Author Topic: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow  (Read 13988 times)

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Offline OK_Cat

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2012, 11:48:54 AM »
I'm more pessimistic about Klein being drafted than Harper.

Offline The Manhatter

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2012, 12:02:55 PM »
IMO, Harper and Brown are the only true locks to get drafted.  The NFL will like Harper's versatility.  While people may look at a 230lb receiver who doesn't have a ton of productivity they will see his skills as a runner (Oregon QB) and ability to run the ball from receiver position, blocker, and he does present some skill as a receiver though not quite that steady by NFL standards.  He may be seen as a unique 3rd down back as a receiver out of the back field.  Honestly, someone may draft him as a running back and primarily as a receiver from that position.  Either way his complete skill set has some value.

I think there are a handful of players who very well may get drafted and that would include Malone, Wilson, Klein, Tuggle, and...yes, Tannahill. 

As for Meshak Williams and Adam Davis?  no.  Meshak has a limit to his size and he's too rigid to play the OLB position in the league.  Adam Davis would have a shot as an OLB if he were more explosive and had more quickness to make plays in space.  Neither will be seen as an NFL prospect.  But they are quality defensive ends for us in our scheme and what we like to do.

Tuggle and Klein are the two guys that will really intrigue scouts.  Tuggle has some upside to play in the league.  He is explosive, that was evident in the Miami game and he does have the change of direction and short area quickness to make some plays in space.  Biggest drawback on Tuggle now is he has no pass rushing skill in terms of hand-to-hand combat or setting up blockers.  He doesn't shoot his hands when he engages blockers.  Plus, he doesn't demonstrate upper body pop when he does engage.  Scouts will love his movement ability, length, athleticism, range, pedigree, etc. but to get drafted he'll need to demonstrate at some point during this season that he is capable of developing moves with his hands as weapons and the upper body strength to pop blockers and seperate. 
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline 'taterblast

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2012, 12:05:06 PM »
IMO, Harper and Brown are the only true locks to get drafted.  The NFL will like Harper's versatility.  While people may look at a 230lb receiver who doesn't have a ton of productivity they will see his skills as a runner (Oregon QB) and ability to run the ball from receiver position, blocker, and he does present some skill as a receiver though not quite that steady by NFL standards.  He may be seen as a unique 3rd down back as a receiver out of the back field.  Honestly, someone may draft him as a running back and primarily as a receiver from that position.  Either way his complete skill set has some value.

I think there are a handful of players who very well may get drafted and that would include Malone, Wilson, Klein, Tuggle, and...yes, Tannahill. 

As for Meshak Williams and Adam Davis?  no.  Meshak has a limit to his size and he's too rigid to play the OLB position in the league.  Adam Davis would have a shot as an OLB if he were more explosive and had more quickness to make plays in space.  Neither will be seen as an NFL prospect.  But they are quality defensive ends for us in our scheme and what we like to do.

Tuggle and Klein are the two guys that will really intrigue scouts.  Tuggle has some upside to play in the league.  He is explosive, that was evident in the Miami game and he does have the change of direction and short area quickness to make some plays in space.  Biggest drawback on Tuggle now is he has no pass rushing skill in terms of hand-to-hand combat or setting up blockers.  He doesn't shoot his hands when he engages blockers.  Plus, he doesn't demonstrate upper body pop when he does engage.  Scouts will love his movement ability, length, athleticism, range, pedigree, etc. but to get drafted he'll need to demonstrate at some point during this season that he is capable of developing moves with his hands as weapons and the upper body strength to pop blockers and seperate.

 :dance:

Offline The Manhatter

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #28 on: September 12, 2012, 12:06:17 PM »
to add to the previous post, I definitely think we're better at 6 of the front 7 positions than we were a year ago.  Tuggle is part of that because he is an upgrade over Lamur.  He is bigger, more explosive, and capable of making more plays as a pass rusher and around the LOS than Lamur.  Lamur had more upper body pop and likely was better in coverage but even then I'm not so sure.  Tuggle looked awfully sudden on the play where Miami tried an outside receiver screen and the receiver cutback.  That was a much smaller and quicker player and Tuggle made the play look routine and did so in the backfield.  He demonstrated a LOT of ability on that one play.
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline The Manhatter

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #29 on: September 12, 2012, 12:14:31 PM »
What I am more interested to know is when our offensive linemen start showing up on their radar.  They know about Finney already as he has begun to climb the charts from his first year.  Whitehair and Lucas are two that they should notice pretty soon.  I can guarantee you this right now...all three WILL play on Sundays.  I can say this without hesitation: in terms of ability we have never been more talented than we are from the center out to Left Tackle than we are right now.  Finney, Whitehair, and Lucas is a REALLY talented trio for KSU. 
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline 'taterblast

