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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: sys on February 29, 2016, 09:49:46 PM
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following a big road win over incarnate wood, sfa climbs all the way up to 50 in the kenpom, two spots below kansas state. with just two games apiece and the conference tourneys to go, can sfa overtake kstate before they run out of season?
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Amazing to see two stud coaches at the top of their games, with top 50 teams in the nation, coming down to the wire to see who's better
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If you are doing comparisons, might as well throw #54 in there too.
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please, ksu_bbb. let's focus on the race that matters to kstaters.
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Hypothetical score if we played right now.
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Hypothetical score if we played right now.
let the season play out, cns.
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sfa 50, KState 48
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please, ksu_bbb. let's focus on the race that matters to kstaters.
I suspect that as long as KSU finishes higher than that #54 team, the season will be considered a success for a large segment of our fanbase.
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chingon, in theory we could open up the race to track every team between 40 and 60. but, imo, college basketball is all about rivalries. as we all know kstate and sfa have split the kenpom race in the last two years. and now with this year coming right down to the wire, true kstate and sfa fans are naturally focused on which of these extremely similar natural rivals is going to take the 2015-2016 kenpom troph.
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Hypothetical score if we played right now.
Yeah, I was thinking op put both teams through some scientific generator thingy.
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50-49.
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oscar is right. If we were in a different conference, we'd be tourney bound!
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oscar is right. If we were in a different conference, we'd be tourney bound!
Not really. The very thing that boosts our rank is being in a "difficult" conference. Put KSU in the ACC or SEC and I think our rank would drop (even if we had a couple of more wins).
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i think we would win the southland conference and nab a hard earned ncaa tourney bid
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i think we would win the southland conference and nab a hard earned ncaa tourney bid
We could. A neutral site game against SFA would be a toss up, though.
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i think we would win the southland conference and nab a hard earned ncaa tourney bid
We could. A neutral site game against SFA would be a toss up, though.
why the strawman?
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i think we would win the southland conference and nab a hard earned ncaa tourney bid
We could. A neutral site game against SFA would be a toss up, though.
why the strawman?
what straw man?
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i think we would win the southland conference and nab a hard earned ncaa tourney bid
We could. A neutral site game against SFA would be a toss up, though.
I wish I knew a quick and easy way to confirm but my gut tells me SFA has a better neutral site record.
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a great mov against tcu pushes kstate up to 43rd. sfa gets their chance tomorrow northwestern state. kenpom already thinks they'll win by 15 so they'll need to lay the wood (that's a pun) to the northwestern state whatever they ares to keep pace.
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K-State/Tech will be a fulcrum game for K-State & Tech. SFA best possibility of taking a kenpom championship will be their tourney game, should get good amount of juice.
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Fun facts: northwestern state and sfa are huge rivals. They are located in two cities spelled differently but pronounced the same. In fact, northwestern state isn't in the state of northwestern, but the state of Louisiana
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K-State/Tech will be a fulcrum game for K-State & Tech. SFA best possibility of taking a kenpom championship will be their tourney game, should get good amount of juice.
sfa has to play all these low ranked teams, which makes it harder to move up. but they have a greater probability of playing more games. i think it's a fair race.
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Fun facts: northwestern state and sfa are huge rivals. They are located in two cities spelled differently but pronounced the same. In fact, northwestern state isn't in the state of northwestern, but the state of Louisiana
Definitely not pronounced the same.
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https://twitter.com/byberkowitz/status/705600782444445698
46, 43!
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Just you classic 50 point win by Brad. If our AD had any sense he would back channeling a deal in principle. It is really insane what Brad is currently doing.
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https://twitter.com/byberkowitz/status/705600782444445698
46, 43!
How SFU been rolling as of late (last 6 gams), Brad is going to break 40 in kenpom and have a third straight year of improving.
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Just you classic 50 point win by Brad. If our AD had any sense he would back channeling a deal in principle. It is really insane what Brad is currently doing.
just a 40 point mov, unfortunately. good enough to move up to 46, but not good enough to catch the 43rd ranked wildcats. one game left for each squad in conference play, but of course no one wins a kenpom in the regular season.
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What's better? Weber's motion offense or Underwood's continuous motion offense?
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FYI SFA is typically in the top 5 in APG.
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I think it's pretty clear that Brad can coach the crap out of good basketball players. Is there any indication that shows he can recruit at a high level in the big 12? That is my only concern.
