My friend is a jesus freak (jesus freaks gtfo of my thread)

[McGrowlTowelZac]

Wow, just stumbled onto this thread about a month too late.  There were so many responses to to reply to, but I don't want to be here all night.

The hostility in this thread towards Christians is mind boggling.  I don't get it either.  I hate ku, but I understand that there are decent people who are ku fans.  So some hawks I might like, others not so much.  Stereotyping them altogether does no good.

If you saw someone drowning and you had a life preserver, wouldn't you at least throw it to the person?  If they don't want to take it, then so be it.   If they want to try an tread water on their own, then good luck to them.

that's just it, you f*cking idiots think we're drowning.  we're all just living, so stfu and do your thing and let others do theirs and quit acting like you're saving someone who isn't drowning.

[steve dave]

Everyone on earth believes something different than everyone else.  Pretty much the #1 talking point of all time.  Best to just let this one go folks. 

[McGrowlTowelZac]

Everyone on earth believes something different than everyone else.  Pretty much the #1 talking point of all time.  Best to just let this one go folks. 

Yea, but I wanted to save the world one ksufans.com thread at a time.

[ksuno1stunner]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDHJ4ztnldQ

One thing I have noticed is the vague responses I receive everytime I tried to dispute something.  Is the world really 10,000 years old?  "Well, that's not exactly important, that could mean a lot of things."  Can God heal amputees?  "Well, people always try and provide questions to dispute God.  It's not like you can debate someone into God."  What about the God and the huge rock example?  "Once again, that is another question which isn't really important in the grand scheme of things."  Why is christianity right, and Buddhism isn't?  "Well, when I looked at it and compared it to christianity, it just didn't make sense.  It is just too individual."  Can't scientists come close to making basic life?  "No, the cells shriveled up right away."  What about the people who aren't surrounded by christianity?  Do they go to hell?  "Well, God is just, and doesn't try and judge too harshly.  (Which makes no sense to me with how hard I'm being pressured into it).  God will give everyone an opportunity to follow him."

O RLY?

[McGrowlTowelZac]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDHJ4ztnldQ
O RLY?

Oh wow, that video from youtube just changed my life!  Why didn't we have youtube 20 years ago, my life wouldn't have been wasted. 

Ok, seriously, the guy sounded like he was a rational, well-informed, educated person.  Who clearly will never believe anything that isn't directly sitting right in front of him.  That's fine.  Some people are obviously incapable of having faith.  I understand its hard to believe in something you can't see, touch, hear, etc.  That's why its called Faith. 
What is the point of having Faith if God comes down to earth for all to see?  What's difficult about that?  He wants you to make the choice.  He is not forcing you to do anything YOU don't want to do.
I realize it is frustrating not being able to understand every facet of God, but He is beyond our understanding.  That might be a 'strange, insane rationalization', but thats what the Devil wants you to think.  God is not the only force out there to be reckoned with, the Devil is here too.  The Devil causes pain and suffering and he may win some battles, but he won't win the war.

[PCR]

Fatty made a good point--it's amazing how many Engineers are Jesus Freaks... I think Jesus Freaks have a strong affinity for order and tradition, and Engineers tend to like those things as well.  But there's a billion exceptions to this, so I don't really know... I know almost all of my engineering buddies were religious at K-State.  It might just be a Kansas thing, though.  It really is the buckle of the Bible Belt.  For a State that made its name on being Free-Thinkers and dissenters, we really have made a habit of conforming. 

I think trying to make sense of life on your own without some sort of framework (usually religion) is pretty difficult.  Some people, like us atheist/agnostics, don't really care enough about divine intervention or an afterlife enough to take what is clearly an intellectually dishonest stance on the nature of the Universe.  In my opinion, religion is a fine tool for attempting to make some sense of your life, but you have to be honest with yourself and admit that it's utter nonsense.  I think there's a LOT of religious people who know it's nonsense, but participate anyway.  Your born-again Jesus Freak friend is probably not one of these people.  The born-agains seem to love diving head-first into the mythology and gulping it down as though it's the Answer to Life The Universe and Everything.  Tell him that he doesn't know the Answer and nobody does (aside from 42), and to get off his high horse and stop thinking so highly of himself. 

