Author Topic: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns  (Read 4401 times)

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Online steve dave

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Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« on: June 22, 2011, 02:40:35 PM »
http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2011/06/17/gas-farm-labor-crisis-playing-out-as-planned/

Ga’s farm-labor crisis playing out as planned
7:22 am June 17, 2011, by Jay

After enacting House Bill 87, a law designed to drive illegal immigrants out of Georgia, state officials appear shocked to discover that HB 87 is, well, driving a lot of illegal immigrants out of Georgia.

It might be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Thanks to the resulting labor shortage, Georgia farmers have been forced to leave millions of dollars’ worth of blueberries, onions, melons and other crops unharvested and rotting in the fields. It has also put state officials into something of a panic at the damage they’ve done to Georgia’s largest industry.

Barely a month ago, you might recall, Gov. Nathan Deal welcomed the TV cameras into his office as he proudly signed HB 87 into law. Two weeks later, with farmers howling, a scrambling Deal ordered a hasty investigation into the impact of the law he had just signed, as if all this had come as quite a surprise to him.

The results of that investigation have now been released. According to survey of 230 Georgia farmers conducted by Agriculture Commissioner Gary Black, farmers expect to need more than 11,000 workers at some point over the rest of the season, a number that probably underestimates the real need, since not every farmer in the state responded to the survey.

In response, Deal proposes that farmers try to hire the 2,000 unemployed criminal probationers estimated to live in southwest Georgia. Somehow, I suspect that would not be a partnership made in heaven for either party.

As an editorial in the Valdosta Daily Times notes, “Maybe this should have been prepared for, with farmers’ input. Maybe the state should have discussed the ramifications with those directly affected. Maybe the immigration issue is not as easy as ’send them home,’ but is a far more complex one in that maybe Georgia needs them, relies on them, and cannot successfully support the state’s No. 1 economic engine without them.”

According to the survey, more than 6,300 of the unclaimed jobs pay an hourly wage of just $7.25 to $8.99, or an average of roughly $8 an hour. Over a 40-hour work week in the South Georgia sun, that’s $320 a week, before taxes, although most workers probably put in considerably longer hours. Another 3,200 jobs pay $9 to $11 an hour. And while our agriculture commissioner has been quoted as saying Georgia farms provide “$12, $13, $14, $16, $18-an-hour jobs,” the survey reported just 169 openings out of more than 11,000 that pay $16 or more.

In addition, few of the jobs include benefits — only 7.7 percent offer health insurance, and barely a third are even covered by workers compensation. And the truth is that even if all 2,000 probationers in the region agreed to work at those rates and stuck it out — a highly unlikely event, to put it mildly — it wouldn’t fix the problem.

Given all that, Deal’s pledge to find “viable and law-abiding solutions” to the problem that he helped create seems naively far-fetched. Again, if such solutions existed, they should have been put in place before the bill ever became law, because this impact was entirely predictable and in fact intended.

It’s hard to envision a way out of this. Georgia farmers could try to solve the manpower shortage by offering higher wages, but that would create an entirely different set of problems. If they raise wages by a third to a half, which is probably what it would take, they would drive up their operating costs and put themselves at a severe price disadvantage against competitors in states without such tough immigration laws. That’s one of the major disadvantages of trying to implement immigration reform state by state, rather than all at once.

The pain this is causing is real. People are going to lose their crops, and in some cases their farms. The small-town businesses that supply those farms with goods and services are going to suffer as well. For economically embattled rural Georgia, this could be a major blow.

In fact, with a federal court challenge filed last week, you have to wonder whether state officials aren’t secretly hoping to be rescued from this mess by the intervention of a judge. But given how the Georgia law is drafted and how the Supreme Court ruled in a recent case out of Arizona, I don’t think that’s likely.

We’re going to reap what we have sown, even if the farmers can’t


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Offline OK_Cat

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2011, 02:42:12 PM »
 :lol:

Offline CNS

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2011, 02:44:18 PM »
Love blueberries and watermellon. 

Why is GA so dumb?

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2011, 02:46:10 PM »
Maybe they should try paying more than $8 per hour for a shitty job. Wal-Mart employees make like $12.

Offline john "teach me how to" dougie

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2011, 03:36:59 PM »
Why are Georgia farmers allowed to hire illegals? Modern day slavery.


Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2011, 03:58:21 PM »
Maybe they should try paying more than $8 per hour for a crapty job. Wal-Mart employees make like $12.

The great irony of all of this is that hiring illegals to do the job for less is capitalism.  Forcing businesses to hire American workers for increased wages and benefits (for the good of the workers) is socialism.

Cest la vie.

Offline sys

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2011, 04:03:43 PM »
The great irony of all of this is that hiring illegals to do the job for less is capitalism.  Forcing businesses to hire American workers for increased wages and benefits (for the good of the workers) is socialism.

Cest la vie.

that's Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!), pjd.
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Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2011, 04:07:13 PM »
The great irony of all of this is that hiring illegals to do the job for less is capitalism.  Forcing businesses to hire American workers for increased wages and benefits (for the good of the workers) is socialism.

Cest la vie.

that's respected, pjd.

How so, sys?

Offline sys

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2011, 04:11:14 PM »
it's protectionism/free trade, not capitalism/socialism.
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

Offline wetwillie

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2011, 04:17:01 PM »
it's protectionism/free trade, not capitalism/socialism.

Which is still very ironic given the party and people who passed the law.
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Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2011, 04:33:12 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Offline CNS

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2011, 04:56:17 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2011, 06:26:12 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Yes, and only wealthy and educated Mexicans can come to the United States legally.

