Author Topic: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions  (Read 54579 times)

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Offline michigancat

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #175 on: July 16, 2012, 02:28:26 PM »
steve dave, why did joe gordon leave?

Offline ChiComCat

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #176 on: July 16, 2012, 02:32:08 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Offline HeinBallz

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #177 on: July 16, 2012, 02:32:17 PM »
steve dave, why did joe gordon leave?

Stop trying to get this thread back on it's satirical rails. We were having an honest to god witch trial here.
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Offline HeinBallz

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #178 on: July 16, 2012, 02:33:33 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

FTR, I can be done with Ron Paul at any moment, but I will always blindly follow the constitution.
Good is better than Evil because it's nicer.

Offline kstatefreak42

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #179 on: July 16, 2012, 02:34:22 PM »
"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson, after signing the Federal Reserve into existence



What else do we need? I mean its so damn obvious.
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Offline steve dave

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #180 on: July 16, 2012, 02:38:52 PM »
steve dave, why did joe gordon leave?

I'm not certain.  I would suspect a rift amongst the current staff over his never getting an actual coaching position or yet another John Currie related defection. 

Offline michigancat

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #181 on: July 16, 2012, 02:41:08 PM »
steve dave, why did joe gordon leave?

I'm not certain.  I would suspect a rift amongst the current staff over his never getting an actual coaching position or yet another John Currie related defection. 

follow up: why didn't he get an actual coaching position?

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #182 on: July 16, 2012, 02:43:38 PM »
FTR, I can be done with Ron Paul at any moment, but I will always blindly follow the constitution.

Question, not trolling or disagreeing, just interested in your view: why is a document that was created by a group of men hundreds of years ago in a vastly different time still necessarily and entirely valid today, and also better than anything else?
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Offline steve dave

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #183 on: July 16, 2012, 02:43:57 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

Offline steve dave

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #184 on: July 16, 2012, 02:44:24 PM »
steve dave, why did joe gordon leave?

I'm not certain.  I would suspect a rift amongst the current staff over his never getting an actual coaching position or yet another John Currie related defection. 

follow up: why didn't he get an actual coaching position?

bill doesn't trust people who are a lot younger than him? 

Offline p1k3

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #185 on: July 16, 2012, 02:46:34 PM »
"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson, after signing the Federal Reserve into existence



What else do we need? I mean its so damn obvious.

I know that voting doesnt matterbwhen i see this quote and certain excerpts from the Rothschild memoirs.

Offline HeinBallz

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #186 on: July 16, 2012, 03:46:46 PM »
FTR, I can be done with Ron Paul at any moment, but I will always blindly follow the constitution.

Question, not trolling or disagreeing, just interested in your view: why is a document that was created by a group of men hundreds of years ago in a vastly different time still necessarily and entirely valid today, and also better than anything else?

Unlike popular belief, the Constitution is not a document relevant only to one place in time - such as the Bible.   It is, in it's purest sense, a document outlining structure of government.  It is a system of checks and balances to assure that a dictatorship or monopoly of power does not occur.   Today, we live in a society where the People fear the government.  Our constitutions ONLY PURPOSE was to assure that the government fears the people. 

Regardless of claims that a 200 year old document is not relevant due to cultural differences, there is nothing I see that doesn't account for cultural differences as it's vague in interpretation, but literal in ruling.   What do I mean by that? Statements such as "all men are created equal" - in 1796, that meant all white people with testicles were equal.  In 2012, it clearly means all humans are equal.  Cultural definitions change, but the rules provide a framework for how you apply those definitions.   It's not perfect, but if it were followed, there would not be growing concern over a corrupt federal reserve, because there wouldn't be one.   There wouldn't be accusations of presidents being a dictator as there would be checks & balances for all decisions. 

The best I can answer is this: If all civil liberties were and always have been completely protected and the constitution was followed through out the entire history, there would have been no:
1. Civil rights issues in the 50's, 60's & 70's as All men & women would have ALWAYS had those rights.
2. Vietnam War, Korean War, Desert Storm, and not likely the current conflict that we're in.  All of these 'could' have happened, but it would have taken an act of congress to declare each of these.
3. Financial Housing crisis: there would have not been fiat money, and qualifying for a loan would have been much more difficult - which if you read further up in the thread, JFK may not have been shot over issuing silver certificates because all currency would have been backed by silver/gold/etc.
4. Gay marriage / rights would have not been an issue on a federal level.


I could probably go on if I had more time - but I think you get the picture.  A dictatorship is evil and easily corruptible.   Currently, we operate under the illusion that we hold the government accountable - but between the last two presidents we have had:
1. Wars started strictly for the purpose of financial gain of some individuals and commanded through executive order
2. Privacy taking a back seat to personal safety through the Patriot Act.
3. NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) removing right to peaceful protest, right to trial by jury of peers, and a right to bear arms and has turned the presidential office into judge, jury, & executioner.   