I was listening to a sociologist who studies the brain, and he said if there were no pre-conceived notions of any religions up to this point in history, human beings would invent them within a month.  It's just the way people are made.  Being religious has a lot to do with your personality, too.  Speaking for myself, I'm really analytical, and it just makes it hard for me to believe anything without some very strong supporting evidence.  A lot of people will believe anything without much in the way of facts to support it.  Salesmen and Politicians rely on the fact that this is how most people make decisions--very emotional, not so much facty. 

[PCR]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDHJ4ztnldQ
O RLY?

Oh wow, that video from youtube just changed my life!  Why didn't we have youtube 20 years ago, my life wouldn't have been wasted. 

Ok, seriously, the guy sounded like he was a rational, well-informed, educated person.  Who clearly will never believe anything that isn't directly sitting right in front of him.  That's fine.  Some people are obviously incapable of having faith.  I understand its hard to believe in something you can't see, touch, hear, etc.  That's why its called Faith. 
What is the point of having Faith if God comes down to earth for all to see?  What's difficult about that?  He wants you to make the choice.  He is not forcing you to do anything YOU don't want to do.
I realize it is frustrating not being able to understand every facet of God, but He is beyond our understanding.  That might be a 'strange, insane rationalization', but thats what the Devil wants you to think.  God is not the only force out there to be reckoned with, the Devil is here too.  The Devil causes pain and suffering and he may win some battles, but he won't win the war.

See this is exactly what I'm talking about.  You say you're perfectly fine with having "faith", which means you decided that your Religion is true in the absence of any real supporting evidence.  That's why religions are so successful.  Most people are this way.  The great logical fallacy is that you're using circular logic to support your belief.   You say you have belief because... well you believe in it.  Complete nonsense, but you wouldn't be able to accept Christian (or whatever) dogma without this suspension of disbelief.  As long as you know it's nonsense, then I say God Bless, Go Forward!

[Pete]

most christians believe that if children get killed at a young enough age where they arent intelligent enough to understand about God or religon then they havent been able to make the choice to become a christian and therefore will go to heaven.  and the example about adults in other countries not having heard of the "christian God or Jesus" is why there are missionaries.  it is the responsibility of christians to spread God's word to people who havent heard it.

This is also a really good way to drive revenue.  Turn everyone in your organization into a salesmen and base their ultimate annual review (at least partially) on this effort.  &@#%ing brilliant move by the christians in my opinion.  Would have thought the Jews had thought of it.   

[McGrowlTowelZac]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDHJ4ztnldQ
O RLY?

Oh wow, that video from youtube just changed my life!  Why didn't we have youtube 20 years ago, my life wouldn't have been wasted. 

Ok, seriously, the guy sounded like he was a rational, well-informed, educated person.  Who clearly will never believe anything that isn't directly sitting right in front of him.  That's fine.  Some people are obviously incapable of having faith.  I understand its hard to believe in something you can't see, touch, hear, etc.  That's why its called Faith. 
What is the point of having Faith if God comes down to earth for all to see?  What's difficult about that?  He wants you to make the choice.  He is not forcing you to do anything YOU don't want to do.
I realize it is frustrating not being able to understand every facet of God, but He is beyond our understanding.  That might be a 'strange, insane rationalization', but thats what the Devil wants you to think.  God is not the only force out there to be reckoned with, the Devil is here too.  The Devil causes pain and suffering and he may win some battles, but he won't win the war.

See this is exactly what I'm talking about.  You say you're perfectly fine with having "faith", which means you decided that your Religion is true in the absence of any real supporting evidence.  That's why religions are so successful.  Most people are this way.  The great logical fallacy is that you're using circular logic to support your belief.   You say you have belief because... well you believe in it.  Complete nonsense, but you wouldn't be able to accept Christian (or whatever) dogma without this suspension of disbelief.  As long as you know it's nonsense, then I say God Bless, Go Forward!

