US Men's National Team Soccer Thread! (lower division thread)

[scottwildcat]

MIR what is your hot list of coaches you would call that you would deem to be getable if you were head of the USSF? (Also I think MIR would be much better than Sun-dog as USSF president)

[scottwildcat]

let's hand the keys to mastroeni and just ghostride this bitch over the edge and into the colorado river

this made me legitimately chuckle pretty loudly at work.

[MakeItRain]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

[MakeItRain]

I mean at worst it's the second best job in the third best region in the world. I think it's the best job in the second best region in the world. If you're a European based coach are you really going to move to Brazil, Argentina, or Colombia for equal money?

The entire conversation is stupid anyway, how often are we discussing world class national team coaches anywhere? WTF did Joachim Low do before he lead Germany? The answer is not a damn thing.

Cuckold American soccer fans, man.

Ottmar Hitzfield won the Champions League with both Bayern and Dortmund before coaching the Swiss, Vincente del Bosque won the CL with Real Madrid before Spain, Conte coached Juventas and Siena before both to international success, Prandelli coached several Serie A teams to successful seasons, Hodgson has been coaching since the 70's, Tite is widely regarded as one of the best coaches on earth and Scolari coached a ton of great teams before Brazil.

These are a handful of a ton. You are delusional if you think coaching an American team, where soccer is a third tier sport, is going to be more enticing than European or South American teams where they are treated and looked at like a god, will be walking into an established and proven talent development system, and coaching a team with top level players. 

Three fourths of the countries you listed haven't won a rough ridin' thing in any of our lifetimes, so your stance is incredibly inconsistent.

Having won an international tournament is not the only prerequisite to having a job be desirable.

Let's have a quick look at where former USA coaches go, shall we: Egypt, LA Galaxy, bottom of a ditch, blah blah blah.

Side note: Cuckold American Soccer Fans is a great phrase.

Hitzfield and Conte are good examples of heralded coaches that went to national teams although its worth noting that neither of them accomplished anything even Steve Sampson didn't do himself. Del Bosque was fired twice before he took over in Spain and Prandelli finished 11th in Serie A  before taking over Italy.

You can make the argument, if you were interested in not being defeatist, that the reason American coaches haven't gotten better jobs after they left US Soccer because they are American. Bob Bradley absolutely performed as well as Conte if Italy doesn't win the euros and Prandelli, you simply cannot argue otherwise.

Even soccer as a third tier sport is a really big deal here, again I'll reference ticket sales at the last world cup. We also have a ton of money and this is a great place to live. It's a great job, I wouldn't want any of these European based managers anyway...

[MakeItRain]

MIR what is your hot list of coaches you would call that you would deem to be getable if you were head of the USSF? (Also I think MIR would be much better than Sun-dog as USSF president)

I'm not smart enough to be able to give you names beyond MLS guys but I can tell you what kind of coach we need:
1. Someone who realizes that this isn't Europe and never will be, we cannot win the same way, don't force a square peg in a round hole.
2. I should have listed this 1st because its the most important, WE CANNOT ACHIEVE THE LEVEL OF SUCCESS WE STRIVE FOR IF WE DO NOT HAVE A STRONG DOMESTIC LEAGUE. Instead of constantly shitting on the league we need to make it a top 5 league.
3. We need someone unafraid to play an attacking style, having a counter-attacking team to elongate your career is horse crap.
4. Someone who is able to recruit Americans worldwide, Jürgen is obviously great at this.
5. Someone who can place aside their ego and play our best players at their best positions.

I have a guy in mind someone who loves this country, has been all around the world and respected internationally and he understands the need for a strong domestic league. I won't say who though although its pretty easy to guess who this man is.

[asava]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

You keep going back to this "we have more" argument without acknowledging that "more" doesn't mean anything if there isn't actual quality produced. Are you seriously going to take the position that our youth development is on par with the top soccer playing countries in the world just because we have more kids playing shitty soccer? Pulisic left America at age 14 so he could go play under Dortmund's academy. The best players in the world are regularly playing with club academies in Europe or South America before entering high school. They generally are playing in youth academies from a much earlier age on (5-7 year olds). Throw in the absolute crap show of collegiate soccer, and the USA is worlds behind the opportunities provided to players abroad.

