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Offline 0.42

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Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« on: September 04, 2011, 04:10:31 PM »
So I'll start with the good part, obviously our defense played much better last night than they did at any point of last season sans maybe the KU game. At this point, do you think that last year was primarily just a lack of depth that mumped us rather than scheming, and in your opinion do you think that it looks like Cosh might have learned from last year's mistakes?

Now, the bad/weird parts:

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen


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Offline hemmy

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2011, 04:54:47 PM »
Cosh has learned nothing.  The average ranking of his defenses over the course of his career has proven he is incapable of being a good DC.

Offline kitten_mittons

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #2 on: September 05, 2011, 07:13:42 PM »
-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.
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Offline CHONGS

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #3 on: September 05, 2011, 07:17:59 PM »
So I'll start with the good part, obviously our defense played much better last night than they did at any point of last season sans maybe the KU game. At this point, do you think that last year was primarily just a lack of depth that mumped us rather than scheming, and in your opinion do you think that it looks like Cosh might have learned from last year's mistakes?

Now, the bad/weird parts:

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen
:dubious:

Offline Bookcat

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #4 on: September 05, 2011, 07:19:33 PM »
-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.
Terence Newman Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap

Hartman and Newman comparisons?

wow. just wow.

Offline DQ12

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #5 on: September 05, 2011, 07:22:20 PM »

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen
-Snyder has traditionally put guys like 2ys and Zimmerman back there because they're a "sure set of hands."  I think he does that when he's concerned less with getting a big return, and more concerned with not totally screwing up a punt.  He does it because it's safe and he has confidence that they will not screw up.  Obviously, it didn't work because we muffed a punt, but I'm pretty sure that's why Snyder does it.  I'd bet in a couple weeks we see one of the "burners" back there.

-I think I remember what you're referring to.  IIRC, that play was out of the shotgun with only BW in the backfield.  When we line up in this formation, our offense has been incredibly predictable.  About 50% of the time, it's a lead QB draw.  The other 50%, it's a pass play.  Either way, we never run outside with that formation, and I'm sure every team knows that.  If that's the case, it was probably just a misdirection type play to unclog the middle on future QB lead draws.


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Offline kitten_mittons

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2011, 09:47:48 PM »
-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.
Terence Newman Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap

Hartman and Newman comparisons?

wow. just wow.
Yes, the comparison is that they both play defense.  I am not wanting Y2 to continue returning punts, but not having someone return punts just because they play on defense is pretty dumb.

Offline Cire

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #7 on: September 05, 2011, 09:52:59 PM »
Defense is way more athletic in the front seven.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2011, 09:53:35 PM »
Defense is way more athletic in the front seven.

yes

Offline felix rex

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2011, 07:59:23 AM »
Is tre walker kinda good? It seemed like he was kinda good. Plus, I still love him for looking great in that high school letter jacket and not decommitting.
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Offline Lucas Scoopsalot

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2011, 05:55:27 PM »
All i know is Arthur Brown is the real deal.
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Offline 0.42

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2011, 06:51:32 PM »
So I'll start with the good part, obviously our defense played much better last night than they did at any point of last season sans maybe the KU game. At this point, do you think that last year was primarily just a lack of depth that mumped us rather than scheming, and in your opinion do you think that it looks like Cosh might have learned from last year's mistakes?

Now, the bad/weird parts:

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen
:dubious:

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Offline The Manhatter

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2011, 11:44:19 AM »
So I'll start with the good part, obviously our defense played much better last night than they did at any point of last season sans maybe the KU game. At this point, do you think that last year was primarily just a lack of depth that mumped us rather than scheming, and in your opinion do you think that it looks like Cosh might have learned from last year's mistakes?

Now, the bad/weird parts:

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen


I wouldn't refer to myself as an "expert" but might know a few things I see.

The defense is better, or at least it was better in game 1.  Challenges still remain and some good running teams will gash us at times though I don't see it being quite to the extent as last year.  In the first game Kibble does look improved from last year.  We should expect this of a JC DT who does have some abilities much the way Daniel Calvin improved from year 1 to year 2.  I think we're better at NT and DE as a collection...especially at Felder's spot.  LBs are night and day though they will be had because Walker still struggled with the physical component in game 1 and it was obvious that Art Brown will be a LB prone to taking himself out of position from overpursuit.  A physical OL with good run blockers in space from the OL or some adequate run blockers at TE, FB, slot receivers, will gash us with some cut back runs to the weakside.  I still think when Harold's at his best (but only at his best) he's more disruptive at End than A. Davis or Voelker though Meshak has some nice upside.  We're quicker in the front 7...a LOT quicker.  I don't see us as being as good at the 3 tech as last year (Lutui vs. Prizell Brown).  It's a wait and see approach from the secondary because that wasn't a competent passing team in EKU.  We'll be harder to run against on the edges but will still have issues stopping the ground game between the tackles. 