Understand that the Liberty movement is not afraid of all of these powers being abused right now, even though each of the above has been abused, including a 16 year old American boy being assassinated, but you NEVER allow power to be given to anyone that your worst enemy may be able to some day occupy.  We have set a precedence for allowing a President to make decisions in all of our lives, with or without our approval.  What happens when a president think YOU are a terrorist for something of you're own personal conviction?   Because you own a gun due to your personal choice to hunt; Or because you practice a certain religion; or whatever else. 

A man I respect very much once said something that changed my entire outlook on life/work/parenting.

I'm paraphrasing here, but:
"whenever I'm approached with a problem within society, I first always  ask myself; Is there a way this problem could be solved with a little more freedom?"  -Penn Jillette
Good is better than Evil because it's nicer.

Offline HeinBallz

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #187 on: July 16, 2012, 03:55:17 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.
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Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #188 on: July 16, 2012, 03:55:34 PM »
FTR, I can be done with Ron Paul at any moment, but I will always blindly follow the constitution.

Question, not trolling or disagreeing, just interested in your view: why is a document that was created by a group of men hundreds of years ago in a vastly different time still necessarily and entirely valid today, and also better than anything else?

Unlike popular belief, the Constitution is not a document relevant only to one place in time - such as the Bible.   It is, in it's purest sense, a document outlining structure of government.  It is a system of checks and balances to assure that a dictatorship or monopoly of power does not occur.   Today, we live in a society where the People fear the government.  Our constitutions ONLY PURPOSE was to assure that the government fears the people. 

Regardless of claims that a 200 year old document is not relevant due to cultural differences, there is nothing I see that doesn't account for cultural differences as it's vague in interpretation, but literal in ruling.   What do I mean by that? Statements such as "all men are created equal" - in 1796, that meant all white people with testicles were equal.  In 2012, it clearly means all humans are equal.  Cultural definitions change, but the rules provide a framework for how you apply those definitions.   It's not perfect, but if it were followed, there would not be growing concern over a corrupt federal reserve, because there wouldn't be one.   There wouldn't be accusations of presidents being a dictator as there would be checks & balances for all decisions. 

The best I can answer is this: If all civil liberties were and always have been completely protected and the constitution was followed through out the entire history, there would have been no:
1. Civil rights issues in the 50's, 60's & 70's as All men & women would have ALWAYS had those rights.
2. Vietnam War, Korean War, Desert Storm, and not likely the current conflict that we're in.  All of these 'could' have happened, but it would have taken an act of congress to declare each of these.
3. Financial Housing crisis: there would have not been fiat money, and qualifying for a loan would have been much more difficult - which if you read further up in the thread, JFK may not have been shot over issuing silver certificates because all currency would have been backed by silver/gold/etc.
4. Gay marriage / rights would have not been an issue on a federal level.


I could probably go on if I had more time - but I think you get the picture.  A dictatorship is evil and easily corruptible.   Currently, we operate under the illusion that we hold the government accountable - but between the last two presidents we have had:
1. Wars started strictly for the purpose of financial gain of some individuals and commanded through executive order
2. Privacy taking a back seat to personal safety through the Patriot Act.
3. NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) removing right to peaceful protest, right to trial by jury of peers, and a right to bear arms and has turned the presidential office into judge, jury, & executioner.   

Understand that the Liberty movement is not afraid of all of these powers being abused right now, even though each of the above has been abused, including a 16 year old American boy being assassinated, but you NEVER allow power to be given to anyone that your worst enemy may be able to some day occupy.  We have set a precedence for allowing a President to make decisions in all of our lives, with or without our approval.  What happens when a president think YOU are a terrorist for something of you're own personal conviction?   Because you own a gun due to your personal choice to hunt; Or because you practice a certain religion; or whatever else. 

A man I respect very much once said something that changed my entire outlook on life/work/parenting.

I'm paraphrasing here, but:
"whenever I'm approached with a problem within society, I first always  ask myself; Is there a way this problem could be solved with a little more freedom?"  -Penn Jillette

Really bummed that the Martavious :didnotread: gif is gone.

New question for Steve Dave: what happened to the Martavious gif?
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Offline ChiComCat

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #189 on: July 16, 2012, 04:09:03 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.

He is usually about 50/50 between making sense and batshit crazy.  This is largely because he is not beholden to some larger political machine, which I appreciate

Offline OK_Cat

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #190 on: July 16, 2012, 04:16:15 PM »
"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson, after signing the Federal Reserve into existence



What else do we need? I mean its so damn obvious.

hey dummy, http://other.skepticproject.com/articles/quotes/view/17/woodrow-wilson-regrets-the-federal-reserve/

that speech was given a year before the federal reserve. 