We aren't talking about who has more, or even what "most school aged kids" are doing in each country, we are talking about what they have available to them and how the top players are trained. Even if this was a "most school aged kids" discussion, do you really think that the average American kid is as into soccer or as good as the average Spanish, German, English, Argentinian, Brazlian, Belgian, Czech, Dutch, French, Greek, or Portuguese kid?

[asava]

MIR what is your hot list of coaches you would call that you would deem to be getable if you were head of the USSF? (Also I think MIR would be much better than Sun-dog as USSF president)

I'm not smart enough to be able to give you names beyond MLS guys but I can tell you what kind of coach we need:
1. Someone who realizes that this isn't Europe and never will be, we cannot win the same way, don't force a square peg in a round hole.
2. I should have listed this 1st because its the most important, WE CANNOT ACHIEVE THE LEVEL OF SUCCESS WE STRIVE FOR IF WE DO NOT HAVE A STRONG DOMESTIC LEAGUE. Instead of constantly shitting on the league we need to make it a top 5 league.
3. We need someone unafraid to play an attacking style, having a counter-attacking team to elongate your career is horse crap.
4. Someone who is able to recruit Americans worldwide, Jürgen is obviously great at this.
5. Someone who can place aside their ego and play our best players at their best positions.

I have a guy in mind someone who loves this country, has been all around the world and respected internationally and he understands the need for a strong domestic league. I won't say who though although its pretty easy to guess who this man is.

You don't think Jurgen wants a strong domestic league? He shits on the MLS because it hinders the continued development and training of his players. You can't dispute that this is actually correct. The growth of the MLS will be pivotal to the future strength of the USMNT, but it isn't doing us any favors at the moment.

[slobber]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

[sunny_cat]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

You think FC Dallas' Academy doesn't know crap? Red Bull's? NE's? LA's? Columbus'?

[asava]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

You think FC Dallas' Academy doesn't know crap? Red Bull's? NE's? LA's? Columbus'?

Not when compared to Barcelona, Everton, Boca Jr., Juventas, PSV, Porto, Bayer Leverkusen, etc.

[sunny_cat]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

You think FC Dallas' Academy doesn't know crap? Red Bull's? NE's? LA's? Columbus'?

Not when compared to Barcelona, Everton, Boca Jr., Juventas, PSV, Porto, Bayer Leverkusen, etc.

I didn't compare them? MLS is twenty years old. Academy system way younger than that. Those leagues are 100 years old.

[asava]

We have middle school coaches who think dump and run is great soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

We have middle school and high school coaches who are shop teachers just looking for a little extra cash and generally don't know a thing about soccer.

Do you think most school aged kids in most soccer playing countries are the reincarnation of Sir Alex? How qualified do you think most soccer coaches of 14 year olds in Brazil are doing? If you want I can walk over to my pool and go get a guy who coaches 13 year olds in England, he's lifeguarding a bunch of 5-14 year old Iowans right now, he'll be teaching Iowans how to use maps and compasses in an hour.

Do you and Dobber not realize how insane this argument is? Is there any doubt that there can't be more than five countries in the world that has more youth in soccer academies than we do?

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.


Royals aren't gonna win 'em all

You think FC Dallas' Academy doesn't know crap? Red Bull's? NE's? LA's? Columbus'?

Not when compared to Barcelona, Everton, Boca Jr., Juventas, PSV, Porto, Bayer Leverkusen, etc.

I didn't compare them? MLS is twenty years old. Academy system way younger than that. Those leagues are 100 years old.

Goddammit MIR, why can't you ever agree with me on something. My point is that out academies don't know crap about soccer and other countries' academies know something about soccer.

[MakeItRain]

MIR what is your hot list of coaches you would call that you would deem to be getable if you were head of the USSF? (Also I think MIR would be much better than Sun-dog as USSF president)

I'm not smart enough to be able to give you names beyond MLS guys but I can tell you what kind of coach we need:
1. Someone who realizes that this isn't Europe and never will be, we cannot win the same way, don't force a square peg in a round hole.
2. I should have listed this 1st because its the most important, WE CANNOT ACHIEVE THE LEVEL OF SUCCESS WE STRIVE FOR IF WE DO NOT HAVE A STRONG DOMESTIC LEAGUE. Instead of constantly shitting on the league we need to make it a top 5 league.
3. We need someone unafraid to play an attacking style, having a counter-attacking team to elongate your career is horse crap.
4. Someone who is able to recruit Americans worldwide, Jürgen is obviously great at this.
5. Someone who can place aside their ego and play our best players at their best positions.

