Jay Williams Preseason Top PG's

[Underdog Wildcat]

JPullz nowhere to be found.

Get angry, Cat fans, GET ANGRY.

1. Kalin Lucas
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Jimmer Fredette
4. Malcolm Delaney
5. Brandon Knight
6. Kemba Walker
7. Kevin Anderson
8. Demetri McCamey
9. Shelvin Mack
10. Josh Selby

BTW from a purely objective standpoint, Mack at 9 is a joke, no way he's not top 3.

[CNS]

JPullz nowhere to be found.

Get angry, Cat fans, GET ANGRY.

1. Kalin Lucas
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Jimmer Fredette
4. Malcolm Delaney
5. Brandon Knight
6. Kemba Walker
7. Kevin Anderson
8. Demetri McCamey
9. Shelvin Mack
10. Josh Selby

BTW from a purely objective standpoint, Mack at 9 is a joke, no way he's not top 3.

 

[Underdog Wildcat]

More fuel to the fire (and dammit, Mack is being underrated here also)

http://www.nbadraft.net/2011-preview-top-pgs

[Underdog Wildcat]

While we're at it(not quite as negative this time), Pullen, Samuels, and Kelly tabbed as 11th, 12th, and 14th best pro prospects in B12 this year by draftexpress.

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Top-NBA-Draft-Prospects-in-the-Big-12-Part-Three-11-15---3561/

[chum1]

Maybe he's listed where he should be at SG.

[jtksu]

JPullz nowhere to be found.

Get angry, Cat fans, GET ANGRY.

1. Kalin Lucas
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Jimmer Fredette
4. Malcolm Delaney
5. Brandon Knight
6. Kemba Walker
7. Kevin Anderson
8. Demetri McCamey
9. Shelvin Mack
10. Josh Selby

BTW from a purely objective standpoint, Mack at 9 is a joke, no way he's not top 3.

The dumb sons of bitches have him down in the HM category.

Also, Mack is @ 7, not 9.

[WillieWatanabe]

meh

[Underdog Wildcat]

JPullz nowhere to be found.

Get angry, Cat fans, GET ANGRY.

1. Kalin Lucas
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Jimmer Fredette
4. Malcolm Delaney
5. Brandon Knight
6. Kemba Walker
7. Kevin Anderson
8. Demetri McCamey
9. Shelvin Mack
10. Josh Selby

BTW from a purely objective standpoint, Mack at 9 is a joke, no way he's not top 3.

The dumb sons of bitches have him down in the HM category.

Also, Mack is @ 7, not 9.

Mack is at 9 in Jay Williams rankings from the original post, he's 7 in the NBADraft.net rankings, which were linked in my 2nd post in this thread.

You are correct though, Draftnet has Pullen ranked as "HM" in the PG category.

[jtksu]

JPullz nowhere to be found.

Get angry, Cat fans, GET ANGRY.

1. Kalin Lucas
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Jimmer Fredette
4. Malcolm Delaney
5. Brandon Knight
6. Kemba Walker
7. Kevin Anderson
8. Demetri McCamey
9. Shelvin Mack
10. Josh Selby

BTW from a purely objective standpoint, Mack at 9 is a joke, no way he's not top 3.

The dumb sons of bitches have him down in the HM category.

Also, Mack is @ 7, not 9.

Mack is at 9 in Jay Williams rankings from the original post, he's 7 in the NBADraft.net rankings, which were linked in my 2nd post in this thread.

You are correct though, Dreafnet has Pullen ranked as "HM" in the PG category.

Whoops, my bad.

[AbeFroman]

Maybe he's listed where he should be at SG.

[Panjandrum]

Maybe he's listed where he should be at SG.

This.

[Underdog Wildcat]

NBA Draftnet has Pullen ranked as "HM" in the PG category.

Are you folks having reading comprehension problems?

If we're going to be as good as advertised this year, Pullen is going to have to see the majority of his minutes at PG.

[jtksu]

NBA Draftnet has Pullen ranked as "HM" in the PG category.

Are you folks having reading comprehension problems?

If we're going to be as good as advertised this year, Pullen is going to have to see the majority of his minutes at PG.

Not sure how much I agree with that statement.  I think Pullen definitely needs to spend a ton of minutes at the point to aid in his NBA future.  We still have questions as to who will fill the minutes at SG if he moves over to the 1 full time and we would have questions at the 1 if he stays at the 2.  I expect we will see him moving back and forth between the 1 and 2 until we get a better idea of who is going to step up (other than him, of course) at the guard spots.

[Underdog Wildcat]

Do your like our chances better with Myles and/or Irving as our primary PG or McGruder and/or Russell as the primary 2G?

To me, it's no a brainer, Mac and Russell at the 2 provide us a much better shot at reaching our potential this year.

In addition, I belive if there's any position on the court where experience is valuable, it's at the 1.

[jtksu]

That is true, you can hide a lot of shortcomings at the 2 (especially if it's a commitee) but the 1 needs to be strong.  Regardless, I wouldn't say that I am worried about Myles or Irving at the 1, I would say I haven't seen enough out of either to really make a good judgement at this point.  Gruds certainly excites me but I would lump Russell in with Irving, Myles, Sprads, Nino, Southwell. etc in the "needs further evaluation category. 

