Would a qualified Thomas have given Prince another year?

[michigancat]

My god, how beautiful would Freeman have been with DT in the backfield. 

I mean, we surely would have won the CU game and been bowl eligible, right?  Also, a running threat would have made the blowouts look more respectable (see Prince's first year w/ Patton and JJ).

Kind of LOL when you think about it.

[ksuno1stunner]

 

[bam8485]

 Does Thomas coach defense too?  Wow that guy is amazing.

[ksu_FAN]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

[chum1]

Seems like the ku loss was a lot more significant than the CU loss in this regard.

[ksu_FAN]

Seems like the ku loss was a lot more significant than the CU loss in this regard.

True, but even Krause would've had a tough time firing the guy if he was still in position to get bowl elgible.

[chum1]

Krause did have a tough time with it.  He was forced to do something he didn't want to.

[EllToPay]

not really worthy of a powertard comment, pretty decent question.

i'd say yes, he would still be here.

 

[michigancat]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

Are you kidding me?  Of course an effective running game would affect time of possession...like, a ton.  Which makes the defensive stats look better.  Which would have made the losses a lot prettier.  And our fanbase loves pretty losses.  (see: @UCLA)

[cireksu]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

This is hilarious IMO.  Oldest Jr High football trick in the book.

[Bhyaaaaa!]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

This is hilarious IMO.  Oldest Jr High football trick in the book.

Something that I find personally amusing is that Carson is, without a doubt, the worst player out on the field whenever he steps on it. Yet, he is required to have the ball in his hand nearly every play. It's hilarious to watch. Its like watching Rick Ankiel pitch. The poor bastard probably just wants to go back to the locker room but a senile old man is forcing him to do this stupid sh*t that at best embarrasses him three times a drive and at worst nearly kills him.

Carson will probably be seriously injured this year. 

[McGrowlTowelZac]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

Are you kidding me?  Of course an effective running game would affect time of possession...like, a ton.  Which makes the defensive stats look better.  Which would have made the losses a lot prettier.  And our fanbase loves pretty losses.  (see: @UCLA)

The problem is that Prince's love child, Freeman, still would have been the focal point and Freeman would still be throwing the ball a ton.  I don't believe Prince knew what a good run game was.

Also, having DT would have saved Prince's job.  No way they fire him if he is bowl eligible, no way.  If he wins at Colorado we would have been 5-2 and the mood of the program is a lot different from the way it was after the CU loss.  Then I would like to say "who knows" what would have happened in the following 4 games, OU, ku, MU, NU, but I think we all know those would have still be horrible loses. Leaving all the pressure to win ISU to become bowl eligible.  6-6 gets us bowl eligible... but maybe they don't send us to a bowl, then we could fire him and gone after Patterson and Patterson would be the coach, .  So maybe DT would have helped us land Gary.

[ksu_FAN]

Are you kidding me?  Of course an effective running game would affect time of possession...like, a ton.  Which makes the defensive stats look better.  Which would have made the losses a lot prettier.  And our fanbase loves pretty losses.  (see: @UCLA)

No, I'm not kidding at all.  When did Prince ever try to control TOP?  His best team in 06 was #114 in TOP.  #111 in 07.  #107 last year.  There is absolutely no evidence that having Thomas would've made much difference for last year's team in TOP, Prince didn't even try to control this.  

[ew2x4]

I think he'd be ineffective behind Prince's OL. It was awful.

[catzacker]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

Are you kidding me?  Of course an effective running game would affect time of possession...like, a ton.  Which makes the defensive stats look better.  Which would have made the losses a lot prettier.  And our fanbase loves pretty losses.  (see: @UCLA)

even when we had james johnson and leon patton it didn't appear that running the ball was (a) a priority and/or (b) done well enough to be a priority.

granted, we had a 1st round draft pick at qB so you'd like to get it in his hands, but prince never really tried to run the ball (or could) consistently (though our ypc during the prince era was actually good).

[sonofdaxjones]

Outside of Thomas, look at all the other RB's Prince brought in his 2nd and 3rd recruiting classes . . . .



















Yeah . . . I know, nobody that had a prayer of making an immediate impact.    

[ksu_FAN]

even when we had james johnson and leon patton it didn't appear that running the ball was (a) a priority and/or (b) done well enough to be a priority.

granted, we had a 1st round draft pick at qB so you'd like to get it in his hands, but prince never really tried to run the ball (or could) consistently (though our ypc during the prince era was actually good).

Yeah, and just as appropriate would be to ask "Would making TOP a priority have given Prince another year?".  I'd say it is just as likely, if not more, that it would've made as much difference as having Thomas last year.

[michigancat]

Perhaps, but I don't know how much more effective Thomas running stretch-zone plays would've been.  Probably a win vs CU, but not much more.  He would've helped, but as was said, that wouldn't have changed the issues with the defense.  Nor with time of possession.

There is a reason Snyder has this team leading the nation in TOP.