We put Ty Z back to return punts because he has sure hands, will make good decisions, and he's a good athlete.  He had two punt returns of 40-plus yards last year (CU & Syracuse).  Being solid on punt return is more about trusting the returner (the choices he makes and hands) and having good people surrounding them in your scheme as it is tremendous athletic ability.  It's not uncommon across the country to see reliable, less spectatcular vets go back to field punts even for the more talented teams.

We ran the outside toss play to Braden Wilson because we had leverage on EKU if Harper could make his block.  It was a good scheme and something they were not prepared for.  Think of it as a comparison to the throwback pass to McDonald last year against UCF.  The strongside backer is typically responsible for the fullback and when the initial option look flows to his side all it takes is a false step from read recognition of the OL to fullback and direction of the play to force LB in a position to shoot the gap or scrape around the contain...Harper was in a position to prevent that contain from being spilled the ball carrier.  We had it and it was a good play call but wasn't executed (which was the story of the night).
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2011, 11:51:53 AM »
Also on Zimmerman at returner; I'm pretty sure this is not the long term plan. Snyder will want a little bigger threat there, and you could see that option right now is Lockett. After TZ muffed the 2nd punt, it made the decision to give him a shot easier, though both were used the rest of the game. I think we'll see more Lockett (and possibly Thompson) and less TZ as the season goes on.

Offline Cire

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2011, 11:59:29 AM »
I was impressed with Voelker(?) williams and DAvis's motors.  We haven't had guys on the Dline with motors to pursue and chase the way we did on saturday.

pretty big upgrade, especially if we are going to keep playing soft zones with a four man rush.

Offline pissclams

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2011, 12:00:47 PM »
Also on Zimmerman at returner; I'm pretty sure this is not the long term plan. Snyder will want a little bigger threat there, and you could see that option right now is Lockett. After TZ muffed the 2nd punt, it made the decision to give him a shot easier, though both were used the rest of the game. I think we'll see more Lockett (and possibly Thompson) and less TZ as the season goes on.

damn 42.  
we figured this out weeks ago, pls don't make _FAN rehash the crap we've already got documented and official.

http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=13905.msg321455#msg321455





Cheesy Mustache QB might make an appearance.

New warning: Don't get in a fight with someone who doesn't even need to bother to buy ink.

Offline KSNimrod

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2011, 12:05:07 PM »
We ran the outside toss play to Braden Wilson because we had leverage on EKU if Harper could make his block.  It was a good scheme and something they were not prepared for.  Think of it as a comparison to the throwback pass to McDonald last year against UCF.  The strongside backer is typically responsible for the fullback and when the initial option look flows to his side all it takes is a false step from read recognition of the OL to fullback and direction of the play to force LB in a position to shoot the gap or scrape around the contain...Harper was in a position to prevent that contain from being spilled the ball carrier.  We had it and it was a good play call but wasn't executed (which was the story of the night).

It sure looked to me like Wilson was pissed on that play that Harper whiffed on the block...  Not sure if I can replay it on the HDTV site but he was fairly animated towards Harper.

Offline 0.42

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2011, 12:05:53 PM »
 :love:

gold-plated meat goats are on the way to 'Hatter and 'Fan. I need to start reading that Smart Football blog more on top of reading your posts.

My drunk ass was thinking that Synds had lost his mind on Saturday, but what you're saying makes sense. The lack of execution was obviously troubling, but I'm firmly back in the "wait until the Kent State game to make judgements" camp. If they're missing those blocks and giving up those same turnovers in that game I'm going to be very  :dubious:

Offline 0.42

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2011, 12:07:20 PM »
Also on Zimmerman at returner; I'm pretty sure this is not the long term plan. Snyder will want a little bigger threat there, and you could see that option right now is Lockett. After TZ muffed the 2nd punt, it made the decision to give him a shot easier, though both were used the rest of the game. I think we'll see more Lockett (and possibly Thompson) and less TZ as the season goes on.

damn 42.  
we figured this out weeks ago, pls don't make _FAN rehash the crap we've already got documented and official.

http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=13905.msg321455#msg321455





 :comeatme:

I did enjoy this post from that thread very much:

FSN's Dave Lapham Keys to a Kansas State victory


1)Klein and Tyler need to "Lockett-up"

 :D

Offline pissclams

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2011, 12:10:49 PM »
Lockett-up < Lock'N Load


Cheesy Mustache QB might make an appearance.