[ChiComCat]

That is true, you can hide a lot of shortcomings at the 2 (especially if it's a commitee) but the 1 needs to be strong.  Regardless, I wouldn't say that I am worried about Myles or Irving at the 1, I would say I haven't seen enough out of either to really make a good judgement at this point.  Gruds certainly excites me but I would lump Russell in with Irving, Myles, Sprads, Nino, Southwell. etc in the "needs further evaluation category. 

Myles and Irving would make me worry my ass off.  I think it has to be Russell at the 1 when JP is at the 2, with McOrebs playing the 2 quite a bit while JP plays 1.  Irving will get spot duty.  Myles gets the Frank Martin treatment of playing 12 minutes one game then 0 minutes for the next couple.

[Underdog Wildcat]

Difference between Russell and Irving?Myles is that our coaches have specifically referred to him as a 2 and they have made no such distinction for Irving?Myles. I don't know if I necessarily agree with that but I have heard that through several different sources.

While it is true he hasn't proven himself on the court to a much greater degree than Irving/Myles, I believe Russell does possess greater upside than either of them by virtue of having a more advanced offensive skill set(handle, shooting, passing).

Bottom line, if we really do have a conference title contending, portential Final 4 team on our hands, I like our chances a lot better with a tough, expereinced, playmaking, shotmaker running the show. No one else on our roster besides Pullen comes close to meeting that description.

[ChiComCat]

Difference between Russell and Irving?Myles is that our coaches have specifically referred to him as a 2 and they have made no such distinction for Irving?Myles. I don't know if I necessarily agree with that but I have heard that through several different sources.

Did not know this, but am sticking with my original projection.  Russell just seems pointy to me

[Underdog Wildcat]

Russell just seems pointy to me

I know, I always thought the strength of his game was his passing/court vision/facilitating which would fall under the 'traditional" defintion of a PG, but hey, I don't get to see him in practice everyday and I don't get detailed reports on summer workouts, so there could be a lot I'm missing.  

not so much.

[chum1]

NBA Draftnet has Pullen ranked as "HM" in the PG category.

Are you folks having reading comprehension problems?

If we're going to be as good as advertised this year, Pullen is going to have to see the majority of his minutes at PG.

What you should take away from those NBA projections is that, due to his size, Pullen's only shot in the NBA is at point guard and that is an extreme longshot at best.

How he projects in the NBA has nothing to do with how he best serves KSU this year. 

The notion that Pullen best serves the team at PG is debatable.  Of all guards, Irving got the most minutes last year behind Pullen.  And he got the most quality minutes by far.  People can fantasize and hope all they want, but there's not good reason to expect this to change.  And if we push the ball like we did last year and both Irving and Pullen are on the court, there are more scoring opportunities with Pullen at SG - because he's much better at spotting up than Irving is.  Things might be different if Pullen was a good passer.  But he's not.

[sys]

Of all guards, Irving got the most minutes last year behind Pullen.  And he got the most quality minutes by far.  People can fantasize and hope all they want, but there's not good reason to expect this to change.

myles and spradling weren't on the team last year. 

[chum1]

Of all guards, Irving got the most minutes last year behind Pullen.  And he got the most quality minutes by far.  People can fantasize and hope all they want, but there's not good reason to expect this to change.

myles and spradling weren't on the team last year. 

a couple of first year meh recruits? that's where the hoping and fantasizing comes in.

[mcmwcat]

Of all guards, Irving got the most minutes last year behind Pullen.  And he got the most quality minutes by far.  People can fantasize and hope all they want, but there's not good reason to expect this to change.

myles and spradling weren't on the team last year. 

a couple of first year meh recruits? that's where the hoping and fantasizing comes in.

meh.  same thing could have been said about Irving last year.  if Martin thought Irving was the answer then he wouldn't have brought in Canada to compete for the spot.

[chum1]

Of all guards, Irving got the most minutes last year behind Pullen.  And he got the most quality minutes by far.  People can fantasize and hope all they want, but there's not good reason to expect this to change.

myles and spradling weren't on the team last year. 

a couple of first year meh recruits? that's where the hoping and fantasizing comes in.

meh.  same thing could have been said about Irving last year.  if Martin thought Irving was the answer then he wouldn't have brought in Canada to compete for the spot.

what you guys are missing is that mi played last year while other guards sat. he's an exception.

[Underdog Wildcat]

chum1,

McGruder 12.5 MPG
Irving 10.3 MPG

You really nailed this one, 10.3 MPG is clearly greater than 12.5 MPG.

Not once last year did Irving display the playmaking ability to be a full time PG. The handle, passing ability, court vision just aren't there, not saying he can't improve in those areas, but he's just not the answer to run the show for this team.

You're vastly underestimating Pullen's passing ability, he has very good court vision. He does need to be less careless with the ball and his improvement in that area will be vital to our success this year, but I've seen Jake play enough to know that if given the opportunity, he excels at drawing defenders and finding the open man. With him being the primary ballhandler this year, those opportunities will increase and his passing ability will be on further display.