I have a guy in mind someone who loves this country, has been all around the world and respected internationally and he understands the need for a strong domestic league. I won't say who though although its pretty easy to guess who this man is.

You don't think Jurgen wants a strong domestic league? He shits on the MLS because it hinders the continued development and training of his players. You can't dispute that this is actually correct. The growth of the MLS will be pivotal to the future strength of the USMNT, but it isn't doing us any favors at the moment.

How in the eff is he helping the domestic league by constantly being critical of it, encouraging players to bypass it, and not giving the players in the league a fair shake? The league is 20 rough ridin' years old, man. Just because it isn't as developed as others worldwide doesn't mean it is hindering development, that's actually insane to think mls is hindering development of soccer in this country.

[sunny_cat]

Is there anything more unsurprising than asava calling it "the MLS"?

[CHONGS]

Jesus Christ himself could coach US soccer, but until we have real players and not glorified hobbyists we will suck.

[mocat]

you guys, trust the process

[The Big Train]

yeah dont we need a spear and a crown of thorns or something first 

[scottwildcat]

Stop ruining this thread

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[asava]

MIR what is your hot list of coaches you would call that you would deem to be getable if you were head of the USSF? (Also I think MIR would be much better than Sun-dog as USSF president)

I'm not smart enough to be able to give you names beyond MLS guys but I can tell you what kind of coach we need:
1. Someone who realizes that this isn't Europe and never will be, we cannot win the same way, don't force a square peg in a round hole.
2. I should have listed this 1st because its the most important, WE CANNOT ACHIEVE THE LEVEL OF SUCCESS WE STRIVE FOR IF WE DO NOT HAVE A STRONG DOMESTIC LEAGUE. Instead of constantly shitting on the league we need to make it a top 5 league.
3. We need someone unafraid to play an attacking style, having a counter-attacking team to elongate your career is horse crap.
4. Someone who is able to recruit Americans worldwide, Jürgen is obviously great at this.
5. Someone who can place aside their ego and play our best players at their best positions.

I have a guy in mind someone who loves this country, has been all around the world and respected internationally and he understands the need for a strong domestic league. I won't say who though although its pretty easy to guess who this man is.

You don't think Jurgen wants a strong domestic league? He shits on the MLS because it hinders the continued development and training of his players. You can't dispute that this is actually correct. The growth of the MLS will be pivotal to the future strength of the USMNT, but it isn't doing us any favors at the moment.

How in the eff is he helping the domestic league by constantly being critical of it, encouraging players to bypass it, and not giving the players in the league a fair shake? The league is 20 rough ridin' years old, man. Just because it isn't as developed as others worldwide doesn't mean it is hindering development, that's actually insane to think mls is hindering development of soccer in this country.

So you are angry that Jurgen is calling a spade a spade and advising national team players to play in leagues that are admittedly more developed? I didn't say anything about the mls hindering development of soccer in this country. In fact I said the opposite. It is important to the continued development of soccer in this country. More interest, better facilities, and better infrastructure will lead to better soccer being played at all levels. Other things will need to change as well, but it all will take time. What I did say was that currently, MLS isn't doing our current players any favors and it puts them at a disadvantage in fitness, training, and quality of competition. You said it yourself, "the league is 20 rough ridin' years old, man." How can it, at present, provide USMNT players with the same quality of training and competition as other leagues? If what you are suggesting is that Jurgen should give his blessings to every USMNT player who wants to play in the MLS in order to bolster the advancement of the MLS rather than what is best for the USMNT players, then it's super weird that you are calling for his head now for not showing enough results now when a strategy like that would require a TON more time to have an effect.

[asava]

Stop ruining this thread

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Stop thinking you have any ownership in this thread.

[The Big Train]

theres like 3 people that even post here so it kind of is theirs

[asava]

Good point. carry on.

[Spaces]

3rd place would be fun today

[sunny_cat]

Stop ruining this thread

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Way too late for this

[sunny_cat]

3rd place would be fun today