Are you kidding me?  Of course an effective running game would affect time of possession...like, a ton.  Which makes the defensive stats look better.  Which would have made the losses a lot prettier.  And our fanbase loves pretty losses.  (see: @UCLA)

even when we had james johnson and leon patton it didn't appear that running the ball was (a) a priority and/or (b) done well enough to be a priority.

granted, we had a 1st round draft pick at qB so you'd like to get it in his hands, but prince never really tried to run the ball (or could) consistently (though our ypc during the prince era was actually good).

Our OL was horrible the first 2 years.  Slightly better last year.  IMO.

It was weird looking at stats - TOP was pretty much identical for RP all 3 years.

[catzacker]

Our OL was horrible the first 2 years.  Slightly better last year.  IMO.

It was weird looking at stats - TOP was pretty much identical for RP all 3 years.

yep, regardless of talent, experience, schedule...TOP = 27 minutes during Ron's Reign.  Snyds has us at 35 minutes now.  The TOP is literally the only thing suppressing the score and masking how bad this defense really is.  The weird thing is that our ypc were actually pretty decent (around 4.0) under Prince, he just didn't get that many attempts (he averaged about 30 attempts per game...snyds is at 43).  Christ, we'd be a decent team with Freems.  He'd hide enough of our flaws and snyder wouldn't have him throwing as much.  

[ksu_FAN]

Our OL was horrible the first 2 years.  Slightly better last year.  IMO.

It was weird looking at stats - TOP was pretty much identical for RP all 3 years.

yep, regardless of talent, experience, schedule...TOP = 27 minutes during Ron's Reign.  Snyds has us at 35 minutes now.  The TOP is literally the only thing suppressing the score and masking how bad this defense really is.  The weird thing is that our ypc were actually pretty decent (around 4.0) under Prince, he just didn't get that many attempts (he averaged about 30 attempts per game...snyds is at 43).  Christ, we'd be a decent team with Freems.  He'd hide enough of our flaws and snyder wouldn't have him throwing as much.  

Its really pretty shocking to me how Prince couldn't see how using more TOP would've helped him out a great deal.  Its not like he would've had to change much, just breaking the huddle a little later and snapping the ball with under 5 on the play clock would've added another minute or more on average.  Even more so, using that strategy (plus some luck) helped him win the OSU game his first year.  Then he never seemed to go back to that at all, except maybe at aTm last year. 

[sonofdaxjones]

Our OL was horrible the first 2 years.  Slightly better last year.  IMO.

It was weird looking at stats - TOP was pretty much identical for RP all 3 years.

yep, regardless of talent, experience, schedule...TOP = 27 minutes during Ron's Reign.  Snyds has us at 35 minutes now.  The TOP is literally the only thing suppressing the score and masking how bad this defense really is.  The weird thing is that our ypc were actually pretty decent (around 4.0) under Prince, he just didn't get that many attempts (he averaged about 30 attempts per game...snyds is at 43).  Christ, we'd be a decent team with Freems.  He'd hide enough of our flaws and snyder wouldn't have him throwing as much.  

So Snyder had Coffman throwing over 30 times, but if Snyder had Freeman he wouldn't have him throwing the same amount if not more??   Also no doubt that more of the passes would be stretching the field if he had Freeman.  

One thing you really had to appreciate about of Prince was his willingness to put the worst defense in K-State history back out on the field again, and again, and again.   It was like, "hey, if I give these guys enough chances maybe they'll play better".



 

[catzacker]

Our OL was horrible the first 2 years.  Slightly better last year.  IMO.

It was weird looking at stats - TOP was pretty much identical for RP all 3 years.

yep, regardless of talent, experience, schedule...TOP = 27 minutes during Ron's Reign.  Snyds has us at 35 minutes now.  The TOP is literally the only thing suppressing the score and masking how bad this defense really is.  The weird thing is that our ypc were actually pretty decent (around 4.0) under Prince, he just didn't get that many attempts (he averaged about 30 attempts per game...snyds is at 43).  Christ, we'd be a decent team with Freems.  He'd hide enough of our flaws and snyder wouldn't have him throwing as much.  

So Snyder had Coffman throwing over 30 times, but if Snyder had Freeman he wouldn't have him throwing the same amount if not more??   Also no doubt that more of the passes would be stretching the field if he had Freeman.  

One thing you really had to appreciate about of Prince was his willingness to put the worst defense in K-State history back out on the field again, and again, and again.   It was like, "hey, if I give these guys enough chances maybe they'll play better".

snyder never had a qb like freems, but the highest pass attempts per game snyds ever had was in '89 (36 per game).  Between '92-'96 the highest was 32 in '93.  After that, we basically were in the mid to low 20's in pass attempts (except in '04 and '05 when we sucked and threw it about 28 times).  We're throwing coffman around 30 times a game.  That's down from the 37 that ronald averaged over 3 years.  Though, it's kind of relative, we were good so we could run the ball and salt away the game.

[pissclams]

ring bells bitch