not just missouri, best to avoid all cops

[8manpick]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Lol. Only if the cop is too busy pummeling to grab his gun.

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

You made up a scenario where the hospital staff turned on their security guards and wrote a letter condemning them, and used that as evidence that the guards did nothing wrong.

LOL what?  That letter was from mental health professionals decrying the use of force with an non sequitur argument about techniques.  I was wrong that it was't directly (we think) from the pen of those staff members, but the point is still 100% valid.  I made up no facts about the actual scenario or conduct of the police or mental health patient.  Try again.

[Rage Against the McKee]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

You made up a scenario where the hospital staff turned on their security guards and wrote a letter condemning them, and used that as evidence that the guards did nothing wrong.

LOL what?  That letter was from mental health professionals decrying the use of force with an non sequitur argument about techniques.  I was wrong that it was't directly (we think) from the pen of those staff members, but the point is still 100% valid.  I made up no facts about the actual scenario or conduct of the police or mental health patient.  Try again.

So you support hospital staff shooting at their mental health patients when they get a little out of hand, then? And of course the letter wasn't written by staff at that hospital. No hospital would allow their staff to open them up to a lawsuit like that.

[Mrs. Gooch]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

Most likely the cop's glasses got knocked off when the guy flailed his arms to protect his head from getting repeatedly punched. The witness stated that the cop charged him from far away so the guy didn't have an opportunity to knock the glasses off before he got pummeled.

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

You made up a scenario where the hospital staff turned on their security guards and wrote a letter condemning them, and used that as evidence that the guards did nothing wrong.

LOL what?  That letter was from mental health professionals decrying the use of force with an non sequitur argument about techniques.  I was wrong that it was't directly (we think) from the pen of those staff members, but the point is still 100% valid.  I made up no facts about the actual scenario or conduct of the police or mental health patient.  Try again.

So you support hospital staff shooting at their mental health patients when they get a little out of hand, then? And of course the letter wasn't written by staff at that hospital. No hospital would allow their staff to open them up to a lawsuit like that.

Are you for rough ridin' real?  Do you think the guards were doing random bed checks and were just cursing by when the patient didn't take his meds because he didn't get ice cream and start blasting?

The situation was already out of hand when the guards were called.  They went through 3 levels of force elevations before using lethal force because crap was so out of hand.  JFC these are the facts that are critical in these cases that you people are choosing to ignore to fit your narrative.  I'm not asking for a lot out of you people, just an honest evaluation of the facts and you can't even come up with an intellectual defense of your narrative, and that is why you malign me with your bullshit attacks (looking at you too Puni).  Just stop for a second and take off the anti-cop glasses and think about how normal people would react.

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

Most likely the cop's glasses got knocked off when the guy flailed his arms to protect his head from getting repeatedly punched. The witness stated that the cop charged him from far away so the guy didn't have an opportunity to knock the glasses off before he got pummeled.

More examples of people making up facts to fit a narrative. 

My points fit within the police account and the witness account without making room for "most likely"s.

[Mrs. Gooch]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

Most likely the cop's glasses got knocked off when the guy flailed his arms to protect his head from getting repeatedly punched. The witness stated that the cop charged him from far away so the guy didn't have an opportunity to knock the glasses off before he got pummeled.

More examples of people making up facts to fit a narrative. 

My points fit within the police account and the witness account without making room for "most likely"s.

If the witness says the cop rushed him before they were within contact distance, when do you think the guy knocked the cop's glasses off which led to the cop pummeling him?

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

Most likely the cop's glasses got knocked off when the guy flailed his arms to protect his head from getting repeatedly punched. The witness stated that the cop charged him from far away so the guy didn't have an opportunity to knock the glasses off before he got pummeled.

More examples of people making up facts to fit a narrative. 

My points fit within the police account and the witness account without making room for "most likely"s.

If the witness says the cop rushed him before they were within contact distance, when do you think the guy knocked the cop's glasses off which led to the cop pummeling him?

Because there was a violent interaction between them?  You don't get to physical resist a legal arrest.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Are you for rough ridin' real?  Do you think the guards were doing random bed checks and were just cursing by when the patient didn't take his meds because he didn't get ice cream and start blasting?