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I think it's pretty clear that Brad can coach the crap out of good basketball players. Is there any indication that shows he can recruit at a high level in the big 12? That is my only concern.
It's a legit concern. He would need to find 2-3 really good assistants that can recruit. I think he could.
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FYI SFA is typically in the top 5 in APG.
In 3 years, nearly 2/3 of SFA's made shots are assisted. Top 11 every year.
His offense is really good. Constant moment and lots of opportunity to set up 2 man games.
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Brad has started luring 3 stars to SFA, which is at least like 4 stars here. I think the energy he would bring to the program/recruiting would be greater than anything we've seen since Huggy.
Maybe, I'm too optimistic on that score.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
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I think it's pretty clear that Brad can coach the crap out of good basketball players. Is there any indication that shows he can recruit at a high level in the big 12? That is my only concern.
It's a legit concern. He would need to find 2-3 really good assistants that can recruit. I think he could.
I said this in another thread, but the ability of oscar and his staff to recruit enough talent to be a top half of the conference team has completely eliminated recruiting as a question for Brad in my mind.
Even if Brad doesn't have any recruits he believes are P5 to bring with him it's not like oscar did either (after 15+ years straight as a HC in one of the best bb states in the country :curse:). After 3 years at SFA I trust Brad knows at least a couple of guys from the Texas AAU scene to do what AB3 has done.
Finally, Brad himself has Florida connections and it would be nice to get in on some of the Sunrise kids.
I guess what I am saying is I will eat my hat if Brad can't replicate what oscar has done. I suppose one thing oscar can do is drop Deron Williams name but I doubt any recruits care about what oscar did at Illinois when they were 5 or 6 years old.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
Brad is in good standing with MoKan and that would be huge. He has a strong relationship with Sunrise and Erik Pastrana is tight with KC Run GMC. Now where I don't think recruiting locally in a good strategy for Kansas State. Being able to steal some good players to round out a roster would be a huge plus.
I also think Brad is smart enough to understand that at Kansas State you need to build an elite staff of recruiters. I think he already has an up and comer in Pastrana.
I also think this year is Brads best coaching job. Losing Jacob Parker really hurt them. He really let him stretch a defense. Brad made big strides defensively this year.
Brad's pin wheel offense produces a lot of cheap baskets and you top that with how his defenses turn people over you get a high 2fg%, stops offensive droughts. The big key is landing bigs that are a little more skilled that can knock down some threes and a corner elbow shot.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
to oscar's credit that is exactly what he did with AB3. I am sure oscar rationalizes it in his head that Brooks is part of a "famous basketball family" but I don't think oscar had the half the relationship with AB3 that Hugs did with Te500k.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
to oscar's credit that is exactly what he did with AB3. I am sure oscar rationalizes it in his head that Brooks is part of a "famous basketball family" but I don't think oscar had the half the relationship with AB3 that Hugs did with Te500k.
The whole blah blah can't recruit is rough ridin' stupid. Build a staff that can, that is all it takes.
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Not that any of this is happening but would be lol to see how the new guys deal w/spradling's little local aau operation.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
to oscar's credit that is exactly what he did with AB3. I am sure oscar rationalizes it in his head that Brooks is part of a "famous basketball family" but I don't think oscar had the half the relationship with AB3 that Hugs did with Te500k.
The whole blah blah can't recruit is rough ridin' stupid. Build a staff that can, that is all it takes.
Absolutely, Wooldridge was likely going to recruit well enough to at least meet our fan-base's crap expectations had he been allowed to keep Salinas around. Jim's bank account might have eventually been worse off in the long run tho.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
Additional positives:
He's recruited at this level
He's recruited this region
It's not like he's going to Socon AAU tourneys. He knows the same coaches and players he would need to know at a higher level.
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I'm sold. Let's hire Brad immediately. Weber can be DOBO and finally give the schedule makers what they have coming to them.
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I'm sold. Let's hire Brad immediately. Weber can be DOBO and finally give the schedule makers what they have coming to them.
The key would be to keep Chester. Weber can go wherever.
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he's happy to wade into the aau stuff. he's not one of those head coaches that thinks he's too good for their crap and sends asst coaches off to do all the interacting. i think he'd do fine.
Brad is in good standing with MoKan and that would be huge. He has a strong relationship with Sunrise and Erik Pastrana is tight with KC Run GMC. Now where I don't think recruiting locally in a good strategy for Kansas State. Being able to steal some good players to round out a roster would be a huge plus.
