top ten reasons we fired ron prince

[michigancat]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

[OK_Cat]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

 

[Acceleration Man]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Smith, the Browns, Harper.  None of these guys would be here.  None.

Really, this is a dumb thread.  Really dumb.  Dis Snyder all you want, but this is dumb.

I'll buy a ticket on this train.

[kso_FAN]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken.  

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

[CHONGS]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Smith, the Browns, Harper.  None of these guys would be here.  None.

Really, this is a dumb thread.  Really dumb.  Dis Snyder all you want, but this is dumb.

The purpose is not to dis Snyder, but to access what has actually been improved.  Of course I don't want Prince back, we have to look to see what problems still exist.  KSU has been in a malaise since 2004 and it has been a pretty consistent malaise despite coaching changes.

A lot of the reasons people wanted Bill to step down in 2004 are still here.
A lot of the reasons people wanted Prince fired are still here.


To me that is the elephant in the room.  Its been 6 years now of the same bad defense and poor recruiting.

[OK_Cat]

The Smith/Harper/Browns talk is only going to buy OB so much time, though.

Smith has been good, but now he's done for the year.

Harper hasn't done anything worthwhile.

There's no way of knowing if either Brown will do much, given their short history at other schools.

[CHONGS]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken.  

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.  

It is a completely legit point.
I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time.  We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.

[yoga-like_abana]

Did you guys honestly think we would win this game?

[michigancat]

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something.  But I don't think being a little better than Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.

I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time.  We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.

Oooh, this is a good point.

[EllToPay]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken.  

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.

[CHONGS]

Did you guys honestly think we would win this game?

No, but that's not the point.

[kso_FAN]

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.  

It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something.  But I don't think being a little better then Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.

I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time.  We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.

Oooh, this is a good point.

The problem is I think "turn around a program" this time around is likely going to look like  8-4 bowl teams and not DOD type teams.  

[kso_FAN]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken. 

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.

Tuggle? Sams?

[CHONGS]

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.  

It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something.  But I don't think being a little better then Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.

I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time.  We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.

Oooh, this is a good point.

The problem is I think "turn around a program" this time around is likely going to look like  8-4 bowl teams and not DOD type teams.  

I would be 100% satisfied with that.  If we get that I am a happy man.

[EllToPay]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken. 

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.

Tuggle? Sams?

Sure, there's hope. But talking strictly in present tense, they're meaningless.

[yoga-like_abana]

Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2.  Just sayin'.

Point taken. 

BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points.  Not unusual though that this would be the case.

But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit.  I mean, those are some of our more talented guys. 

Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.

Tuggle? Sams?

Sure, there's hope. But talking strictly in present tense, they're meaningless.

So what you are saying is that he is slowly getting players here that fits his scheme? 

[Acceleration Man]

Michigan and OK... I get that you're not impressed with what Snyd's is doing. There may very well be some validity to that, some of which I'll readily admit. Just 2 things --

1. He's not as bad as you're making him out to be

2. Present a realistic scenario in which we either can hire someone better right now. And I don't mean pipe dreams. I mean realistic possibilities.

I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse -- after the Prince debacle, going with a known quantity who would appease donors, provide stability, and re-open some bridges for local recruiting wasn't the worst decision we could have gone for. My worry is that what happens when Synd's retires again -- which is why I think it's absurd that there seems to be no roadmap by Snyd's or Currie in this regard.

[Acceleration Man]

I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time.  We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.

Agreed, except for the fact that Prince's firing happened in large part because the team got progressively worse. I don't think that we've gotten worse at games/recruiting so far. But I would agree in so much that overall we need so see improvement next year over this year. That's realistic coming off a marginal season, and it simply holds Snyd's accountable for his most basic premise.

[michigancat]

1. He's not as bad as you're making him out to be.

No, he's exactly as bad as I'm making him out to be.

2. Present a realistic scenario in which we either can hire someone better right now. And I don't mean pipe dreams. I mean realistic possibilities.

Mike Leach is better, realistic and available right now.  RIGHT THE eff NOW.

I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse.

A lot worse would be difficult.

I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse -- after the Prince debacle, going with a known quantity who would appease donors, provide stability, and re-open some bridges for local recruiting wasn't the worst decision we could have gone for.

Anyone can do those things.  You don't have to be a "known quantity" to do everything you listed.

My worry is that what happens when Synd's retires again -- which is why I think it's absurd that there seems to be no roadmap by Snyd's or Currie in this regard.

That's exactly why you don't hire old men to be football coaches.  If you have a "plan", you're telling kids you'll bail on them.  If you don't, the other coaches will tell kids you'll bail on them.

[EllToPay]

Anyone that says Leach isn't a possibility can STFU. You think that dude wouldn't love more to come right back to the Big 12 and stick it to Tech every year?

[yoga-like_abana]

micat doing what micat does best.

[Acceleration Man]

Mike Leach is better, realistic and available right now.  RIGHT THE foooock NOW.

Would you give Leach more than 2.5 years to build a "successful" program, if necessary? (Not necessarily opposed to the Leach idea, but just curious).

A lot worse would be difficult.

Agreed.

Anyone can do those things.

Really? Would have to disagree with that.

That's exactly why you don't hire old men to be football coaches.  If you have a "plan", you're telling kids you'll bail on them.  If you don't, the other coaches will tell kids you'll bail on them.

Definitely has the potential to be a problem, but not so sure it IS a problem. Also, I'm not saying we have to be all public with it, but it bothers me that there has been no indication of any plan.

[Acceleration Man]

What I mean about having a plan in place could simply be this. Snyd's agrees that when an excellent coaching candidate is available, the university can gauge their interest, and if it looks like a go, Snyd's would be willing to step down. I'm disappointed that we're not pursuing something like this, and/or that Snyd's would never do something like this.

[Kat Kid]

If we could hire Leach.  It would be exactly like that time Rusty was like "We need to hire Huggins.  RIGHT NOW!  He's just sitting there!!"  and everyone was all like "We can't do that!  We're K-State!  We almost went .500 in league anyway."

And then 

It could happen again.  I want it to happen so bad.

[OK_Cat]

What I mean about having a plan in place could simply be this. Snyd's agrees that when an excellent coaching candidate is available, the university can gauge their interest, and if it looks like a go, Snyd's would be willing to step down. I'm disappointed that we're not pursuing something like this, and/or that Snyd's would never do something like this.

eff that.  We don't need to give Snyder options.  When the time is right, change the locks.