Thats what Faith is, being sure of what you cannot see. Its not hard to believe in concrete being hard, I can walk outside and fall on it.  Its right in front of you.  How hard is it to say, 'I believe all this stuff to be true, because of this mountain of evidence.'?  Bravo, you are able to make a seemingly obvious choice, you are to be commended. 
If God wanted being a Christian to be easy He would appear to the world and say, "Get off the couch and worship me!"  He has given us a choice.

For a State that made its name on being Free-Thinkers and dissenters, we really have made a habit of conforming. 

This day and age, it is probably more conforming to be a non-christian, then to actually be a Christian. 

[Rick Daris]

Fatty made a good point--it's amazing how many Engineers are Jesus Freaks... I think Jesus Freaks have a strong affinity for order and tradition, and Engineers tend to like those things as well.  But there's a billion exceptions to this, so I don't really know... I know almost all of my engineering buddies were religious at K-State.  It might just be a Kansas thing, though.  It really is the buckle of the Bible Belt.  For a State that made its name on being Free-Thinkers and dissenters, we really have made a habit of conforming. 

I think trying to make sense of life on your own without some sort of framework (usually religion) is pretty difficult.  Some people, like us atheist/agnostics, don't really care enough about divine intervention or an afterlife enough to take what is clearly an intellectually dishonest stance on the nature of the Universe.  In my opinion, religion is a fine tool for attempting to make some sense of your life, but you have to be honest with yourself and admit that it's utter nonsense.  I think there's a LOT of religious people who know it's nonsense, but participate anyway.  Your born-again Jesus Freak friend is probably not one of these people.  The born-agains seem to love diving head-first into the mythology and gulping it down as though it's the Answer to Life The Universe and Everything.  Tell him that he doesn't know the Answer and nobody does (aside from 42), and to get off his high horse and stop thinking so highly of himself. 

I was listening to a sociologist who studies the brain, and he said if there were no pre-conceived notions of any religions up to this point in history, human beings would invent them within a month.  It's just the way people are made.  Being religious has a lot to do with your personality, too.  Speaking for myself, I'm really analytical, and it just makes it hard for me to believe anything without some very strong supporting evidence.  A lot of people will believe anything without much in the way of facts to support it.  Salesmen and Politicians rely on the fact that this is how most people make decisions--very emotional, not so much facty. 

There is actually quite a bit to the personality/religion thing. I am an INTP and can't force myself to believe in god, jesus, etc. I kind of wish I could, but I can't. Introverted/analytical people as a whole aren't very religious, at least compared to other personalities.

[LimestoneOutcropping]

Wow, just stumbled onto this thread about a month too late.  There were so many responses to to reply to, but I don't want to be here all night.

The hostility in this thread towards Christians is mind boggling.  I don't get it either.  I hate ku, but I understand that there are decent people who are ku fans.  So some hawks I might like, others not so much.  Stereotyping them altogether does no good.

If you saw someone drowning and you had a life preserver, wouldn't you at least throw it to the person?  If they don't want to take it, then so be it.  If they want to try an tread water on their own, then good luck to them.

As far as Christians being hypocritical, well a lot of times that just comes from people wanting to see them fail.  Christians aren't perfect, nor will they ever be, but the point is to try to be Christ like, who was without sin.  Because they put themselves out there as trying to live without sin, I know it makes it that much more fun and easier to point and laugh when they trip up.  But at least their trying.

Trying to put God into a perspective that you can understand is where so many people will turn away.  Our minds can't comprehend God and his existence, and to try to put God into a standard to do so is pointless.  His power is unfathomable.  That's where faith comes into it.  Faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you cannot see.  And for many that faith is asking too much.

 

First, I think people are just throwing some thoughts out there but, like is too typical, a religious fella takes it as a venomous attack.  If I say "it is uncontroverted that dinosaurs existed and therefore at least portions of the bible are as accurate as a Harry Potter book" you think is is some hate.  Its not.  Just pointing out what I think.

the life preserver comment is exactly why people really dislike having conversations with fundamentalists.  You are SO sure that non-christians are drowning and you are the only life preserver but assume, just for a second, that the muslims are right?  Aren't you actually throwing me an anchor which will certainly damn me to hell?

