Author Topic: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV  (Read 5189 times)

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Offline kso_FAN

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Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« on: January 27, 2015, 10:00:12 PM »


oscar sometimes likes to throw around the term punked, and that would be appropriate for tonight's game. "Thrown around" would be pretty appropriate as well, considering the number of times K-State threw the ball away (or didn't throw it all). Huggins brought his tough-minded team into the Octagon of Doom (and it was pretty OODish tonight) and out fought the Wildcats for a crushing home loss.

Of course anytime you turn the ball over 1/3 of the time you have major problems and as a result tons of possessions were wasted. It was clear the gameplan was to be deliberate so as not to make mistakes that led directly to WVU points and the Cats actually outscored WVU on points off of turnovers 12-11. K-State also won fast break points 17-8. Still, the wasted possessions because K-State couldn't even get the ball in were mind numbing and despite the wretched offense, it would've been nice to see the Cats in the half court.

Then there are categories that the Cats seemingly won, namely oboarding and FT rate. But each of these comes with a disclaimer, because it wasn't so much what the K-State gained, but what they did with it. For example, the first half saw K-State win OR% 41-22% (9 oboards to 4), yet WVU outscored KSU on 2nd chance points 9 to 2. So everytime WVU got an oboard they converted and K-State managed to turn 9 offensive boards into 2 points. In the 2nd half WVU flipped it 42-27% (8 to 4), however K-State scored even with WVU 5-5 off of those oboards. Still, the net loss of 14-7 is a huge factor in a 6 point loss. The Cats had been solid on 2PT% lately, but were held to under 40% against WVU's length and K-State will not win games with that shooting, especially with no outside threat besides Marcus.

Finally the FT line and K-State not taking advantage of 2nd half opportunities. Despite a healthy FT rate differential for the half and the game, WVU still outscored the Cats by 1 point on FTs. With the way WVU fouls, FTs are an area you have to take advantage of against them and K-State failed miserably in that regard tonight.

Finally, the Cats had to have guys step up with the loss of Nino so early in the game. (and its idiotic to say losing Nino wasn't a huge factor considering how he had been playing) However, guys like Edwards and Hurt came out on the floor and completely caved against WVU's pressure. As a result the only way were going to win was a huge night from either Marcus or Gip and we got neither.

As a result the Cats suffered a devastating loss after barely bringing their season back onto life support from the dregs that were December. Even worse, up next is a trip to Lawrence with 5 of the next 7 on the road.


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Offline cDubya

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2015, 10:16:13 PM »
You're pretty good at this...  :thumbs:

Offline Mixed-Nutz

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2015, 10:21:06 PM »


oscar sometimes likes to throw around the term punked, and that would be appropriate for tonight's game. "Thrown around" would be pretty appropriate as well, considering the number of times K-State threw the ball away (or didn't throw it all). Huggins brought his tough-minded team into the Octagon of Doom (and it was pretty OODish tonight) and out fought the Wildcats for a crushing home loss.

Of course anytime you turn the ball over 1/3 of the time you have major problems and as a result tons of possessions were wasted. It was clear the gameplan was to be deliberate so as not to make mistakes that led directly to WVU points and the Cats actually outscored WVU on points off of turnovers 12-11. K-State also won fast break points 17-8. Still, the wasted possessions because K-State couldn't even get the ball in were mind numbing and despite the wretched offense, it would've been nice to see the Cats in the half court.

Then there are categories that the Cats seemingly won, namely oboarding and FT rate. But each of these comes with a disclaimer, because it wasn't so much what the K-State gained, but what they did with it. For example, the first half saw K-State win OR% 41-22% (9 oboards to 4), yet WVU outscored KSU on 2nd chance points 9 to 2. So everytime WVU got an oboard they converted and K-State managed to turn 9 offensive boards into 2 points. In the 2nd half WVU flipped it 42-27% (8 to 4), however K-State scored even with WVU 5-5 off of those oboards. Still, the net loss of 14-7 is a huge factor in a 6 point loss. The Cats had been solid on 2PT% lately, but were held to under 40% against WVU's length and K-State will not win games with that shooting, especially with no outside threat besides Marcus.

Finally the FT line and K-State not taking advantage of 2nd half opportunities. Despite a healthy FT rate differential for the half and the game, WVU still outscored the Cats by 1 point on FTs. With the way WVU fouls, FTs are an area you have to take advantage of against them and K-State failed miserably in that regard tonight.

Finally, the Cats had to have guys step up with the loss of Nino so early in the game. (and its idiotic to say losing Nino wasn't a huge factor considering how he had been playing) However, guys like Edwards and Hurt came out on the floor and completely caved against WVU's pressure. As a result the only way were going to win was a huge night from either Marcus or Gip and we got neither.

