If Frank was here this year...

[SdK]

Let's compare inheriting Beas and Walker while already have been on staff and retaining the other coaches with inheriting these years team and starting your coaching staff all over. Let's compare results.

[ksupamplemousse]

It's amazing how much sophomore Angel makes people think that oscar is a genius and Frank is a dunce.

[kso_FAN]

I think we'd be about the same.

I have no doubt that Frank would've gotten this team to play really well at some point in the season. But there also most certainly would've been some stretch of drama and Franking and Frank making points about effort in practice, etc.. As a result we would have lost at least one really dumb game because it was what Frank teams did. Its just as likely this season would've looked like 11 as it did 10 under Frank. It would've been a good season, but it would've had Frank things.

And that difference is a major reason why rake's "boring" thread is 9 pages.

[steve dave]

I agree we'd be about the same overall. oscar seems like he's great at playing to seed but he can't break through his ceiling and I don't see that changing. Frank would break through the basement floor and the ceiling. I never felt like we had a prayer before we went to KU. I would have if Frank was here.

[kso_FAN]

I agree we'd be about the same overall. oscar seems like he's great at playing to seed but he can't break through his ceiling and I don't see that changing. Frank would break through the basement floor and the ceiling. I never felt like we had a prayer before we went to KU. I would have if Frank was here.

But you and I both know, if he plays to seed and gets to the Sweet 16 we'll love him hard. Some won't, but we will.

[steve dave]

I agree we'd be about the same overall. oscar seems like he's great at playing to seed but he can't break through his ceiling and I don't see that changing. Frank would break through the basement floor and the ceiling. I never felt like we had a prayer before we went to KU. I would have if Frank was here.

But you and I both know, if he plays to seed and gets to the Sweet 16 we'll love him hard. Some won't, but we will.

I love winning basketball games

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

Not being upset a single time this season, so far, is a big accomplishment. oscar deserves credit for that, even if the Big 12 is down this year. He's done a great job utilizing the talent that Frank and DH recruited. So I'm happy with oscar's coaching, but I'm still skeptical about his track record recruiting.

[sonofdaxjones]

"Why take 1st when 5th is available" Frank Martin 2012

[sonofdaxjones]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night. 

[mocat]

This is really all you need to know:

Frank:
13-23 vs better teams (36%)
100-29 vs worse teams (77%)

oscar:
2-4 vs better teams (33%)
20-1 vs worse teams (95%)

[Winters]

:dnr:

[Rage Against the McKee]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night.

His recruits are rated ok by recruiting services, but how many of them actually end up being good players? His Illinois team that he left obviously is filled with a bunch of fp, tc, etc.'s Orris over Gray is just mind boggling, and Jacob Pullen wasn't good enough to play for him. His talent evaluation leaves a whole lot to be desired.

[420seriouscat69]

:dnr:

Pussy!

[Winters]

:dnr:

Pussy!

How about you save this for after the season so I can enjoy this basketball season. k thanks.

[420seriouscat69]

:dnr:

Pussy!

How about you save this for after the season so I can enjoy this basketball season. k thanks.

We're getting too cuddly around here. Someone has to throw a curve ball.

[sonofdaxjones]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night.

His recruits are rated ok by recruiting services, but how many of them actually end up being good players? His Illinois team that he left obviously is filled with a bunch of fp, tc, etc.'s Orris over Gray is just mind boggling, and Jacob Pullen wasn't good enough to play for him. His talent evaluation leaves a whole lot to be desired.

His 2010 class had 3 4 Star guys sign LOI's.  His 2009 class had 2 Rivals Top 50 guys committed.  I know there was some stories around some of those guys that I don't remember, but the point remains.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night.

His recruits are rated ok by recruiting services, but how many of them actually end up being good players? His Illinois team that he left obviously is filled with a bunch of fp, tc, etc.'s Orris over Gray is just mind boggling, and Jacob Pullen wasn't good enough to play for him. His talent evaluation leaves a whole lot to be desired.

His 2010 class had 3 4 Star guys sign LOI's.  His 2009 class had 2 Rivals Top 50 guys committed.  I know there was some stories around some of those guys that I don't remember, but the point remains.

Most of them suck, though.

[hatingfrancisco]

I miss the games where we got down early and Frank just mailed it in to prove a point.   

[Ghost of Stan Parrish]

This is really all you need to know:

Frank:
13-23 vs better teams (36%)
100-29 vs worse teams (77%)

oscar:
2-4 vs better teams (33%)
20-1 vs worse teams (95%)

boom

[wetwillie]

This is really all you need to know:

Frank:
13-23 vs better teams (36%)
100-29 vs worse teams (77%)

oscar:
2-4 vs better teams (33%)
20-1 vs worse teams (95%)

boom

I'm really disappointed mocat didn't use a proportional sample size

[mocat]

make your own proportional sample size then

[Mr Bread]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night.

His recruits are rated ok by recruiting services, but how many of them actually end up being good players? His Illinois team that he left obviously is filled with a bunch of fp, tc, etc.'s Orris over Gray is just mind boggling, and Jacob Pullen wasn't good enough to play for him. His talent evaluation leaves a whole lot to be desired.

His 2010 class had 3 4 Star guys sign LOI's.  His 2009 class had 2 Rivals Top 50 guys committed.  I know there was some stories around some of those guys that I don't remember, but the point remains.

Most of them suck, though.

Yeah.  Those are the players that got him fired.  High ratings, terrible results.  Very much an FP, TC issue and not so much a talent issue. 

[yoga-like_abana]

Hmm, interesting topic, fanning. I wonder why no one has brought it up before?

Yeah, if I luke'd this I'm sorry. But no one would start a thread like this on here cause we all loved frank and  many want to ignore the negatives that came with frank cause he was so successful/likeable.

what can I say? you're a maverick, fanning.

I know you're being facetious, but anyway.

o/u 3 for how many times fanning edited to re-write facetious.

[kstate4life]

We wouldn't have the same Shane because Frank wouldn't play him, and JO would be better because he would have been suspended already.

[westcoast_emawer]

Thing is, Weber didn't recruit that bad at all at Illinois, and his recruiting at K-State is starting to ratchet up as well.

Biggest thing for me is:  1.  Intensity as his guys take over.  2.  Utilization of big men and flexibility within the offense to attack the basket, look inside and board when the jumpers aren't falling.   

I was pretty pleased with the look inside first emphasis against TT the other night.

Spot on. I truly believe this would be an up and down .500 team with frustration and head-scratching moments with Frank around.

Also I believe Weber's leadership and this coaching staffs leadership is great. When your leader(HCFM) is up and down and a ravening lunatic on the sidelines your players will be inconsistent, over-emotional (good and bad) and be up and down as well. This team is much more mature and poised this year than last. Some has to do with players growing up, but I believe Weber's leadership has been crucial.

These guys are bought in to "finding a way to contribute and help the team win." Rather than worrying about getting theirs or feeling sorry for themselves.

Also enjoyable to see guys encourage others through adverse situations during the game. Refreshing to say the least. Frank's message had taken it's course with this program.

In the words of Lou, "Startin' to come together Pepper." Nice to see a band of bro's out there.