Author Topic: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)  (Read 55297 times)

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Offline puniraptor

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #475 on: November 21, 2017, 07:00:37 PM »
k-s-u-w is a commercial Christmas lighting sales engineer. his wife is an HVAC sales engineer.

Offline Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #476 on: November 21, 2017, 09:48:23 PM »
Holy crap! I had no idea how hard I was dick punching the libtarded itt!

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Offline catastrophe

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #477 on: November 21, 2017, 11:24:42 PM »
Yea you have no idea about a lot of things.

Offline sys

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we understand it better now that the american century is over and some of us sound more and more like serbs.

Offline catastrophe

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #479 on: November 22, 2017, 07:22:39 AM »
I’m so pissed about everything estate tax right now.

Offline Dugout DickStone

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #480 on: November 22, 2017, 10:28:03 AM »
FSD did not have a point, just a failure to understand how things work. And I defy you to find someone in America who doesn’t pay taxes. He’s just conflating all tax with federal income tax.

You are grasping at technicalities to avoid the larger point. Just about everyone pays some tax, usually at least in the form of sales tax. But it's more than a little annoying to hear some bad person who pays an effective FIT rate near zero bitching about how some guy paying 15% or more doesn't deserve a tax cut. There are net makers and net takers in this society and the fact that they both get an equal voice in our governance leads one direction.

Unless you're paying FIT, please: STFU about somebody else getting to keep a little more of their money. That is all.

Sooo, you are revoking your offer to give up more of your money to support President Trump?

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline 8manpick

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #482 on: November 22, 2017, 11:22:03 AM »
I’m so pissed about everything estate tax right now.
Why should people pay more taxes on what has already been taxed?  Keep your hands out of my family's pocket.

I can't decide if I actually agree with that argument, but I think it has some merit.  I think it makes much more sense to tax high levels of income than it does tax inherited money and property. That is just a pure form of wealth redistribution.
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Offline 8manpick

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #483 on: November 22, 2017, 11:23:27 AM »
I’m so pissed about everything estate tax right now.
Why should people pay more taxes on what has already been taxed?  Keep your hands out of my family's pocket.

I can't decide if I actually agree with that argument, but I think it has some merit.  I think it makes much more sense to tax high levels of income than it does tax inherited money and property. That is just a pure form of wealth redistribution.
I guess what I'm saying is that if I were to write a new tax code from scratch that I thought was just, it wouldn't include an estate tax.
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Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #484 on: November 22, 2017, 11:41:05 AM »
I'll repeat that the estate tax can be legally avoided, and almost always is, with some careful estate planning. So the estate tax is primarily a boon for tax planning attorneys and cpas, and a political cudgel for Dems. If you can avoid a tax completely and legally by paying a lawyer to shelter your assets, that's a dumb tax.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline Dugout DickStone

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #485 on: November 22, 2017, 11:52:33 AM »
I'll repeat that the estate tax can be legally avoided, and almost always is, with some careful estate planning. So the estate tax is primarily a boon for tax planning attorneys and cpas, and a political cudgel for Dems. If you can avoid a tax completely and legally by paying a lawyer to shelter your assets, that's a dumb tax.

Then almost all taxes are a dumb tax in that case

Offline catastrophe

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #486 on: November 22, 2017, 12:15:23 PM »
I’m so pissed about everything estate tax right now.
Why should people pay more taxes on what has already been taxed?  Keep your hands out of my family's pocket.

I can't decide if I actually agree with that argument, but I think it has some merit.  I think it makes much more sense to tax high levels of income than it does tax inherited money and property. That is just a pure form of wealth redistribution.
I guess what I'm saying is that if I were to write a new tax code from scratch that I thought was just, it wouldn't include an estate tax.

There is always going to be an unfairness to taxes. Why should a grocery store pay tax on money I spend there when that money was already taxed when I got paid? And why should my income be taxed when my clients already paid tax on the money they used to pay my bills?

Offline 8manpick

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #487 on: November 22, 2017, 12:18:24 PM »
I’m so pissed about everything estate tax right now.
Why should people pay more taxes on what has already been taxed?  Keep your hands out of my family's pocket.

I can't decide if I actually agree with that argument, but I think it has some merit.  I think it makes much more sense to tax high levels of income than it does tax inherited money and property. That is just a pure form of wealth redistribution.
I guess what I'm saying is that if I were to write a new tax code from scratch that I thought was just, it wouldn't include an estate tax.

