Dallas

[TCUHornedFrog]

I really do sympathize with both sides on this.

The vast majority of cops are people just doing a job (and by vast majority, >95%).  The problem is, as the Houston example Emo posted earlier, very small numbers of cops can have very large impacts on communities.  Throw in the us vs. them mentality that has been instilled in police departments since the beginning of the drug war, improved technology for people to monitor the police with, and you get to where we are now. 

[Trim]

There are no non-business encounters I've had w/cops in which I'd have been adequately comfortable if I'd been black.  That includes walking home (in which I was given a free ride, before uber even existed!).  Not sure about comfort levels when working with or above them.

One of my favorite stories is asking a cop for a ride home at 3am and level 7 and eating a microwave gas station burrito in the back while he chauffeured me home

So convenient.  Now, how do you see that situation playing out for Blib?

Edit: If you were Blib instead of lib, what would you have done differently or not at 3am?

[420seriouscat69]

[star seed 7]

There are no non-business encounters I've had w/cops in which I'd have been adequately comfortable if I'd been black.  That includes walking home (in which I was given a free ride, before uber even existed!).  Not sure about comfort levels when working with or above them.

One of my favorite stories is asking a cop for a ride home at 3am and level 7 and eating a microwave gas station burrito in the back while he chauffeured me home

So convenient.  Now, how do you see that situation playing out for Blib?

Edit: If you were Blib instead of lib, what would you have done differently or not at 3am?

I have no clue. Probably wouldn't have been in Lawrence, considering their history

[Trim]

There are no non-business encounters I've had w/cops in which I'd have been adequately comfortable if I'd been black.  That includes walking home (in which I was given a free ride, before uber even existed!).  Not sure about comfort levels when working with or above them.

One of my favorite stories is asking a cop for a ride home at 3am and level 7 and eating a microwave gas station burrito in the back while he chauffeured me home

So convenient.  Now, how do you see that situation playing out for Blib?

Edit: If you were Blib instead of lib, what would you have done differently or not at 3am?

I have no clue. Probably wouldn't have been in Lawrence, considering their history

Good call, but even if you'd inadvertently found yourself there and even at a 7, you'd have probably had enough left in the brain to avoid any interaction w/the cop, because self-preservation.

[Ptolemy]

I got pulled over for having a brake light out last year. I wasn't held, though. Just a written warning and I was on my way.

I was pulled over once for a taillight out and then found out my license was suspended (state eff up) and tags expired (my eff up) and I got a warning for the light and tags and a ticket for the license and the whole thing took like 10 minutes tops.

Being white rules

I was pulled over in 2001 (last time I was pulled over by a cop) for speeding - 71 in a 60 - and the cop discovered my license was suspended. So, he arrested me, cuffed me and took me to the county lockup. I was polite and cooperative all the way through.  Turned out the state DOR screwed up and suspended my license unlawfully. I paid $300 bail and was released within an hour. Two weeks later, the prosecutor refunded me the money and apologized to me in person. The cop was black and I'm white.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

The term "Pretexual" is belied by broken tail light. Its a stupid anecdotal comment that should be ignored.

[star seed 7]

I got pulled over for having a brake light out last year. I wasn't held, though. Just a written warning and I was on my way.

I was pulled over once for a taillight out and then found out my license was suspended (state eff up) and tags expired (my eff up) and I got a warning for the light and tags and a ticket for the license and the whole thing took like 10 minutes tops.

Being white rules

I was pulled over in 2001 (last time I was pulled over by a cop) for speeding - 71 in a 60 - and the cop discovered my license was suspended. So, he arrested me, cuffed me and took me to the county lockup. I was polite and cooperative all the way through.  Turned out the state DOR screwed up and suspended my license unlawfully. I paid $300 bail and was released within an hour. Two weeks later, the prosecutor refunded me the money and apologized to me in person. The cop was black and I'm white.

It's not nice to lie 'lemy

[Rage Against the McKee]

There are no non-business encounters I've had w/cops in which I'd have been adequately comfortable if I'd been black.  That includes walking home (in which I was given a free ride, before uber even existed!).  Not sure about comfort levels when working with or above them.

