Just a quick question . . .

[kougar24]

There are problems inherent in every defense for sure, weak points, open areas etc. etc.   There's inherent issues and then there's bad fundamentals, and stupid play. 

Right. Backdoors are an inherent weakness in a D that overplays passing lanes. On-ball defenders getting broken down and blown by on the dribble is bad fundamental defense.

In other words, if you still demand to focus on defensive woes, your anger is still misguided even within that facet alone.

[bigDcat]

weird to bitch about backdoor cuts re. generally excellent defense in the uf & unlv games (i disagree w. _fan on defense quality in uf game) while ignoring the right-in-goddamned-front-door-&-drive-through-the-whole-effing-house horrible d against unf and the inability to handle a simple ball screen in the 1st half of the sav st game.

why were we going under screens?  were we daring them to shoot the 3?

Don't we do this a lot?     Also, this is what okstate likes to do a lot with page.

[kougar24]

weird to bitch about backdoor cuts re. generally excellent defense in the uf & unlv games (i disagree w. _fan on defense quality in uf game) while ignoring the right-in-goddamned-front-door-&-drive-through-the-whole-effing-house horrible d against unf and the inability to handle a simple ball screen in the 1st half of the sav st game.

why were we going under screens?  were we daring them to shoot the 3?

Don't we do this a lot?     Also, this is what okstate likes to do a lot with page.

How you guard against a screen depends on where on the court the screen is set. It also depends some on the defensive philosophy; you can have the guy guarding the screener hedge a step (seems to be Frank's wish), have him hedge completely (Self's design), or even press underneath to force the screener to flatten out (Frank's guys do this sometimes, but not sure it's by design).

It also depends on knowing opposing personnel. In your example, a guy would have to know Page is looking almost exclusively to jack up a 3, and that he's a good shooter. It isn't as simple as "never go under the screen" though, as teams can scheme against that as well, and even if you go over the screen, you can get too far behind a guy like Page to defend the shot if the screen is set high enough.

[sonofdaxjones]

There are problems inherent in every defense for sure, weak points, open areas etc. etc.   There's inherent issues and then there's bad fundamentals, and stupid play. 

Right. Backdoors are an inherent weakness in a D that overplays passing lanes. On-ball defenders getting broken down and blown by on the dribble is bad fundamental defense.

In other words, if you still demand to focus on defensive woes, your anger is still misguided even within that facet alone.

Again, you don't over play the base line passing lane when the offensive player is 2 passes (at least) away from the ball (unless of course they're going against a K-State defender who is playing terrible ball and man defense, in that case, they're a cut and one pass away for a dunk/layup away from the ball.

[catzacker]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

[sonofdaxjones]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this   

[kougar24]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this   

Maybe your anger is so misguided because you have false memories. I can't think of a single backdoor cut against us this year that was 2 passes away from the ball. It's always been the wing a single pass away from the point with the ball.

Maybe--maybe--there have been one or two instances of what you're talking about, but the vast majority (if not all) of our backdoor failings have come from a single pass away.

[Poster formerly known as jthutch]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this   

Maybe your anger is so misguided because you have false memories. I can't think of a single backdoor cut against us this year that was 2 passes away from the ball. It's always been the wing a single pass away from the point with the ball.

Maybe--maybe--there have been one or two instances of what you're talking about, but the vast majority (if not all) of our backdoor failings have come from a single pass away.

The bigger problem is that the guy that is gaurding 2 passes away is over playing and not in the right place for help side on the block.  Once one guy is beat everyone on the defense has to rotate to pick up the next guys man.

[kougar24]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this  

Maybe your anger is so misguided because you have false memories. I can't think of a single backdoor cut against us this year that was 2 passes away from the ball. It's always been the wing a single pass away from the point with the ball.

Maybe--maybe--there have been one or two instances of what you're talking about, but the vast majority (if not all) of our backdoor failings have come from a single pass away.

The bigger problem is that the guy that is gaurding 2 passes away is over playing and not in the right place for help side on the block.  Once one guy is beat everyone on the defense has to rotate to pick up the next guys man.

Our helpside D has generally been pretty good this year. Yes, when we get backdoor'd on occasion, someone screwed up a help assignment. However, helpside D (like backdoors in general) aren't nearly the concern our on-ball defense is.

But it sure is a fun topic for casual basketball fans like dax to pick up and run with.