As a result the Cats suffered a devastating loss after barely bringing their season back onto life support from the dregs that were December. Even worse, up next is a trip to Lawrence with 5 of the next 7 on the road.

eFG% of 39.8 percent against WVU is pathetic. AT HOME. When team that spreads its pressure out to the extreme you have to get easy buckets. Need to hit free throws. If we had 20 turnovers I would of been ecstatic.

I hope nino is health, half court offense went to crap in the second half. He helps with motion but our ball handers were getting pushed too far away from the rim. Ball screen offense is terrible, our personnel doesn't fit it. Best way to handle pressure.

Nothing from Edwards also killed us. 
« Last Edit: January 27, 2015, 10:26:58 PM by Mixed-Nutz »

Offline Powercat Posse

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2015, 10:31:41 PM »
1. Of our first 30 shots (7-30 FG) we missed 10 lay ups and 2 tip in shots ....this according to the play by play.  12 shots inside 3-4 feet missed.....Really :Ugh:

2. We had about 8-9 TOs where we didn't have the ball for 1 second ( countless dumb lob passes up for grabs.. Plus 5 sec calls and Foster traveling on baseline inbound)

3. Everyone still hates on Jevon, but we got 2 FGs on 7 Att and 4 TOs from our 40 min of Gip/Hurt.

4. We allow .84 PPP at home and lose

----just 4 pathetic reasons on why we blew a chance to win.

Offline Mixed-Nutz

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2015, 10:40:33 PM »
plus 15 missed free throws.

Offline Powercat Posse

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2015, 10:44:33 PM »
plus 15 missed free throws.

More specifically 10-22 in the 2nd half.  We shoot 62.5 eFG% and get 22 FTAs in the 2nd half.... Yet still failed to get 1.00 on PPP (we were .93). 

Offline bones129

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2015, 10:47:18 PM »
I'll bet we didn't even win the try hards.   :bang:

Offline Powercat Posse

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2015, 11:08:23 PM »
I mean WV TOed the ball over 1/4 of their possessions, made just over 1/3 of their shots, lost the OR battle, and they were almost 20% lower on FTR  than we were....

And they won on our home court. :(

Offline michigancat

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2015, 11:08:28 PM »
Huggins teams like tonight's are a joy to watch. The way he gets teams to play as hard as they do is amazing.

Also, did we ever set a single screen on a backcourt out of bounds? My God, oscar. WV deserves a ton of credit, but sweet Christ try something different in the second half.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2015, 12:30:11 AM »
Huggins teams like tonight's are a joy to watch. The way he gets teams to play as hard as they do is amazing.

Also, did we ever set a single screen on a backcourt out of bounds? My God, oscar. WV deserves a ton of credit, but sweet Christ try something different in the second half.

No we didn't :curse:

Offline Steffy08

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2015, 06:46:25 AM »
I'll bet we didn't even win the try hards.   :bang:

We played extremely hard, just not well.
Losing Niño was a killer; hope it is not a Travis Green injury.

I think Nigel was way too tentative upon breaking the press.
Also, the lack of finishers at the rim was problematic.
As usual, Jevon and Weber are getting too much blame for this loss.

We lost a dogfight against a great team when we lost our best player (lately) to an injury.  It happens.  This league is a grind.

Offline Mr Bread

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2015, 07:14:34 AM »
a great team
My prescience is fully engorged.  It throbs with righteous accuracy.  I am sated.

Offline pissclams

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2015, 07:48:20 AM »
I'll bet we didn't even win the try hards.   :bang:

We played extremely hard, just not well.
Losing Niño was a killer; hope it is not a Travis Green injury.

I think Nigel was way too tentative upon breaking the press.
Also, the lack of finishers at the rim was problematic.
As usual, Jevon and Weber are getting too much blame for this loss.

We lost a dogfight against a great team when we lost our best player (lately) to an injury.  It happens.  This league is a grind.

you're a rough ridin' idiot


Cheesy Mustache QB might make an appearance.

New warning: Don't get in a fight with someone who doesn't even need to bother to buy ink.

Offline CHONGS

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2015, 08:56:32 AM »
I am pretty sure it's just Nino, no ñ.  Can we get an official ruling on this?

Offline Cire

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2015, 09:01:01 AM »
I missed playing the way huggs team does

Offline Steffy08

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2015, 09:02:03 AM »
I am pretty sure it's just Nino, no ñ.  Can we get an official ruling on this?