I think the most important thing is next time you go golfing with some over the top christian, get ridiculously drunk and make him drive you home...if he won't, he is not really a good christian.

[McGrowlTowelZac]

Wow, just stumbled onto this thread about a month too late.  There were so many responses to to reply to, but I don't want to be here all night.

The hostility in this thread towards Christians is mind boggling.  I don't get it either.  I hate ku, but I understand that there are decent people who are ku fans.  So some hawks I might like, others not so much.  Stereotyping them altogether does no good.

If you saw someone drowning and you had a life preserver, wouldn't you at least throw it to the person?  If they don't want to take it, then so be it.  If they want to try an tread water on their own, then good luck to them.

As far as Christians being hypocritical, well a lot of times that just comes from people wanting to see them fail.  Christians aren't perfect, nor will they ever be, but the point is to try to be Christ like, who was without sin.  Because they put themselves out there as trying to live without sin, I know it makes it that much more fun and easier to point and laugh when they trip up.  But at least their trying.

Trying to put God into a perspective that you can understand is where so many people will turn away.  Our minds can't comprehend God and his existence, and to try to put God into a standard to do so is pointless.  His power is unfathomable.  That's where faith comes into it.  Faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you cannot see.  And for many that faith is asking too much.

 

First, I think people are just throwing some thoughts out there but, like is too typical, a religious fella takes it as a venomous attack.  If I say "it is uncontroverted that dinosaurs existed and therefore at least portions of the bible are as accurate as a Harry Potter book" you think is is some hate.  Its not.  Just pointing out what I think.

the life preserver comment is exactly why people really dislike having conversations with fundamentalists.  You are SO sure that non-christians are drowning and you are the only life preserver but assume, just for a second, that the muslims are right?  Aren't you actually throwing me an anchor which will certainly damn me to hell?

I think the most important thing is next time you go golfing with some over the top christian, get ridiculously drunk and make him drive you home...if he won't, he is not really a good christian.

In my defense, I knew the 'drowning' comment would set some people off, so I followed it up with the 'treading water' comment. 

[asava]

i think the best posts in this entire thread has been steve dave. i don't get why people make it into a competition.

sure you can have a great discussion and debate over it, but what it essentially comes down to is a leap of faith. there are some people that take it, landing in different places, and some people who don't believe that there is anything to jump to. no matter what semblance of an answer you come to it is going to come down to that decision. everything in this world can be explained through any one perspective depending on the person who experiences it.

to me man is a limited creature, just like an ant, just like a dog. to expect to understand everything is unjust and arrogant. i'm not saying that people can't make decisions based on facts or prior evidence, because they do it everyday, and i, like everyone else, have. i'm also trying not to give too much information one way or the other as to what my beliefs are because i don't really think that is the point of the conversation. the point is that that decision is never a fact. it can be passionately believed to be a fact, but it doesn't make any more difference in it being the truth than it does to make something false. 

In my defense, I knew the 'drowning comment what set some people off, so I followed it up with the 'treading water' comment. 

its not that the drowning comment was the totality of the problem. once you made the decision that there was something that could save those people, you placed yourself in a better situation. i think what people have a problem with when people make these references is that maybe the people who you are attempting to throw a life saver to are already on a boat, or maybe there is no water at all. the fact that you encroach on another persons life and decisions and tell them they are essentially below you because of their life is immediately going to put them on the defensive. you are telling them that what they have chose is wrong without completely understanding that they may or may not have come to their conclusion through some process you have never experienced. thats what i think people are getting at.

[KSt8er]

If God wanted being a Christian to be easy He would appear to the world and say, "Get off the couch and worship me!"  He has given us a choice.

Seriously, think about it, what would God do all day if everyone was of one religion and knew that there was this one God, nothing, not a damn thing, he'd have nobody to judge, nobody to send to hell.   BORING.  Nope, judging and casting out, crap like that is so much more fun.

[LimestoneOutcropping]

Wow, just stumbled onto this thread about a month too late.  There were so many responses to to reply to, but I don't want to be here all night.