[sonofdaxjones]

The typical bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example perpetually points to poor shooting or something on the offensive end during a K-State loss.   Failing to understand and/or compehend that at a critical juncture of the game, when K-State was in the lead, momentum was lost and in fact the game was lost on 4 or 5 serious defensive breakdowns, all done at the hand of the simplest play in basketball and in each case with the K-State player playing horrific ball and man defense and playing their man in an utterly stupid fashion given their mans relative court postion and relationship to the ball.   Said scenario has happened in 2 of the 3 K-State losses, with the 3rd loss showing K-State breaking down repeatedly in finding the ball in defensive transition and of course being backed doored repeatedly.   But a typical bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example, will once again point out offensive woes . . . yet the bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example, will embrace the JYC mantra will verve and vigor.

[sonofdaxjones]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this   

Maybe your anger is so misguided because you have false memories. I can't think of a single backdoor cut against us this year that was 2 passes away from the ball. It's always been the wing a single pass away from the point with the ball.Maybe--maybe--there have been one or two instances of what you're talking about, but the vast majority (if not all) of our backdoor failings have come from a single pass away.

Go back and look at the UNLV tape, there was a baseline backdoor cut for a layup where the ball was delivered from the top of the key, and where UNLV had a player on the wing on the same side the baseline guy made the cut to the basket from . . . that's 2 passes away from the ball in any normal defensive scenario, why are we over playing the passing lane 15 feet from the basket on the baseline??

[OregonSmock]

You all know I am right on this . . . you're all just too chickencac to admit it.

Welcome to www.goEMAW.com.

[chum1]

why does frank consistently yank players for following the master plan of allowing points off of backdoor cuts?  does he not understand his own genius?  c'mon frank!  c'mon!

[kougar24]

frank's defense overplays the passing lane when the ball is one pass away. always have.  not sure what team you're watching.  we have always given up the back door.  even with huggins.  it's not fundamentally sound to give up the back door cut, but it's a bi-product of teaching pressure on the wings.

You're not paying attention.   If you look at the floor, you could see that many times the guys we are losing in our defense are at least 2 passes away . . . but we're playing such bad ball and man defense, that the offensive player simply makes a little cut and goes back door on us, and they're instantly one pass away while the K-State defender looks like this   

Maybe your anger is so misguided because you have false memories. I can't think of a single backdoor cut against us this year that was 2 passes away from the ball. It's always been the wing a single pass away from the point with the ball.Maybe--maybe--there have been one or two instances of what you're talking about, but the vast majority (if not all) of our backdoor failings have come from a single pass away.

Go back and look at the UNLV tape, there was a baseline backdoor cut for a layup where the ball was delivered from the top of the key, and where UNLV had a player on the wing on the same side the baseline guy made the cut to the basket from . . . that's 2 passes away from the ball in any normal defensive scenario, why are we over playing the passing lane 15 feet from the basket on the baseline??

So...once?

[0.42]

The typical bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example perpetually points to poor shooting or something on the offensive end during a K-State loss.   Failing to understand and/or compehend that at a critical juncture of the game, when K-State was in the lead, momentum was lost and in fact the game was lost on 4 or 5 serious defensive breakdowns, all done at the hand of the simplest play in basketball and in each case with the K-State player playing horrific ball and man defense and playing their man in an utterly stupid fashion given their mans relative court postion and relationship to the ball.   Said scenario has happened in 2 of the 3 K-State losses, with the 3rd loss showing K-State breaking down repeatedly in finding the ball in defensive transition and of course being backed doored repeatedly.   But a typical bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example, will once again point out offensive woes . . . yet the bandwagon fan, like Kougs for example, will embrace the JYC mantra will verve and vigor.

You all know I am right on this . . . you're all just too chickencac to admit it.

Welcome to www.goEMAW.com.

This thread just got taken to another level.

[pissclams]

who cares if we miss shots?  we just need to shoot more!

[sys]

when dax dies, i hope someone has the foresight to donate his brain to science.

[kougar24]

when dax dies

Not going to happen.

[WillieWatanabe]

I would love to eat with Dax at BWW and watch him diagram plays in his wing sauce.

[kougar24]

I would love to eat with Dax at BWW and watch him diagram plays in his wing sauce.

(but in honey bbq sauce)

[Cire]

JFC we're not a top 15 team.

[pissclams]

JFC we're not a top 15 team.

the only reason we're not a top 15 team is because we haven't won enough games.  did you see how good our defense was against unlv?

[da_Catz]

Wow  

y'know, before reading this thread, I was really worried about our Defense (figured we couldn't shoot like cac forever on offense),
after reading this thread......not so much.

Cheers & E M A W  Y'ALL !

[WillieWatanabe]

JFC we're not a top 15 team.

glad you can read the rankings too.

[CHONGS]

Confirmation Bias