Jay Williams Preseason Top PG's

[CNS]

I think Jake can be a very successful PG if we are able to fill the SG position with someone that can get buckets.  If Jake is the only guard on the court demanding respect from the D, we are mumped.

If Rodney/Nick/MI/anyone else can play a competent 2 spot, we should be fine.

My main concern this year(other than the 2/3 spot) is our break.  We won a lot of games last year by pushing the ball faster  for longer than others could keep up with.  Now that Denis is gone, our ability to do that will be hit hard.  Jake seems to be a different style of guard than Denis.  He can press it, but no one can as well as Denis.  It will be interesting to see how we alter our game to compensate.

[kso_FAN]

Frank will dual combo guard the heck out of things early and we'll see how things shake out.  IMO its likely Jake fits the PG/combo role, but we'll see.

[CNS]

No question it will be a combo-guard solution, but I don't think Jake can be combo'ed with anyone currently on the roster that will provide as fast of a pushing front as what he and Denis did.

It will have to become more of a measured, controlled attack rather than Denis out running everyone with solid trailers.  What worries me about this is that we sucked the most last season when things slowed down.

[Skipper44]

Do any of you remember how well at time Jake played at the point when he was a freshman?  84-75?  Going toe to toe with DJamer Augustin in the CTS?  Jake and McOreb are clearly the best backcourt for this team. 

[Skipper44]

No question it will be a combo-guard solution, but I don't think Jake can be combo'ed with anyone currently on the roster that will provide as fast of a pushing front as what he and Denis did.

It will have to become more of a measured, controlled attack rather than Denis out running everyone with solid trailers.  What worries me about this is that we sucked the most last season when things slowed down.

The pace of the team will most likely go down, but I look expect an increase in eff. in the post from Kelly, Samuels and Judge.  It may  :powerespect: to say, but Freddy has to be million times better in the half court offense when compared Colon.

[kitten_mittons]

Do any of you remember how well at time Jake played at the point when he was a freshman?  84-75?  Going toe to toe with DJamer Augustin in the CTS?  Jake and McOreb are clearly the best backcourt for this team. 

It is true that Jake as a Freshman tore apart Chalmers and Sherron Collins in the same game.

[kso_FAN]

Do any of you remember how well at time Jake played at the point when he was a freshman?  84-75?  Going toe to toe with DJamer Augustin in the CTS?  Jake and McOreb are clearly the best backcourt for this team. 

I think you are likely correct.

[CNS]

Do any of you remember how well at time Jake played at the point when he was a freshman?  84-75?  Going toe to toe with DJamer Augustin in the CTS?  Jake and McOreb are clearly the best backcourt for this team. 

I am missing this reference.   

[chum1]

chum1,

McGruder 12.5 MPG
Irving 10.3 MPG

You really nailed this one, 10.3 MPG is clearly greater than 12.5 MPG.

Not once last year did Irving display the playmaking ability to be a full time PG. The handle, passing ability, court vision just aren't there, not saying he can't improve in those areas, but he's just not the answer to run the show for this team.

You're vastly underestimating Pullen's passing ability, he has very good court vision. He does need to be less careless with the ball and his improvement in that area will be vital to our success this year, but I've seen Jake play enough to know that if given the opportunity, he excels at drawing defenders and finding the open man. With him being the primary ballhandler this year, those opportunities will increase and his passing ability will be on further display.

sorry i misremembered the mpg. you may be right that mi sucks, but my point is more that the others suck more. if you're right about pullen, you wouldn't have all of the experts disagreeing with you.

[Underdog Wildcat]

Never said Irving sucks, just that he won't be a full time PG, can still be a very valuable contributor to this team as a "3rd guard" off the bench or possibly a starter at the 2 at the end of his career.

The "experts" might have watched Pullen play 5 times over the past 3 years, I've seen him play 100 times, doesn't mean that my overall knowledge of the game is better, just that I have had better opportunity to observe all the strengths, weaknesses, nuances, etc. of his game.

[kso_FAN]

No question it will be a combo-guard solution, but I don't think Jake can be combo'ed with anyone currently on the roster that will provide as fast of a pushing front as what he and Denis did.

It will have to become more of a measured, controlled attack rather than Denis out running everyone with solid trailers.  What worries me about this is that we sucked the most last season when things slowed down.

There are other ways to push the ball and increase the tempo of the game and we will continue to do so.  Granted, having the fastest player on the court who also handles the ball well is a great way to do it, but we'll find a way.  Frank isn't going to suddenly try some sort of Sadler approach to Wildcat hoops and play 60 possession games.

[CNS]

No question it will be a combo-guard solution, but I don't think Jake can be combo'ed with anyone currently on the roster that will provide as fast of a pushing front as what he and Denis did.

It will have to become more of a measured, controlled attack rather than Denis out running everyone with solid trailers.  What worries me about this is that we sucked the most last season when things slowed down.

There are other ways to push the ball and increase the tempo of the game and we will continue to do so.  Granted, having the fastest player on the court who also handles the ball well is a great way to do it, but we'll find a way.  Frank isn't going to suddenly try some sort of Sadler approach to Wildcat hoops and play 60 possession games.

I didn't mean that extreme of slow.   We have a lot of talent and that will allow us to keep up a fast pace.  It just won't be what it was.

<---Misses Denis.   

I am a little worried though.  Last year, our guys did a lot of standing around and got stagnant pretty easily when we tried to slow things down.  I am sure it will get figured out.

[sys]

1. pullen
2. mcgruder
3. samuels
4. kelly or judge
5. asprilla or kelly

i understand this is the gpctard's preferred lineup.  and i can see the appeal.  but that's a really poor handling team.