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Offline Cire

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2011, 01:02:54 PM »
The Chamber is Lockettloaded.

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2011, 01:56:05 PM »
So I'll start with the good part, obviously our defense played much better last night than they did at any point of last season sans maybe the KU game. At this point, do you think that last year was primarily just a lack of depth that mumped us rather than scheming, and in your opinion do you think that it looks like Cosh might have learned from last year's mistakes?

Now, the bad/weird parts:

-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.

-What on earth are we doing running outside toss plays with Braden Wilson? He's obviously a good bruiser and can gain some yards by taking some people with him, but he's not fast enough to run a successful toss play. What is Snyder/Dimel trying to do here?


thanks, ima hang up and listen


I wouldn't refer to myself as an "expert" but might know a few things I see.

The defense is better, or at least it was better in game 1.  Challenges still remain and some good running teams will gash us at times though I don't see it being quite to the extent as last year.  In the first game Kibble does look improved from last year.  We should expect this of a JC DT who does have some abilities much the way Daniel Calvin improved from year 1 to year 2.  I think we're better at NT and DE as a collection...especially at Felder's spot.  LBs are night and day though they will be had because Walker still struggled with the physical component in game 1 and it was obvious that Art Brown will be a LB prone to taking himself out of position from overpursuit.  A physical OL with good run blockers in space from the OL or some adequate run blockers at TE, FB, slot receivers, will gash us with some cut back runs to the weakside.  I still think when Harold's at his best (but only at his best) he's more disruptive at End than A. Davis or Voelker though Meshak has some nice upside.  We're quicker in the front 7...a LOT quicker.  I don't see us as being as good at the 3 tech as last year (Lutui vs. Prizell Brown).  It's a wait and see approach from the secondary because that wasn't a competent passing team in EKU.  We'll be harder to run against on the edges but will still have issues stopping the ground game between the tackles. 

We put Ty Z back to return punts because he has sure hands, will make good decisions, and he's a good athlete.  He had two punt returns of 40-plus yards last year (CU & Syracuse).  Being solid on punt return is more about trusting the returner (the choices he makes and hands) and having good people surrounding them in your scheme as it is tremendous athletic ability.  It's not uncommon across the country to see reliable, less spectatcular vets go back to field punts even for the more talented teams.

We ran the outside toss play to Braden Wilson because we had leverage on EKU if Harper could make his block.  It was a good scheme and something they were not prepared for.  Think of it as a comparison to the throwback pass to McDonald last year against UCF.  The strongside backer is typically responsible for the fullback and when the initial option look flows to his side all it takes is a false step from read recognition of the OL to fullback and direction of the play to force LB in a position to shoot the gap or scrape around the contain...Harper was in a position to prevent that contain from being spilled the ball carrier.  We had it and it was a good play call but wasn't executed (which was the story of the night).

Not much to add to this other than the fact that Snyder also mentioned that he wants to get Wilson the ball more this year overall.

Offline unleashthemob

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2011, 01:59:24 PM »
-Why are we having defensive players like Ty field punts and kickoffs? First of all, they're not going to be as fresh as a non-defensive player who hasn't just played a series, so the chances of them having breakaway speed seem minimal.
Terence Newman Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap
[/quote. I know Terence Newman, Terence Newman is a friend of mine, Ty Zimmerman is no Terence Newman!

Offline Stevesie60

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #23 on: September 07, 2011, 09:01:28 PM »
The Chamber is Lockettloaded.

I enjoyed the hell out of this post.

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Re: Questions for goEMAW football experts (_FAN, hatter, Paj, etc)
« Reply #24 on: September 07, 2011, 09:12:13 PM »
I'm certainly a Cosh skeptic, but was impressed by the obvious improvements on defense compared to last year.
Then again, as slow and horrible as we were on defense last year, improvement should be a given.

I'm not ready to throw any parades for Cosh. His track record is average when he's at his best, and taking one performance against a freshman-QB led FCS team as a barometer is a step I'm not willing to take.

But I do think we do have more speed, which certainly doesn't hurt.