Offline john "teach me how to" dougie

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2011, 06:45:24 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2011, 09:12:14 PM »
it's protectionism/free trade, not capitalism/socialism.

Government is influencing the market (higher wages and benefits penalize the producer) to promote the general welfare.

You're right; it's not the most accurate definition, but neither are many of the other examples where people use the same general comparison.  I should have used quotes around both to illustrate.  So, yeah, I'll give you that.

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2011, 09:16:25 PM »

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Yeah, I'll take the lower prices.
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Offline john "teach me how to" dougie

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2011, 09:50:08 PM »

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Yeah, I'll take the lower prices.

I didn't know they had plantations in MN. 

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2011, 09:51:40 PM »
Gramps lives in GA.   :babywillie:
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Offline CNS

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2011, 09:04:21 AM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Not sure that everyone's wage will go up.  I don't work on a farm, but I buy food.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2011, 09:15:31 AM »
A white guy comes in for an interview to work on a Georgia farm.

White Guy (WG): Hello, sir. I saw an ad in the paper that you were looking for work.

Georgia Farmer (GF): I sure am. The job pays $8 per hour, and there's a lot of overtime.

WG: Oh, really? How much overtime are we talking about?

GF: Well, you will be working from 7:00 AM until 8:00 pm Monday through Saturday, and on Sunday I'll let you work from noon to 8. You get 30 minutes each day for lunch and dinner, but only dinner on Sundays.

WG: Oh, so I'll be working just about 80 hours per week. That means that after the first 40 hours, I'll get payed overtime and make $12 per hour, right?

GF: Actually, no. The laws for overtime pay don't apply to farm workers, thank God.

WG: But I thought you said there's a lot of ovetime.

GF: Yeah, you have to work a lot of overtime, I just don't pay you for it.

WG: Dude, I think I'm just going to try and get a job at McDonald's.

GF: People just don't want to work these days. :shakesfist:

Offline john "teach me how to" dougie

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2011, 01:26:47 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Not sure that everyone's wage will go up.  I don't work on a farm, but I buy food.

I am mostly alluding to the working poor who rely on minimum wage.

Why are liberals so eager to pay more in taxes, but when it comes to helping poor farm workers make a few more bucks they want nothing to do with paying a few cents more for fruits and vegetables? Fuel prices, printing money, and ethanol production, have more affect on increasing food prices than farm worker wages ever will.

Offline CNS

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #21 on: June 23, 2011, 01:33:37 PM »
I don't have any problems with people in Georgia wanting to farm, but if they are going to do it, they should do it legally. I'm sure the legal farmers who pay living wages to American citizens don't like the farmers who break the law.

Food prices.

Everyone would have to be a KSU grad just to eat.

Food prices may go up some, but so will the wages for everyone. The illegal labor pool keeps wages artificially low for the legal immigrants.

Not sure that everyone's wage will go up.  I don't work on a farm, but I buy food.

I am mostly alluding to the working poor who rely on minimum wage.

Why are liberals so eager to pay more in taxes, but when it comes to helping poor farm workers make a few more bucks they want nothing to do with paying a few cents more for fruits and vegetables? Fuel prices, printing money, and ethanol production, have more affect on increasing food prices than farm worker wages ever will.

Not a liberal.

Don't want to pay more taxes or pay more for food.

Offline sys

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #22 on: June 23, 2011, 02:25:12 PM »
Why are liberals so eager to pay more in taxes, but when it comes to helping poor farm workers make a few more bucks they want nothing to do with paying a few cents more for fruits and vegetables?

because they vote their class interest.  people (not just in the us, worldwide) vote/think in closer accordance with class interest on immigration/free movement of labor than almost any other issue i can think of.


ag. jobs is a red herring btw.  it is always brought up as a central issue when discussing us immigration, but a v. small fraction of illegal workers work in ag. jobs.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2011, 03:53:31 PM by sys »
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #23 on: June 23, 2011, 02:49:17 PM »
Why are liberals so eager to pay more in taxes, but when it comes to helping poor farm workers make a few more bucks they want nothing to do with paying a few cents more for fruits and vegetables?
[/quote

because they vote their class interest.  people (not just in the us, worldwide) vote/think in closer accordance with class interest on immigration/free movement of labor than almost any other issue i can think of.


ag. jobs is a red herring btw.  it is always brought up as a central issue when discussing us immigration, but a v. small fraction of illegal workers work in ag. jobs.

Ag jobs are somewhat of a red herring, but the percentage of migrant workers in the labor intensive ag jobs I would guess is pretty high:  (corn de-tassling, tomatoes, grapes, peaches, berries etc.) the percentage of undocumented workers is huge).  Part of this is because the USDA has a joke of a guest worker program.

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Re: Travis Tannahill Fistpumps Then Frowns
« Reply #24 on: June 23, 2011, 03:39:19 PM »
Why are liberals so eager to pay more in taxes, but when it comes to helping poor farm workers make a few more bucks they want nothing to do with paying a few cents more for fruits and vegetables?
[/quote

because they vote their class interest.  people (not just in the us, worldwide) vote/think in closer accordance with class interest on immigration/free movement of labor than almost any other issue i can think of.


ag. jobs is a red herring btw.  it is always brought up as a central issue when discussing us immigration, but a v. small fraction of illegal workers work in ag. jobs.

Ag jobs are somewhat of a red herring, but the percentage of migrant workers in the labor intensive ag jobs I would guess is pretty high:  (corn de-tassling, tomatoes, grapes, peaches, berries etc.) the percentage of undocumented workers is huge).  Part of this is because the USDA has a joke of a guest worker program.

This is true. No farmer is going to house the guest workers in permanent dwellings for the length of their stay, let alone pay the fee that comes along with just applying for the program.