One of my favorite stories is asking a cop for a ride home at 3am and level 7 and eating a microwave gas station burrito in the back while he chauffeured me home

So convenient.  Now, how do you see that situation playing out for Blib?

Edit: If you were Blib instead of lib, what would you have done differently or not at 3am?

I have no clue. Probably wouldn't have been in Lawrence, considering their history

Good call, but even if you'd inadvertently found yourself there and even at a 7, you'd have probably had enough left in the brain to avoid any interaction w/the cop, because self-preservation.

I don't think interacting with the cops is a great idea if you are white, either. I know I try to avoid them if at all possible.

[sys]

Throw in the us vs. them mentality that has been instilled in police departments since the beginning of the drug war, improved technology for people to monitor the police with, and you get to where we are now.

if you account for the police/population ratio, i would be absolutely amazed if there isn't less police misconduct now than at any time in the past.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Also, direct quote from aforementioned Harvard professor.

Mr. Fryer emphasizes that the work is not the definitive analysis of police shootings, and that more data would be needed to understand the country as a whole.

Are you a Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)?

[Trim]

There are no non-business encounters I've had w/cops in which I'd have been adequately comfortable if I'd been black.  That includes walking home (in which I was given a free ride, before uber even existed!).  Not sure about comfort levels when working with or above them.

One of my favorite stories is asking a cop for a ride home at 3am and level 7 and eating a microwave gas station burrito in the back while he chauffeured me home

So convenient.  Now, how do you see that situation playing out for Blib?

Edit: If you were Blib instead of lib, what would you have done differently or not at 3am?

I have no clue. Probably wouldn't have been in Lawrence, considering their history

Good call, but even if you'd inadvertently found yourself there and even at a 7, you'd have probably had enough left in the brain to avoid any interaction w/the cop, because self-preservation.

I don't think interacting with the cops is a great idea if you are white, either. I know I try to avoid them if at all possible.

True.  As has been worked through in the other thread, it is probably best to avoid all cops even when not in missouri.  That said, being white def gives you a little wiggle room when an interaction happens against your wishes or when your 7-drunk, burrito-eat'n ass engages them despite knowing better.

[Ptolemy]

I got pulled over for having a brake light out last year. I wasn't held, though. Just a written warning and I was on my way.

I was pulled over once for a taillight out and then found out my license was suspended (state eff up) and tags expired (my eff up) and I got a warning for the light and tags and a ticket for the license and the whole thing took like 10 minutes tops.

Being white rules

I was pulled over in 2001 (last time I was pulled over by a cop) for speeding - 71 in a 60 - and the cop discovered my license was suspended. So, he arrested me, cuffed me and took me to the county lockup. I was polite and cooperative all the way through.  Turned out the state DOR screwed up and suspended my license unlawfully. I paid $300 bail and was released within an hour. Two weeks later, the prosecutor refunded me the money and apologized to me in person. The cop was black and I'm white.

It's not nice to lie 'lemy

Agree. I never lie.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

I've gotten a couple of legitimate speeding tickets and a couple of bullshit illegal turn tickets. I've never been let off with a warning. Probably because I'm white and they know I'm going to pay double the fine to keep it off my insurance. rough ridin' driving while white bullshit.

[Tobias]

So true!

[wetwillie]

It's really shocking to me that anyone refuses to acknowledge that black people are treated differently in this country. 

[Trim]

I suppose I can appreciate white people's apprehension of the police due to deep-rooted fear of cops giving whites tickets instead of warnings b/c they know the white people will pay double to keep their insurance premiums from going up.

[chum1]

I've gotten five warnings and three tickets, one of which I talked the prosecutor into dropping.

I've never had any issues when I've been outside of a car and the police can clearly see what a fine, upstanding citizen I am.

[420seriouscat69]

It's really shocking to me that anyone refuses to acknowledge that black people are treated differently in this country.

