Kansas City things

[kim carnes]

Go vertical kc

[star seed 7]

What street should it be on instead of main st?

SW trafficway

[pissclams]

What street should it be on instead of main st?

are  you not familiar with midtown?
how about putting the POS somewhere that actually needs it?

since we've been told what a great boon to economic development these things are, seems to me that it would make the most sense to put the line in an area that needs public transportation and economic development. troost would be a perfect candidate for the line as the east side, which troost really doesn't even qualify as, desperately needs both.

main street is doing just fine without a streetcar, 99% commercial occupancy in the 20 blocks between 47th and 27th streets with continued redevelopment happening all the time.

if the mayor is scared of too many black people riding it on troost, then put it on gillham/rock hill since that actually goes where the purported need is (umkc and rockhurst)

[pissclams]

you have to consider, though, that putting it where the black people live with dissuade people from driving  in from olathe to ride it and it would change from being a carnival attraction to a functioning piece of our city's infrastructure.  and that's the last thing anyone in KCMO government wants.

[Cartierfor3]

clams makes a p good point

[420seriouscat69]

Yeah, he should drop the mic.

[mocat]

i would be all for a troostcar (just like there used to be) but i think you have to start with the densest part of the city and go from there. that's why leg #1 was in the loop/river market instead of Gillham between 27th and 39th (or whatever). the logical next step is main st. it's sort of the spine of what is and always will be the densest part of the city. until you have a streetcar that serves the plaza/westport districts, it doesn't make sense to put one elsewhere. troost has lots of potential for economic development, but there is no "district." The areas around Troost are mostly residential with actual Troost Ave having the businesses. This raises the question, is the streetcar A) a device to connect dense districts for tourists/shoppers/diners/etc, or is it B) a way for people to get to work? We all know which way it leans currently. I think it's an important question for any expansion. what is it trying to be? If its #1 goal is to spur economic development, well unfortunately you need derps from Eudora to ride it and become patrons of the businesses along its route (while admiring the authenticity of the new restaurant chains). If it's B, then there should be a streetcar on Troost AND Main, because a crap ton of people live in midtown, and both the Troost MAX and Main MAX are pretty crowded.
my gut feeling is you get just as much B with much more A if you put the streetcar on Main.

[mocat]

to some of your other points:

-main st is 99% commercially occupied between 27th & 47th?

-main st would not get any more congested, because at any individual stop there would still be a maximum of 1 streetcar every ~10 mins. and in midtown, there is already a bus only lane on Main st that the streetcar would use (Troost does not have this)

[mocat]

-main st is 99% commercially occupied between 27th & 47th?

sorry developer guy, no room in the Inn 

[pissclams]

-main st is 99% commercially occupied between 27th & 47th?

sorry developer guy, no room in the Inn 

let me help you, chode.  properties b/w 27th and 47th that are zoned as commercial are 99% occupied. 

to some of your other points:

-main st is 99% commercially occupied between 27th & 47th?

-main st would not get any more congested, because at any individual stop there would still be a maximum of 1 streetcar every ~10 mins. and in midtown, there is already a bus only lane on Main st that the streetcar would use (Troost does not have this)

you should add traffic engineer to your already long list of impressive accomplishments.  there is no full time bus only lane on main street.  so yes, reducing car traffic by 50% in both directions will increase congestion.

[mocat]

let me help you, chode.  properties b/w 27th and 47th that are zoned as commercial are 99% occupied. 

do you agree that there is plenty of room for development on Main st between those streets?

you should add traffic engineer to your already long list of impressive accomplishments.  there is no full time bus only lane on main street.  so yes, reducing car traffic by 50% in both directions will increase congestion.

i mean, there is a bus lane on Main st clams. it's a 3 lane street both directions (not 2), and the far right is labeled "BUS LANE."

how on earth did you come up with a 50% reduction in both directions?

[star seed 7]

He means dedicated bus lane not open to other traffic

[mocat]

He means dedicated bus lane not open to other traffic

you wouldn't be able to drive in the same lane as the streetcar? 

[Phil Titola]

Troost was studied. It sadly doesn't have community support nor the taxing capacity to support this level of investment at this point. The troost max is helping.

Main has a lot of room for redevelopment and has plenty of capacity to be redesigned to fit streetcar.

[420seriouscat69]

let me help you, chode.

 

[star seed 7]

He means dedicated bus lane not open to other traffic

you wouldn't be able to drive in the same lane as the streetcar? 

I don't think you're understanding. When clams says there "is no full-time bus lane", he's referring to a dedicated lane that only busses can use. It's not a very good point, but I would be fine giving busses/streetcar dedicated lanes on Main where there is space.

I pretty much only drive on main on Saturday/Sunday afternoons, so maybe it gets more congested than I think, but adding a streetcar seems like a pretty damn minor addition to the traffic

[mocat]

He means dedicated bus lane not open to other traffic

you wouldn't be able to drive in the same lane as the streetcar? 

I don't think you're understanding. When clams says there "is no full-time bus lane", he's referring to a dedicated lane that only busses can use. It's not a very good point, but I would be fine giving busses/streetcar dedicated lanes on Main where there is space.

I pretty much only drive on main on Saturday/Sunday afternoons, so maybe it gets more congested than I think, but adding a streetcar seems like a pretty damn minor addition to the traffic

do you think it would be easier for Main (3 lanes) or Troost (2 lanes) to handle a streetcar?

[mocat]

Main has a lot of room for redevelopment

i don't know it looks 99% full to me

[star seed 7]

The only negative of expansion to me is the time to get from downtown to the plaza would be like 45 minutes or something right? I'm not sure if you can truly connect the districts with ride times like that.

[mocat]

The only negative of expansion to me is the time to get from downtown to the plaza would be like 45 minutes or something right? I'm not sure if you can truly connect the districts with ride times like that.

LOL no. i take the max regularly and it's nowhere near that. like maybe 20 mins

[mocat]

we're getting pretty off-topic tho. clams said it should be on troost instead of main. it might take you 45 mins to get from downtown to the plaza via troost, if you had to walk from troost & cleaver

[star seed 7]

He means dedicated bus lane not open to other traffic

you wouldn't be able to drive in the same lane as the streetcar? 

I don't think you're understanding. When clams says there "is no full-time bus lane", he's referring to a dedicated lane that only busses can use. It's not a very good point, but I would be fine giving busses/streetcar dedicated lanes on Main where there is space.

I pretty much only drive on main on Saturday/Sunday afternoons, so maybe it gets more congested than I think, but adding a streetcar seems like a pretty damn minor addition to the traffic

do you think it would be easier for Main (3 lanes) or Troost (2 lanes) to handle a streetcar?

Hey traffic engineer, main is 6-7 lanes on the stretch we are talking about and troost appears to be 3-4 (with street parking on most of it)

[Cartierfor3]

can you guys run some analysis on a Waldo to the K streetcar line

[mocat]

 

[Phil Titola]

can you guys run some analysis on a Waldo to the K streetcar line

Rock island commuter plan will be a round about way for you to get there....or more likely your kid.