The hostility in this thread towards Christians is mind boggling.  I don't get it either.  I hate ku, but I understand that there are decent people who are ku fans.  So some hawks I might like, others not so much.  Stereotyping them altogether does no good.

If you saw someone drowning and you had a life preserver, wouldn't you at least throw it to the person?  If they don't want to take it, then so be it.  If they want to try an tread water on their own, then good luck to them.

As far as Christians being hypocritical, well a lot of times that just comes from people wanting to see them fail.  Christians aren't perfect, nor will they ever be, but the point is to try to be Christ like, who was without sin.  Because they put themselves out there as trying to live without sin, I know it makes it that much more fun and easier to point and laugh when they trip up.  But at least their trying.

Trying to put God into a perspective that you can understand is where so many people will turn away.  Our minds can't comprehend God and his existence, and to try to put God into a standard to do so is pointless.  His power is unfathomable.  That's where faith comes into it.  Faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you cannot see.  And for many that faith is asking too much.

 

First, I think people are just throwing some thoughts out there but, like is too typical, a religious fella takes it as a venomous attack.  If I say "it is uncontroverted that dinosaurs existed and therefore at least portions of the bible are as accurate as a Harry Potter book" you think is is some hate.  Its not.  Just pointing out what I think.

the life preserver comment is exactly why people really dislike having conversations with fundamentalists.  You are SO sure that non-christians are drowning and you are the only life preserver but assume, just for a second, that the muslims are right?  Aren't you actually throwing me an anchor which will certainly damn me to hell?

I think the most important thing is next time you go golfing with some over the top christian, get ridiculously drunk and make him drive you home...if he won't, he is not really a good christian.

In my defense, I knew the 'drowning comment what set some people off, so I followed it up with the 'treading water' comment. 

Again, what if you are wrong?  There are more muslims than christians.  And they are certainly dying a heck of a lot faster than christians thanks to W and the 101st...so won't they be taking over the after life?

I guess what I'm saying bro is you have the same odds as an atheist of being right.  And considering the evidence that the existence of dinosaurs is a fact and the earth is much, much older than 10,000 etc. you may actually be damning someone to everlasting hell by convincing them to be christian.

[KSt8er]

[
Again, what if you are wrong?  There are more muslims than christians.  And they are certainly dying a heck of a lot faster than christians thanks to W and the 101st...so won't they be taking over the after life?

That is one of my biggest hangups, if God knows all, why would he write a book knowing that Satan (presumably for arguement sake) will write others and his will be the more successful?  In other words, less than 50% of men will get into heaven based on the believing in Christ criteria, thus Satan wins more souls.  Kind of bad planning for someone who loves us imo. 

[McGrowlTowelZac]

 

In my defense, I knew the 'drowning comment what set some people off, so I followed it up with the 'treading water' comment. 

its not that the drowning comment was the totality of the problem. once you made the decision that there was something that could save those people, you placed yourself in a better situation. i think what people have a problem with when people make these references is that maybe the people who you are attempting to throw a life saver to are already on a boat, or maybe there is no water at all. the fact that you encroach on another persons life and decisions and tell them they are essentially below you because of their life is immediately going to put them on the defensive. you are telling them that what they have chose is wrong without completely understanding that they may or may not have come to their conclusion through some process you have never experienced. thats what i think people are getting at.

So if I told you I have been eating at this great restaurant, the food is awesome, great service, and wonderful atmosphere you would get upset with me?  You would be mad because you feel I am assuming that you have never eaten great food, or not experienced a great meal?
Christians share their beliefs because it has brought them joy and they want other to experience what they have.
I guess Christians should just keep it to themselves, that way if they're right, when everybody who wasn't a Christian could blame them while in hell. "Stupid Christians, always hiding their faith from us.  They're so selfish, never wanting to share."

[
Again, what if you are wrong?  There are more muslims than christians.  And they are certainly dying a heck of a lot faster than christians thanks to W and the 101st...so won't they be taking over the after life?