I also think Brad is smart enough to understand that at Kansas State you need to build an elite staff of recruiters. I think he already has an up and comer in Pastrana.
I also think this year is Brads best coaching job. Losing Jacob Parker really hurt them. He really let him stretch a defense. Brad made big strides defensively this year.
Brad's pin wheel offense produces a lot of cheap baskets and you top that with how his defenses turn people over you get a high 2fg%, stops offensive droughts. The big key is landing bigs that are a little more skilled that can knock down some threes and a corner elbow shot.
HPWOIQ
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I'm sold. Let's hire Brad immediately. Weber can be DOBO and finally give the schedule makers what they have coming to them.
The key would be to keep Chester. Weber can go wherever.
keeping Chet would fine but Coach Samuels would be finer
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FWIW, the word of the day in my Words with Friends app is 'UNDERWOOD'.
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I'm sold. Let's hire Brad immediately. Weber can be DOBO and finally give the schedule makers what they have coming to them.
The key would be to keep Chester. Weber can go wherever.
keeping Chet would fine but Coach Samuels would be finer
Or Kim English he deserves the EMAW. :fatty:
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Mike Boynton Jr and Pastrana are already on staff at SFA. Bring those two and retain Chet.
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chet seems like a dumbass. i'd prefer he not be kept.
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chet seems like a dumbass. i'd prefer he not be kept.
Explain yourself.
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chet seems like a dumbass. i'd prefer he not be kept.
Fine, but Brad isn't bringing that dorky ass gonzaga piece of trash that video taped practices for A&M for nearly a decade.
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chet seems like a dumbass. i'd prefer he not be kept.
Explain yourself.
he seems like a dumbass. so i'd rather he not stay.
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kstate 46, sfa 47! if sfa wins by more than 6 or 7 tonight, they should pull into the lead.
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sfa v sam houston on espn3 right now. you can't win a kenpom in the regular season, as they say. but you can lose one.
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the announcer has a great southern accent and calls sfa "stephen eff". stephen f's tallest player is about 6'3".
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21 point win. sfa will take the regular season kenpom. we'll just have to wait and see by how much.
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I know that nothing is ever a sure thing, but this should be a clear indication that Brad is capable of at least doing what oscar is doing here. Brad is much more likable as well. Seems like a no-brainer. BBB.
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.8042
.8035
There's a thin line b/t winning and losing.
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.8042
.8035
There's a thin line b/t winning and losing.
45 to 46, sfa grabs the regular season kenpom. can they hold on through the post season?
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I don't like this one bit.
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I don't like this one bit.
a travesty in trajectory
Gonna win 'em all! (using Tapatalk)
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SFA up to #40. Must have been some post update update. This is turning into a laugher.
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wonderful news. and kstate falls to 47 too as the rich get richer.
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Will we see a day when the top 64 Kenpom teams get tourney invites?
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sfa 37, kstate 54 following kstate's perhaps final game and before sfa's postseason begins. sfa plays houston baptist tomorrow needing a 16 point win to avoid slipping.
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We also need to hoist the trophy for best kenpom rating with 16+ losses. Suck our butts #68 georgetown
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sfa plays houston baptist tomorrow needing a 16 point win to avoid slipping.
sfa won by 36. so far they've only moved up to 36th, but let's wait and see if there's a second update like last time.
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sfa plays houston baptist tomorrow needing a 16 point win to avoid slipping.
sfa won by 36. so far they've only moved up to 36th, but let's wait and see if there's a second update like last time.
I think there's a good chance they hold us off the rest of the way.
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lots of postseason still to go, michigancat! sfa holding steady at 35 late tonight, but kstate has clawed back to 49th.
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stephen eff marked a 22 pt victory over tamu-cc to move up to 34th. the victory also secured their conference tournament championship. as they also won the regular season championship, they qualify for both the ncaa and nit tournaments and will be able to choose in which prestigious postseason tournament they'll participate.
kstate remains mired in 49th and will also face decisions regarding which postseason tournament they most deserve.
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following the last conference championships, sfa moves up to 33rd and kstate moves down to 50th.
the perfidious schedulemakers work their evil magic, matching sfa against 5 pt favorites wvu on friday. in turn, kstate refuses to risk another bout with the schedulemakers, opting out of further postseason play in the hope that their big 12 brethren can gift them the title.
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i was going to save this little nugget for when the season ended, but i'll go ahead at toss in it now:
going back to their feb 13 game against tamu-cc, sfa improved their kenpom ranking in 10 straight games - the longest streak of kenpom rank improving games that i'm aware of by any coach at any level in collegiate basketball.