Yes, I have no idea why my phone does that.  (Used to do "Sams" as "SAMs," too.)

Offline puniraptor

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2015, 09:07:28 AM »
I am pretty sure it's just Nino, no ñ.  Can we get an official ruling on this?

Yes, I have no idea why my phone does that.  (Used to do "Sams" as "SAMs," too.)

because both those things are awesome

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2015, 09:17:10 AM »
Huggins teams like tonight's are a joy to watch. The way he gets teams to play as hard as they do is amazing.

Also, did we ever set a single screen on a backcourt out of bounds? My God, oscar. WV deserves a ton of credit, but sweet Christ try something different in the second half.

Yes we did.  It was in the second half. 

It was a bad sign when we immediately turned the ball over because of the technical and Marcus tried to run the baseline.  You can tell we had a game plan going in, but it was undermined from the first minute and

I knew the in-bounds would be an issue but it was terribly frustrating to watch:

1) We ate several 5 second calls with no timeout.  oscar needed to call one on the first close count to calm the team down and reiterate the game plan.  At least the second time you stop the panic.

2) We ran maybe 3 deep throws and WVU was very aggressively fronting our in bounders every time.  I know they are guarding the in-bounder, but you have so much space to throw it and you only have to connect a few times in a row to change the pressure.

3) We needed to punish them on the 2 and 3 on 1's.  Our spacing was awful, we were tentative with the ball (more than normal) and we did not attack the rim.  Wes and Marcus were the only ones to do it in transition, Jevon did ok in the half court.

4) We had way too many times when our guards were trapped two or three feet in to the court with no dribble and no help.

5) The Big Meat backcourt throw off the guys leg for a dunk made me actually LOL.  I mean it was a completely inexplicable meltdown.  Worse than even Nigel's meltdown in the backcourt.  That stretch he had by the way led to 6 points and should've given them the ball when he pushed a WVU player out of bounds before getting yanked.
It was a really poor performance.  We actually did not have

Offline michigancat

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2015, 09:45:48 AM »
Well, they weren't very good at setting screens then. I thought I saw a couple of screen attempts but they may have instead been part of our "have three guys run around like chickens with their head cut off" strategy we seemed to implement for most of the game.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2015, 09:47:56 AM »
Well, they weren't very good at setting screens then. I thought I saw a couple of screen attempts but they may have instead been part of our "have three guys run around like chickens with their head cut off" strategy we seemed to implement for most of the game.

Yes, it was pretty bad. They seemed to be particularly upset with Edwards cutting/screening when he was in the game. But no one was particularly good at it. I did like our sideline OB in the backcourt with 4 across cutting from the opposite sideline. It worked well, but our underneath OB to break pressure was pretty terrible.

Offline Dugout DickStone

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #20 on: January 28, 2015, 09:57:54 AM »
I'll bet we didn't even win the try hards.   :bang:

IF we didn't, oscar is going to throw someone under his bus

Offline Steffy08

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2015, 10:44:07 AM »
I think we messed up the press by sending too many guys to retrieve the end-bounds pass, which resulted in congestion.

Next time we play them, I would send all but Jevon towards our basket.  Jevon is so quick that nobody can prevent him from getting the in-bounds pass, assuming Jevon has the entire court to work with and our in-bounder does a good job of running the baseline.  If they bring two to double team, then you can race somebody back to help, and he will likely be open.

It was a cluster down there last night.  I'm sure Weber will make this adjustment next time.

One other point:  Our two point guards are sophomores, and our 2 and our 3 are sophomores.  Last night reminded me of the Iowa State game.  Our young guards just got a little tentative in reacting to a high-stress environment.  We will win these games next year when our perimeters guys are a little older, tougher, and more mature.

Offline #LIFE

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2015, 10:48:56 AM »


One other point:  Our two point guards are sophomores, and our 2 and our 3 are sophomores.  Last night reminded me of the Iowa State game.  Our young guards just got a little tentative in reacting to a high-stress environment.  We will win these games next year when our perimeters guys are a little older, tougher, and more mature.

We will win these games when these 2 are booted off the team and replaced with someone who doesn't rough ridin' suck

Offline michigancat

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #23 on: January 28, 2015, 10:50:05 AM »
rough ridin' everyone in college basketball is young, they're in college

Offline EMAWmeister

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Re: Bloodied, Battered, and Bruced; WVU ADV
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2015, 10:50:45 AM »
I'm just sitting here laughing trying to think what would have happened if Frank said "Do not try to throw some rough ridin' hail marry inbounds pass" and our players did it 5 times. The rage would have been incredible.

Also, Frank's players would not have thrown that pass because he specifically told them not to.