That is one of my biggest hangups, if God knows all, why would he write a book knowing that Satan (presumably for arguement sake) will write others and his will be the more successful?  In other words, less than 50% of men will get into heaven based on the believing in Christ criteria, thus Satan wins more souls.  Kind of bad planning for someone who loves us imo. 

You're right, you just shot a big old hole in God's logic.  Man, why didn't He consult with KSt8er, who clearly knows more than Him. 

[Pete]

Again, what if you are wrong?  There are more muslims than christians.  And they are certainly dying a heck of a lot faster than christians thanks to W and the 101st...so won't they be taking over the after life?

I guess what I'm saying bro is you have the same odds as an atheist of being right.  And considering the evidence that the existence of dinosaurs is a fact and the earth is much, much older than 10,000 etc. you may actually be damning someone to everlasting hell by convincing them to be christian.

ZOMG!

Limestone, you missed your calling majoring in Econ bro...you should have gone Philosophy.  You are a goddamn profit.   

[Pete]

That is one of my biggest hangups, if God knows all, why would he write a book knowing that Satan (presumably for arguement sake) will write others and his will be the more successful?  In other words, less than 50% of men will get into heaven based on the believing in Christ criteria, thus Satan wins more souls.  Kind of bad planning for someone who loves us imo. 

You're right, you just shot a big old hole in God's logic.  Man, why didn't He consult with KSt8er, who clearly knows more than Him. 

A legitimate question by Kst8er, IMO. 

Under the Christian model, we are FORCED to believe that the greater virtue is not providing eternal life for the most souls possible, but rather trying to CONVINCE as many souls as possible to the Christian belief system.  We are taught as Christians that God is omnipotent. 

However, God is arguably not benevolent.  How else do you explain children dying from burning to death?  Do you explain it by saying that they are rewarded with eternal life?  How does that make sense?  My Christian neighbor, who is 90, died peacefully in his sleep after a life of affluence and sickness free and according to other Christians moved on to eternal life....so the kid who dies with agonizing pain and whose family dies a form of death every day when they think of that fact are on the same value-scale as the 90 year old dude who ends up in the same blissful afterlife? 

Sure, I'll buy that "God works in mysterious ways," but I don't buy that God is completely free from logic.  Is is JUST as plausible that Christianity is a 1000 miles away from the "Truth" as it is that is "the truth."  It's that darned old vat of eternal burning fire that keeps 'em coming back.

[ArchE_Cat]

Fatty made a good point--it's amazing how many Engineers are Jesus Freaks... I think Jesus Freaks have a strong affinity for order and tradition, and Engineers tend to like those things as well.  But there's a billion exceptions to this, so I don't really know... I know almost all of my engineering buddies were religious at K-State.  It might just be a Kansas thing, though.  It really is the buckle of the Bible Belt.  For a State that made its name on being Free-Thinkers and dissenters, we really have made a habit of conforming. 

I think trying to make sense of life on your own without some sort of framework (usually religion) is pretty difficult.  Some people, like us atheist/agnostics, don't really care enough about divine intervention or an afterlife enough to take what is clearly an intellectually dishonest stance on the nature of the Universe.  In my opinion, religion is a fine tool for attempting to make some sense of your life, but you have to be honest with yourself and admit that it's utter nonsense.  I think there's a LOT of religious people who know it's nonsense, but participate anyway.  Your born-again Jesus Freak friend is probably not one of these people.  The born-agains seem to love diving head-first into the mythology and gulping it down as though it's the Answer to Life The Universe and Everything.  Tell him that he doesn't know the Answer and nobody does (aside from 42), and to get off his high horse and stop thinking so highly of himself. 

I was listening to a sociologist who studies the brain, and he said if there were no pre-conceived notions of any religions up to this point in history, human beings would invent them within a month.  It's just the way people are made.  Being religious has a lot to do with your personality, too.  Speaking for myself, I'm really analytical, and it just makes it hard for me to believe anything without some very strong supporting evidence.  A lot of people will believe anything without much in the way of facts to support it.  Salesmen and Politicians rely on the fact that this is how most people make decisions--very emotional, not so much facty. 