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #30 on: September 12, 2012, 12:23:07 PM »
to add to the previous post, I definitely think we're better at 6 of the front 7 positions than we were a year ago.  Tuggle is part of that because he is an upgrade over Lamur.  He is bigger, more explosive, and capable of making more plays as a pass rusher and around the LOS than Lamur.  Lamur had more upper body pop and likely was better in coverage but even then I'm not so sure.  Tuggle looked awfully sudden on the play where Miami tried an outside receiver screen and the receiver cutback.  That was a much smaller and quicker player and Tuggle made the play look routine and did so in the backfield.  He demonstrated a LOT of ability on that one play.

I have even been pleasantly surprised by Boyd/Sua

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #31 on: September 12, 2012, 12:27:34 PM »
Harper will be drafted for sure.

yeah

Don't see it :dunno: hope I'm wrong though...

His size and 40 time will get him drafted

That's funny because I think it's his size and 40 time that will keep him from getting drafted.

he ran the fastest 40 time at our pro day last year

he runs a 4.5 and is 6'-1" 230 lb

imo neither of those are reasons to draft him at wr

Chris Harper ran a low 4.3

 :thumbs: did not know that

Offline Paul Moscow

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #32 on: September 12, 2012, 12:28:33 PM »
to add to the previous post, I definitely think we're better at 6 of the front 7 positions than we were a year ago.  Tuggle is part of that because he is an upgrade over Lamur.  He is bigger, more explosive, and capable of making more plays as a pass rusher and around the LOS than Lamur.  Lamur had more upper body pop and likely was better in coverage but even then I'm not so sure.  Tuggle looked awfully sudden on the play where Miami tried an outside receiver screen and the receiver cutback.  That was a much smaller and quicker player and Tuggle made the play look routine and did so in the backfield.  He demonstrated a LOT of ability on that one play.

I have even been pleasantly surprised by Boyd/Sua

I thought Boyd played fairly well actually. Didn't lack for enthusiasm at least.

Offline The Manhatter

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #33 on: September 12, 2012, 01:07:16 PM »
I feel a lot better about the DL through two games then I thought I would.  I am not that big on Sua but that has more to do w/ talent and ability than it does his motor and responsibilities.  We're pretty damn solid up front in taking care of our assignments.  There are not standouts...just hard working, tough, and solid veteran players.  If Akinola gets cleared and takes the starting position from Sua then we'll know we're going to have a very salty defense.  He won't get that starting position without being in the vicinity of motor and responsible.  We know he has a lot more talent.  He's got Kibble's size and he's a better athlete. 

BTW, the kid I was pleased to see work out there but not surprised by how he did was Travis Britz.  The kid fights like hell to gain the shoulder advantage on gap play.  He's strong for a freshman, works diligently to do his assignment right, and will help out this year in the run defense.  He's definitely limited in a pass rush sense because he's simply not dynamic as an athlete a little bit of a plodder.  But he's strong, has some good size, uses his hands surprisingly well for a frosh, and will give you effort every play. 
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline Legit Elite

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #34 on: September 12, 2012, 01:16:28 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.
Free edge up to defensive starters when opponents held under 10.

Offline Unruly

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #35 on: September 12, 2012, 01:39:41 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.


Swap malone and wilson and I think you got it.
:dance:


Offline ben ji

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #36 on: September 12, 2012, 01:42:57 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.


Swap malone and wilson and I think you got it.

Most teams dont even carry a FB anymore...I've never seen wilson catch the ball but I would think his only chance in the league is as a hybrid TE/FB. Dont see him getting drafted though.

I could be wrong though

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #37 on: September 12, 2012, 01:45:11 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.



he is not productive and not tall and 230 pounds and drops the ball fairly consistently. why does everyone think harper is a slam dunk draft lock?

he is a projected 7th rounder which means he may or may not be drafted. but yeah i guess i'm an idiot for thinking he may not be drafted

Offline Legit Elite

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #38 on: September 12, 2012, 01:55:46 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.



he is not productive and not tall and 230 pounds and drops the ball fairly consistently. why does everyone think harper is a slam dunk draft lock?

he is a projected 7th rounder which means he may or may not be drafted. but yeah i guess i'm an idiot for thinking he may not be drafted
Self-confirmed
Free edge up to defensive starters when opponents held under 10.

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #39 on: September 12, 2012, 01:59:27 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.



he is not productive and not tall and 230 pounds and drops the ball fairly consistently. why does everyone think harper is a slam dunk draft lock?

he is a projected 7th rounder which means he may or may not be drafted. but yeah i guess i'm an idiot for thinking he may not be drafted
Self-confirmed

what round is he going to get drafted legit elite?