There is always going to be an unfairness to taxes. Why should a grocery store pay tax on money I spend there when that money was already taxed when I got paid? And why should my income be taxed when my clients already paid tax on the money they used to pay my bills?
Because goods or services were exchanged in a business transaction? Sales tax + income tax, done. Boom, problem solved.
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Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #488 on: November 22, 2017, 12:20:05 PM »
I'll repeat that the estate tax can be legally avoided, and almost always is, with some careful estate planning. So the estate tax is primarily a boon for tax planning attorneys and cpas, and a political cudgel for Dems. If you can avoid a tax completely and legally by paying a lawyer to shelter your assets, that's a dumb tax.

Then almost all taxes are a dumb tax in that case

Well there are a lot of stupid taxes out there. But there are many others that you can't legally avoid with a few simple moves. You make wage-based income, you generally have to pay tax on it.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline sys

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #489 on: November 22, 2017, 02:05:27 PM »
Because goods or services were exchanged in a business transaction? Sales tax + income tax, done. Boom, problem solved.

an estate is also only taxed when it changes hands.  i think it makes perfect sense to tax inherited wealth rather than earned income - society has an interest in encouraging industry, not sloth.

furthermore, much of that inherited wealth was initially taxed as capital gains or dividend/interest, at a lower rate than earned income.  as long as we provide tax breaks on income from capital, the argument that an estate has already been fully taxed, and should be passed to heirs tax-free is a bit shallow.

we understand it better now that the american century is over and some of us sound more and more like serbs.

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #490 on: November 22, 2017, 04:54:30 PM »
Estate tax is attempted social engineering to resist an aristocracy.

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #491 on: November 22, 2017, 05:00:01 PM »
You guys are still talking about estate tax as if rich people pay it.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline sys

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #492 on: November 22, 2017, 06:12:55 PM »
Estate tax is attempted social engineering to resist an aristocracy.

isn't it taken from the taxes nobility paid when an heir ascended to the title?
we understand it better now that the american century is over and some of us sound more and more like serbs.

Offline wetwillie

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #493 on: November 22, 2017, 06:37:14 PM »
You guys are still talking about estate tax as if rich people pay it.

If you have less than 5.5 milly you don't pay a dime giving it to your heirs.  I would say the 20 billion in estate taxes paid in 2016 was from some rich people.
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Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #494 on: November 22, 2017, 07:02:44 PM »
You guys are still talking about estate tax as if rich people pay it.

If you have less than 5.5 milly you don't pay a dime giving it to your heirs.  I would say the 20 billion in estate taxes paid in 2016 was from some rich people.

More likely "land rich" farmers and ranchers.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline wetwillie

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #495 on: November 22, 2017, 07:40:45 PM »
You guys are still talking about estate tax as if rich people pay it.

If you have less than 5.5 milly you don't pay a dime giving it to your heirs.  I would say the 20 billion in estate taxes paid in 2016 was from some rich people.

More likely "land rich" farmers and ranchers.

Quote
In 2016, only 682 taxable estates -- or just 13% of all taxable estates -- reported having any farm assets at all, said Beth Kaufman, an estate tax lawyer at Caplin & Drysdale and former associate tax legislative counsel at the Treasury Department.

Quote
And those farm assets represented just a small percent of the gross estate values on average. That suggests that for many in this select group, the farm was not the sole -- and maybe not even the primary -- source of income. It also suggests that there may be other assets to tap if needed to pay an estate tax bill.
For example, Kaufman noted, farm assets represented just 5.4% of total assets on average in taxable estates worth between $5 million and $10 million. That drops to 3.6% for estates worth between $10 million and $20 million, to just under 2% for those worth between $20 million and $50 million, and to 1.5% of estates valued at more than $50 million.
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Offline catastrophe

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #496 on: November 22, 2017, 08:20:55 PM »
#whenTedCruztalkingpointsgowrong

Offline IPA4Me

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #497 on: November 22, 2017, 08:39:45 PM »
Those pesky facts sure get in the way

Offline sys

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #498 on: November 22, 2017, 09:47:25 PM »
isn't it taken from the taxes nobility paid when an heir ascended to the title?

i guess prolly not, as apparently the british didn't start it up until the late 19th century.  we may have even started ours up first.
we understand it better now that the american century is over and some of us sound more and more like serbs.

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Re: Taxes (GOP 2017 edition)
« Reply #499 on: November 23, 2017, 07:09:53 AM »
Those pesky facts sure get in the way

Only when they fit your agenda.  Otherwise you just have to act like they are #fakenews