Minus the devastating story Trim shared with us about MIR getting a traffic ticket for a light being out (RIP MIR), have you had a black friend experience any of these extreme cases that have been going on in America? I have not. In fact, they've always been super respectful in certain situations and have been treated with respect. Trim's paranoia might reside from them (trim/Mir) being IRL trolls and treating ppl badly on the Internet and in real life. I'm sure he's a bit tense walking around the streets at a 7.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

All these anecdotal stories and sentiments doesn't make the Harvard professor's study any less legitimate. 

The blm movement is a farce, and it's proponents are hate filled delusional sociopaths.

[MakeItRain]

The talking point that black lives matter is only about racist white cops is the biggest strawman and/or false flag that currently exists. People that say this including Rudy Giuliani fit into two categories; uneducated or are a liar. I have mentioned on here more than once the movement is about broader contextual issues like our country's history of institutional racism and how that has lead to a devaluation of black lives by all groups including other black people. This devaluation of black lives lead to things like police officers giving black people less latitude, surgeons giving black people less pain meds, and yes black-on-black crime. FSD has mocked me before for pointing this out.

You literally only have to read the first paragraph of the black lives matter wiki page philosophy section to find this:

Black Lives Matter incorporates those traditionally on the margins of black freedom movements.[7] The organization's website, for instance, states that Black Lives Matter is "a unique contribution that goes beyond extrajudicial killings of black people by police and vigilantes" and, embracing intersectionality, that "Black Lives Matter affirms the lives of black queer and trans folks, disabled folks, black undocumented folks, folks with records, women and all black lives along the gender spectrum."[34]

Despite all of this I'm sure it's a matter of time before one of you brings up the old tired trope of, they just care about racist white cops.

First, a great many BLM advocates would not agree with you. They freely admit their primary focus is on police brutality, and take offense to the suggestion that they should have to focus on black-on-black crime.

Regardless, there's a difference between (1) putting a statement on a website or having a symposium just to cover you bases and (2) what you're actual marching / protesting / rioting for. I haven't seen many BLM protests and riots organized against black-on-black violence or any of the other stuff you set forth above. The flashpoint for BLM is cop-on-black violence. That is what they take to the streets for, so that's what they are associated with. When BLM organizes a march through south side Chicago protesting black-on-black violence and calling for more police involvement to quell the violence, let me know.

So deny it until you're blue in the face, but you're either being naïve or disingenuous. BLM activists want to focus on the cops. They view black-on-black crime as either being a statistical falsehood, or irrelevant to the discussion. But if they really thought black lives mattered, they'd want to focus on saving as many black lives as possible, which means asking for more police intervention - not throwing rocks at them or worse.

I've told you more than once that you need to stop viewing black people as a monolith. So do it all of the time and not just when its politically convenient.

[chum1]

This is the purported largest study:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/final-tally-police-shot-and-killed-984-people-in-2015/2016/01/05/3ec7a404-b3c5-11e5-a76a-0b5145e8679a_story.html

[MakeItRain]

I think wanting police to kill fewer people of a certain race is a worthy cause even if it isn't the leading cause of death for that race.

if a = xb + yb + etc and b = basal rate of homicide by cops, x =  multiplier for blacks, y = multiplier for whites and etc = the same for any other group you want to input, i don't really care if you are fixated on x, y, etc or b as long as you want to do something to reduce a.


and even with all that said, the fact that the murdered minnesota guy was stopped 52 or 62 or however many times it was in the recent past is a much bigger problem than the fact that he was shot on one of those occasions, as undramatic as that sounds.

Absolutely

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Monolith

[MakeItRain]

Is it really a thing that people believe BLM cannot protest police violence until they protest/solve black on black crime?

"protest/solve" was an interesting connection!

No, I don't think BLM should be required to "solve" BOB crime before protesting police violence, but it would a be good idea to make BOB crime a more prominent issue in their protests, and for their protests to not facilitate more BOB crime by vilifying police and encouraging them to withdraw from heavily minority areas. You know, if they actually want to save black lives. But maybe that's not the point of BLM.

Do you ever attempt to learn? When you read something you don't think is true do you cover your eyes and say "la la la la" really loud?