be out of towners. High visibility and a simple fixed line are much easier to navigate for these people. These are also people that are very unlikely to take a city bus anywhere.

Busses have their place, but I don't think they jive with the goals of this line.

[Phil Titola]

You mean the construction of it was a clusterfuck?

Yes. I imagine it will be more clustery when it's up and going too.

Why?

Well, it will be on the street, where traffic is. Ppl wil clog up at the stops, etc. I was talking about how hard it already is to get to cosentinos from my place right now. My grocery store and gym. Between all the one way streets, concerts at the midland, the convention center, dumb downtown drivers that don't know where they're going, buses, and now the rail, it will be manic down there. However, I guess that's what you get for living downtown.

You drive to one life? 

[DQ12]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

Which one said that?

the top three "bus vs. light rail" google responses. 

[DQ12]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

It's a foot in the door approach to a rail system, which is more convenient than a bus system.  Denver has now low speed/high speed rail, Mall Ride (Basically our version of streetcar) and a complex bus system that travels every block it seems and all are highly used.

In what way, exactly?  Aside from it being free.

[420seriouscat69]

You mean the construction of it was a clusterfuck?

Yes. I imagine it will be more clustery when it's up and going too.

Why?

Well, it will be on the street, where traffic is. Ppl wil clog up at the stops, etc. I was talking about how hard it already is to get to cosentinos from my place right now. My grocery store and gym. Between all the one way streets, concerts at the midland, the convention center, dumb downtown drivers that don't know where they're going, buses, and now the rail, it will be manic down there. However, I guess that's what you get for living downtown.

You drive to one life? 

It's been cold. I run there now. I'm not going to run there in the cold. I'm not some peasant. 

[Belvis Noland]

I think the major hang up right now is the cost for a rail system that goes like 2 blocks.

What is that cost?  for you specifically? 

[Phil Titola]

i live downtown so i think it's cool and will use it.

if i didn't live downtown i would have to drive downtown anyway so what's the point?

Here is where I see their benefit. Park once and hit many destinations. Yes they could also do this on the main max but they don't for the most part... Whether due to cost or confusion of where it went or perception. I see a lot more people that let's say go to union station with the kids, instead of now driving to go eat at Johnny's in p&l... They leave the car parked and streetcar there... Then they are more likely to keep exploring the city versus driving point to point to point then home.

[420seriouscat69]

I think the major hang up right now is the cost for a rail system that goes like 2 blocks.

What is that cost?  for you specifically?

I have no clue. Whatever the taxes are.

[Phil Titola]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

It's a foot in the door approach to a rail system, which is more convenient than a bus system.  Denver has now low speed/high speed rail, Mall Ride (Basically our version of streetcar) and a complex bus system that travels every block it seems and all are highly used.

In what way, exactly?  Aside from it being free.

That is not a small benefit. Also fixed rail people know where it's going more easily. I can't fully explain it but there is no doubt that mindset exists.

[Dub]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

It's a foot in the door approach to a rail system, which is more convenient than a bus system.  Denver has now low speed/high speed rail, Mall Ride (Basically our version of streetcar) and a complex bus system that travels every block it seems and all are highly used.

In what way, exactly?  Aside from it being free.

It will help development down there and then the light rail hub will be placed along that line in the future.  Just like other cities have done.

[Emo EMAW]

How much of KCMO's general fund is supported by the 1% income tax?

[Phil Titola]

I think the major hang up right now is the cost for a rail system that goes like 2 blocks.

What is that cost?  for you specifically?

I have no clue. Whatever the taxes are.

1 cent sales tax downtown...additionally If you owned your condo would be about $200 to 300 per year in property tax... If you rent your rent will go up in part to cover that expense from your landlord.

[DQ12]

I don't understand what the main anti-rail reasoning is... 

Is it cost?
Is it something about homeless people?
Is it simply because you wouldn't use it?

What's the main hangup here?

My only hang up is that I think it makes very little sense from a transportation perspective.  I looked at blogs like Totola suggested, and I couldn't find anything beyond "perception" as reasons a streetcar makes more sense than busses.

It's a foot in the door approach to a rail system, which is more convenient than a bus system.  Denver has now low speed/high speed rail, Mall Ride (Basically our version of streetcar) and a complex bus system that travels every block it seems and all are highly used.

In what way, exactly?  Aside from it being free.

It will help development down there and then the light rail hub will be placed along that line in the future.  Just like other cities have done.

bolstering development makes it more "convenient" than busses?   

[Phil Titola]

 

How much of KCMO's general fund is supported by the 1% income tax?

Approximately 40%...50% of that is paid by non kcmo residents.

[Dub]

Streetcar funding breakdown
37M in federal transportation funding... I mean this could be used for other transportation projects in kc or around the country
Remaining 70 million comes from property and sales tax within the TDD... And a fee on surface parking lots. Not general city finds that could be used for other things.

The federal funding they are applying for this project I believe can be used for rail only.  It can't be used for bus or other transportation.

[Belvis Noland]

I think the major hang up right now is the cost for a rail system that goes like 2 blocks.

What is that cost?  for you specifically?

I have no clue. Whatever the taxes are.

so your major hang up for this project is the cost - of which you are completely clueless?