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This is an enjoyable thread. Thanks, sys.
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Decision making: works for oscar
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This is an enjoyable thread. Thanks, sys.
thank you. i enjoy it.
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kstate fell to 51st following last night's games. sfa remains 33rd.
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i don't think kenpom adjusted for a lot of the known variables that ravaged our team this season and i don't think that some in this thread have either. taking them into account, we look much more comparable to sfa than in this "made for television" version of his rankings.
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Could SFA potentially crack the top 20 with a win over press Virginia?
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Could SFA potentially crack the top 20 with a win over press Virginia?
they could get in the top 30.
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sfa remains at 33 following the first day of tournament action. kstate falls to 53.
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It's still way too early for a final verdict. Lots of games coming up.
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It's still way too early for a final verdict. Lots of games coming up.
Yes, cats could fall another 10 spots before this is over
Gonna win 'em all! (using Tapatalk)
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I want them to win so badly tonight.
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It's still way too early for a final verdict. Lots of games coming up.
Yes, cats could fall another 10 spots before this is over
Gonna win 'em all! (using Tapatalk)
Already down to 54. SFA could really make a statement, both figuratively and in the ratings with a win over WVU. oscar and Co. have to be hoping upon hope their Big 12 brothers can all make deep runs. Hard to see them doing that tho. They've all had to play that tough Big 12 schedule. None of these other conferences are coming into the tournament so bruised up.
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Update?
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Update?
25!
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the big 12 lets kstate down once again. sfa climbs to 25th in the wake of wvu's betrayal. kstate falls to 55th.
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sfa climbs to 24th, kstate climbs to 54th following the day's tournament play.
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with both teams having concluded their seasons, the opportunity for kstate to catch sfa appears to have passed. as it happens, sfa coach, bradley underwood, decided to conclude his career at sfa shortly following the end of their season. with underwood's decision, the annual sfa-kstate kenpom competition will also come to an unwelcome end.
kstate's big 12 brethren finally did their damn jobs, pulling kstate up to 53rd. sfa fell to 26th following their 2nd round ncaa tournament loss. while i will continue to update through the end of the season, it is not too early to conclude that sfa will win their second consecutive kenpom, winning the series, two kenpoms to one.
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sys, I appreciate the efforts you went to for this thread.
Gonna win 'em all! (using Tapatalk)
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Now as i understand it, if sfa were twice as bad (#52), they would still be ranked higher than k-state, is that accurate sys?
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Now as i understand it, if sfa were twice as bad (#52), they would still be ranked higher than k-state, is that accurate sys?
not quite. but, if there were twice as many teams better than them, they'd still be better than kstate.
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also, sfa's loss to notre dame ended their streak of games in which their kenpom rank improved at 11. you might expect to see a streak like that to start a season. but for a team to do that to end a season is just amazing.
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Brad should be given a certificate.
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I'm just glad that this isn't a comparison between Underwood and Weber. In that case, I'd be pretty upset about the outcome!
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Brad should be given a certificate.
it would make his return to bramlage that much sweeter.
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with the sweet sixteen and elite eight games completed, kstate climbs to 52nd while sfa slips to 27th.
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Who rough ridin' cares?
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Keep doing what you do sys.
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Who rough ridin' cares?
Why don't you get mumped? It seems you hate so much here, get the eff out.
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not every thread is for every poster, the big train.
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Who rough ridin' cares?
Why don't you get mumped? It seems you hate so much here, get the eff out.
The irony of you hating and trying to suppress free speech is pretty rich.
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MIR does not try to suppress free speech. This, I believe.
Gonna win 'em all! (using Tapatalk)
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with the sweet sixteen and elite eight games completed, kstate climbs to 52nd while sfa slips to 27th.
there's still 2 games today. what an idiot.
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To TBTs point, with Underwood no longer being a market alternative to oscar, the direct comparison now seems fruitless.
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:Woot:
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with the sweet sixteen and elite eight games completed, kstate climbs to 52nd while sfa slips to 27th.
there's still 2 games today. what an idiot.
with the elite eight games finally over, sfa falls to 28th, kstate holds steady at 52nd.
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as far as i know, last night's championship game was the final game of the season. through the final four games, sfa climbs back to 27th, kstate falls to 54th. sfa wins.
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king debruce, clearly 2x the coach that brad is