[chum1]

There was a thread on the subject, but losing Clemente could be way more devastating than anyone has been willing to admit.

[Skipper44]

1. pullen
2. mcgruder
3. samuels
4. kelly or judge
5. asprilla or kelly

i understand this is the gpctard's preferred lineup.  and i can see the appeal.  but that's a really poor handling team.

The improvement at the 5 over Colon will help with what McGruder takes away at the two.  How much better is MI at 1 and JP at the 2 really?

[CNS]

1. pullen
2. mcgruder
3. samuels
4. kelly or judge
5. asprilla or kelly

i understand this is the gpctard's preferred lineup.  and i can see the appeal.  but that's a really poor handling team.

The improvement at the 5 over Colon will help with what McGruder takes away at the two.  How much better is MI at 1 and JP at the 2 really?

Does not compute.  How will having a better big alleviate our need for solid ball handling?

Samuels better have gained a enough of a handle for the 3 this off season.  Either that or one of the unknown quantities at guard better have really flipped a switch.  If neither happened, our handling is in trouble.

[kitten_mittons]

1. pullen
2. mcgruder
3. samuels
4. kelly or judge
5. asprilla or kelly

i understand this is the gpctard's preferred lineup.  and i can see the appeal.  but that's a really poor handling team.

The improvement at the 5 over Colon will help with what McGruder takes away at the two.  How much better is MI at 1 and JP at the 2 really?

Does not compute.  How will having a better big alleviate our need for solid ball handling?

Samuels better have gained a enough of a handle for the 3 this off season.  Either that or one of the unknown quantities at guard better have really flipped a switch.  If neither happened, our handling is in trouble.

Samuels probably doesn't start this year again.  Frank likes him at the 4 and will put him at the 3 only when he's wanting the lineup to go big, or if someone gets in foul trouble.

[Skipper44]

1. pullen
2. mcgruder
3. samuels
4. kelly or judge
5. asprilla or kelly

i understand this is the gpctard's preferred lineup.  and i can see the appeal.  but that's a really poor handling team.

The improvement at the 5 over Colon will help with what McGruder takes away at the two.  How much better is MI at 1 and JP at the 2 really?

Does not compute.  How will having a better big alleviate our need for solid ball handling?

Samuels better have gained a enough of a handle for the 3 this off season.  Either that or one of the unknown quantities at guard better have really flipped a switch.  If neither happened, our handling is in trouble.

Assuming Freddy is a solid threat inside, I believe it will reduce the pressure the perimeter ball handlers will see.  Granted, Colon only played about 15 minutes a game so I may be grasping at straws here. 

I am also hoping McGruder has worked on his ball handling a lot in the summer :screenshotofDCandRMplaying1on1:

[OregonSmock]

My best guess at K-State's starting lineup to start next season:


1.  Irving
2.  Pullen
3.  McGruder
4.  Samuels
5.  Kelly



By mid season it could look like this:


1.  Russell
2.  Pullen
3.  McGruder
4.  Judge
5.  Kelly

[ChiComCat]

By mid season it could look like this:


1.  Russell
2.  Pullen
3.  McGruder
4.  Judge
5.  Kelly

I think Beamers is closest on this, though Judge and Kelly switched.  Spri will start possibly depending on the size of the other team.  We need a spark off the bench and I think that will continue to be Samuels role until Pullen graduates.

Its not that JamSam isn't one of our best player or won't play a majority of minutes.

[Benja]

My best guess at K-State's starting lineup to start next season:


1.  Irving
2.  Pullen
3.  McGruder
4.  Samuels
5.  Kelly



By mid season it could look like this:


1.  Russell
2.  Pullen
3.  McGruder
4.  Judge
5.  Kelly

Irving will start about the same time the Gridiron Club gets built. The other one is pretty dumb too.

[Benja]

Startling lineup especially for next year won't mean much anyways. Easiest way to make sense of it is just break it down by minutes played

[skycat]

1 - Jacob Pullen: 18 min, Martavious Irving: 8, Will Spradling: 8, Juevol Myles: 3, Nick Russell: 3
2 - Jacob Pullen: 15, Rodney McGruder: 9, Nick Russell: 5, Shane Southwell: 4, Jarrod Kruger: 3, Martavious Irving: 2, Juevol Myles: 2
3 - Jamar Samuels: 16, Rodney McGruder: 8, Nino Williams: 8, Victor Ojeleye: 4, Shane Southwell: 4
4 - Curtis Kelly: 20, Wally Judge: 11, Jamar Samuels: 9
5 - Freddy Asprilla: 19, Jordan Henriquez-Roberts: 10, Wally Judge: 6, Curtis Kelly: 5

[skycat]

I don't get the negative comments about McGruder's ball handling. McG isn't especially turnover prone -- moreso than Clemente, but not as much as Pullen. His assist pct is much lower than either, but he makes up for that with a higher true shooting pct.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=denis-clemente&p1=jacob-pullen&p2=rodney-mcgruder

[kitten_mittons]

1 - Jacob Pullen: 18 min, Martavious Irving: 8, Will Spradling: 8, Juevol Myles: 3, Nick Russell: 3
2 - Jacob Pullen: 15, Rodney McGruder: 9, Nick Russell: 5, Shane Southwell: 4, Jarrod Kruger: 3, Martavious Irving: 2, Juevol Myles: 2
3 - Jamar Samuels: 16, Rodney McGruder: 8, Nino Williams: 8, Victor Ojeleye: 4, Shane Southwell: 4
4 - Curtis Kelly: 20, Wally Judge: 11, Jamar Samuels: 9
5 - Freddy Asprilla: 19, Jordan Henriquez-Roberts: 10, Wally Judge: 6, Curtis Kelly: 5

You high?