Apparently engineers aren't very analytical...well at least compared to you. 

It's also evident by your statement that you have not done much research regarding different religions and the kind of evidence that exists to support them.

[asava]

 

In my defense, I knew the 'drowning comment what set some people off, so I followed it up with the 'treading water' comment. 

its not that the drowning comment was the totality of the problem. once you made the decision that there was something that could save those people, you placed yourself in a better situation. i think what people have a problem with when people make these references is that maybe the people who you are attempting to throw a life saver to are already on a boat, or maybe there is no water at all. the fact that you encroach on another persons life and decisions and tell them they are essentially below you because of their life is immediately going to put them on the defensive. you are telling them that what they have chose is wrong without completely understanding that they may or may not have come to their conclusion through some process you have never experienced. thats what i think people are getting at.

So if I told you I have been eating at this great restaurant, the food is awesome, great service, and wonderful atmosphere you would get upset with me?  You would be mad because you feel I am assuming that you have never eaten great food, or not experienced a great meal?
Christians share their beliefs because it has brought them joy and they want other to experience what they have.
I guess Christians should just keep it to themselves, that way if they're right, when everybody who wasn't a Christian could blame them while in hell. "Stupid Christians, always hiding their faith from us.  They're so selfish, never wanting to share."

First off, you took that the wrong way, and completely misinterpreted what i said. if you are going to do that there is no reason to have a conversation with you.

Second off, to use you're analogies, in comaparison...
Originally you said that if someone was drowning, or treading water, why not throw them a life saver. If they don't take it that is their choice. You're second situation dealt with you eating at a fine restaurant and you want to tell people about it. In truth neither of them are comparable to eachother. The first acknowledges (from your perspective) that you are in a position to "save" someone. From the perspective of the person in the water maybe he is in no need of saving, maybe he is in his own boat, the S.S. Muhamed, S.S. Allah, S.S. John Smith, or the HMS Beagle, and his boat is perfectly acceptable to them, they don't see anything wrong with it. But to you those boats are on fire and it is your duty to put it out. You are, then, judging you're fellow man, which means that you put yourself before him, even above him. You can see why this may bother some people. As far as the restaurant you said you are eating at a very fine establishment, with excellent food, excellent service, and what have you. Its perfectly fine to tell people about that establishment. It's your right. But again what if the people you are talking to have already eaten there, and found spit in their food, or their steak was rotten. You cannot account for every experience every person has with that restaurant, especially one as big as yours. The restaurant comparison is much more reasonable. Feel free to talk about it as much as you want. Just don't look at the people who don't eat there as if they are starving and pawing at the window. Thats my point.

[ksuno1stunner]

christainity...dying religion?

[jeffy]

christainity...dying religion?

TIME Magazine    #12 TIME (April 8, 1966)
The question Is God Dead? appeared on the cover of TIME in red letters against a black backdrop, and this was the first time the magazine used a type only cover. The article, written by the editors and entitled Toward a Hidden God, included the opinions of Christian theologians Gabriel Vahanian, Paul van Buren, William Hamilton, Thomas J. Altizer, and the Rabbi Richard Rubenstein. They believed the death of God had come since God was no longer visible in public life and religion was dead. This article received much backlash from readers, but the radical movement died out by the end of the decade.

[ksuno1stunner]

 

http://scienceblogs.com/gnxp/2008/05/biblical_literalism_or_low_iq.php

[fatty fat fat]

become an islam, person.

[Saulbadguy]

I would post that on my facebook but got lots of jesus-y friends that would be offended.  Plus my former rabbi.

[ksuno1stunner]

i think i might post it on my jesus freak friend's wall

[jeffy]

If 'jesus freaks' are wrong, then no big deal.  If they are right, then 'woo hoo!'

If non-jesus freaks are wrong.... sucks to be them.

Saul,  are you on tap to be one of the 144,000?

[ksuno1stunner]

meh, i'm just going to go w/ the higher iq population.

[jeffy]

meh, i'm just going to go w/ the higher iq population.

I'm sure you and I are both outliers on that graph.