DEBUNKED  (you're welcome, stevedave)

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #191 on: July 16, 2012, 05:57:48 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.

this is not at all why people think RP fans are crazy.

this is actually the only thing that keeps RP relevent and (somewhat) respected by sane people.
Hyperbolic partisan duplicitous hypocrite

Offline kstatefreak42

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #192 on: July 16, 2012, 06:31:31 PM »
"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson, after signing the Federal Reserve into existence



What else do we need? I mean its so damn obvious.

hey dummy, http://other.skepticproject.com/articles/quotes/view/17/woodrow-wilson-regrets-the-federal-reserve/

that speech was given a year before the federal reserve. 

DEBUNKED  (you're welcome, stevedave)
The first quote is actually changed a bit, the original is[1]:

    A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is privately concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men who, even if their action be honest and intended for the public interest, are necessarily concentrated upon the great undertakings in which their own money is involved and who necessarily, by very reason of their own limitations, chill and check and destroy genuine economic freedom.

What's most interesting is that this originally was in a speech from 1912, a year before the Federal Reserve was even established, so how could he be regretting something that hasn't happened yet?


And my point remains the same.
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Offline HeinBallz

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steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #193 on: July 16, 2012, 06:37:29 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.

this is not at all why people think RP fans are crazy.

this is actually the only thing that keeps RP relevent and (somewhat) respected by sane people.

Then why the immediate hate the moment anyone brings up Ron Paul when people are talking about a politician they can trust?


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Offline kstatefreak42

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #194 on: July 16, 2012, 06:38:57 PM »
Because their stupid rough ridin' idiots to be honest.
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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #195 on: July 16, 2012, 07:01:53 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.

this is not at all why people think RP fans are crazy.

this is actually the only thing that keeps RP relevent and (somewhat) respected by sane people.

Then why the immediate hate the moment anyone brings up Ron Paul when people are talking about a politician they can trust?


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a little because he has some really far-out there ideas (which is whatever to me, you don't have to like everything a person says to support them).

mostly because crazies are to RP as racists are to republicans.
Hyperbolic partisan duplicitous hypocrite

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #196 on: July 16, 2012, 08:10:38 PM »
SD, do Ron Paul supporters act more sheep-like than everyone else as an glowing example of irony?  Are they, in fact, providing a parody candidate that they follow with such zeal so we look inward at our own partisan nature? 

TIA

Some people want to grasp onto whichever candidate holds their belief that it was not their own doing (or more commonly, nondoing) that got them to their current position in life.

I think what people don't see and causes them to immediately pigeon hole Ron Paul supporters as crazy sheep, is RP people like Ron Paul because he has no private interest.   His concern genuinely appears to be for society as a whole.   He achieves no personal gain for the message he is preaching and in fact catches more grief for it.  He is something very rare in politics - an individual advocating for your rights.  He isn't right on everything and in fact I disagree with much of his personal convictions - but his brand of politics allows for me to live my life by my standards, not the standards of some dictator.

this is not at all why people think RP fans are crazy.

this is actually the only thing that keeps RP relevent and (somewhat) respected by sane people.

Then why the immediate hate the moment anyone brings up Ron Paul when people are talking about a politician they can trust?


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It probably has something to do with being called a "sheeple" immediately after Ron Paul gets mentioned, and then hearing some rant about the Bilderberg group and rampant globalization.

If the Ron Paul supporters would just say they like Ron because he stands for individual liberty and has managed to become somewhat relevant while separating himself from both political parties, which is actually kind of incredible, people wouldn't think they are crazy.

Offline p1k3

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Re: steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #197 on: July 16, 2012, 08:16:52 PM »
I think the reason RP people think others are sheep is out of frustration. We're morally opposed to the status quo and it's costing us too much money anyway. But no one gives a eff. They'd rather follow the same old crap. D vs R. Rich bad person vs Rich bad person. It doesnt even matter anymore. Nothing has changed in decades. It blows my mind that people can think RP is crazy. $16 trillion debt, policing the world for 60 years, welfare is out of control, crony capitalism, etc...

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steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #198 on: July 16, 2012, 08:30:51 PM »
Ron Paul isnt that crazy. I think he's great enough (except for returning to a gold standard is impossible and dumb imo). I only hate because the people who get deleted from my Facebook feed post birther tirades, truther idiocies, shout about all other conspiracy theories, forward nutty chain letters and blog posts, and shout with their eyes closed while exhibiting no critical thinking capabilities. RP's biggest problem is that his most vocal followers are incapable of typing out well reasoned defenses and explanations like Mr. Ballz above.


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Offline HeinBallz

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steve dave answers your conspiracy theory questions
« Reply #199 on: July 16, 2012, 09:49:33 PM »
I try to look at gold standard arguments as arguments against fiat $$ - which everyone, who would listen, would agree is easily manipulated for individual gain of whoever holds all the cards.  Which is why I'm a strong proponent of auditing the fed, but not sold on the good standard.


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