Offline Legit Elite

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #40 on: September 12, 2012, 02:01:00 PM »
Well that's a great question.  I'm not God nor do I have a magic 8-ball so I won't take the bait on this one.  All I can say I that it depends on how the rest of his season goes.

Free edge up to defensive starters when opponents held under 10.

Offline OK_Cat

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #41 on: September 12, 2012, 02:58:43 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.


klein is far from a lock.  he's a less-hyped version of tebow, and tebow hasn't amounted to much (except for unnecessary espn coverage).

Offline The Manhatter

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #42 on: September 12, 2012, 02:59:33 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.



he is not productive and not tall and 230 pounds and drops the ball fairly consistently. why does everyone think harper is a slam dunk draft lock?

he is a projected 7th rounder which means he may or may not be drafted. but yeah i guess i'm an idiot for thinking he may not be drafted


Did you happen to see how reliable of hands Niles Paul (Nebraska) had a few years ago?  He be of the same build (likely smaller hands as he had tiny hands at combine) and not much more in the way of a downfield threat.  And he doesn't have Harper's dynamic ability as a runner.  When I say "dynamic" in regards to Harper I don't imply he's Peter Warrick.  But he's pretty damned nifty for a biggun.
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline SabiNation

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #43 on: September 12, 2012, 02:59:50 PM »
I love reading The Manhatter's posts!!!

 :dance:
"If i worked for the NY times, and my boss told me 'hey. if you keep ranking ksu so high, we may fire you' i would tell my boss to 'bring it on.'"  -FFF

Offline 3gQ@T

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #44 on: September 12, 2012, 03:26:40 PM »
CH is comparable to Anquan Boldin who is 6' 1" 223lbs and ran a 4.6+ 40 at the combine. Florida State Career: 118 Rec 1790 yds 21 td with an ACL tear. I think Harper is more dynamic than Boldin but with less production in college. That happens to WR when your QB runs for 27 tds.

Offline Legit Elite

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #45 on: September 12, 2012, 03:48:44 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.


klein is far from a lock.  he's a less-hyped version of tebow, and tebow hasn't amounted to much (except for unnecessary espn coverage).
Not after he scores 1 million on his wonderlic
Free edge up to defensive starters when opponents held under 10.

Offline Mr Bread

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #46 on: September 12, 2012, 03:49:48 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.



he is not productive and not tall and 230 pounds and drops the ball fairly consistently. why does everyone think harper is a slam dunk draft lock?

he is a projected 7th rounder which means he may or may not be drafted. but yeah i guess i'm an idiot for thinking he may not be drafted


Did you happen to see how reliable of hands Niles Paul (Nebraska) had a few years ago?  He be of the same build (likely smaller hands as he had tiny hands at combine) and not much more in the way of a downfield threat.  And he doesn't have Harper's dynamic ability as a runner.  When I say "dynamic" in regards to Harper I don't imply he's Peter Warrick.  But he's pretty damned nifty for a biggun.

Oh man, what a reference.  That guy was like the king of juking.  If all football required was juking ability, he would have been a hall of famer.  So much fun to watch. 
My prescience is fully engorged.  It throbs with righteous accuracy.  I am sated.

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #47 on: September 12, 2012, 03:52:37 PM »
CH is comparable to Anquan Boldin who is 6' 1" 223lbs and ran a 4.6+ 40 at the combine. Florida State Career: 118 Rec 1790 yds 21 td with an ACL tear. I think Harper is more dynamic than Boldin but with less production in college. That happens to WR when your QB runs for 27 tds.

You know what else happens? You don't get drafted.

Offline EMAMFW

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #48 on: September 12, 2012, 04:18:15 PM »
Harper will be drafted for sure.

yeah

Don't see it :dunno: hope I'm wrong though...

His size and 40 time will get him drafted

That's funny because I think it's his size and 40 time that will keep him from getting drafted.

he ran the fastest 40 time at our pro day last year

he runs a 4.5 and is 6'-1" 230 lb

imo neither of those are reasons to draft him at wr

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that's the reason you're working behind a register and not the general manager of a NFL team.   :surprised:

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: NFL Scout: Klien > Tebow
« Reply #49 on: September 12, 2012, 04:20:02 PM »
If you think Harper isn't going to be drafted you are an idiot.

Here's my take:

Locks - ABJ, Harper, Klein, Malone

Possible - Tannelhill, Wilson, Tuggle

I don't know jack about judging skills of linemen on either side of the ball so I will not comment there.


Swap malone and wilson and I think you got it.

Legit Elite nailed it.  I hate hate hate how much K-State fans underrate Nigel Malone.