The situation was already out of hand when the guards were called.  They went through 3 levels of force elevations before using lethal force because crap was so out of hand.  JFC these are the facts that are critical in these cases that you people are choosing to ignore to fit your narrative.  I'm not asking for a lot out of you people, just an honest evaluation of the facts and you can't even come up with an intellectual defense of your narrative, and that is why you malign me with your bullshit attacks (looking at you too Puni).  Just stop for a second and take off the anti-cop glasses and think about how normal people would react.

The facts are that a man admitted himself to the hospital because he wasn't mentally sound. The hospital knew his medical history and failed to properly subdue him, and then they shot him in the chest. Everything else you stated is not supported by anything factual. It's made up bullshit to support your argument. Why do hospital security guards even carry weapons? Why does the hospital not have a proper procedure to deal with mental health patients? The signed petition states that most hospitals do.

I think that story just outlines that police are so used to being able to shoot first and ask questions later that they absolutely should not be working any type of security job when they are off duty. Hospitals should look to mall security for their labor force.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Because there was a violent interaction between them?  You don't get to physical resist a legal arrest.

You shouldn't get to use force on a legal arrest until there has already been resistance.

[ednksu]

Are you for rough ridin' real?  Do you think the guards were doing random bed checks and were just cursing by when the patient didn't take his meds because he didn't get ice cream and start blasting?

The situation was already out of hand when the guards were called.  They went through 3 levels of force elevations before using lethal force because crap was so out of hand.  JFC these are the facts that are critical in these cases that you people are choosing to ignore to fit your narrative.  I'm not asking for a lot out of you people, just an honest evaluation of the facts and you can't even come up with an intellectual defense of your narrative, and that is why you malign me with your bullshit attacks (looking at you too Puni).  Just stop for a second and take off the anti-cop glasses and think about how normal people would react.

The facts are that a man admitted himself to the hospital because he wasn't mentally sound. The hospital knew his medical history and failed to properly subdue him, and then they shot him in the chest. Everything else you stated is not supported by anything factual. It's made up bullshit to support your argument. Why do hospital security guards even carry weapons? Why does the hospital not have a proper procedure to deal with mental health patients? The signed petition states that most hospitals do.

I think that story just outlines that police are so used to being able to shoot first and ask questions later that they absolutely should not be working any type of security job when they are off duty. Hospitals should look to mall security for their labor force.

LOL I mean this is just comical how you are bending the story to fit your needs.

The hospital medical staff totally failed to managed the situation.  The situation got out of hand and they required physical force to attempt to regain control of the situation.  As the situation escalated it became more violent because of the patient's actions.  You can choose to ignore that all you want, it doesn't make it less true. Once the security staff is there, it's not the scenario you want it to be.  And lots of security staff have weapons, lots of place hire off duty cops because its easier with liability issues to employ them.  Those are facts that are widely known, but are only a reasonable supposition here. Now back to you making up "facts" again: we have no idea what the hospital's policies are, or where they broke down from that article.  We have some info about the family attempting to warn the staff, but we don't know where that went or how it was sent to staff.  It's sad the family wasn't there to get the patient involuntarily committed. 

Also you show your bias once again when you ignore the fact they went through 3 levels of force elevation, a series of facts that you do not dispute, and continue to ignore because you know that alone destroys your entire position. 

[ednksu]

Because there was a violent interaction between them?  You don't get to physical resist a legal arrest.

You shouldn't get to use force on a legal arrest until there has already been resistance.

Once again you're making stuff up to fit your narrative.  We don't have reliable information on what occurred (assuming you don't believe the police's account).  Once again, just try and stick to some of the facts instead of going totally off reservation. 

[CNS]

The whole idea of cops not having body cameras by now is ridic.  I mean, this issue has been red hot for over a year now, so even if this was a budget issue during the middle of last year, enough time has gone by to be in a new budget. 

Get the body cams and make wearing them required.  those who don't, fired.

[ednksu]

The whole idea of cops not having body cameras by now is ridic.  I mean, this issue has been red hot for over a year now, so even if this was a budget issue during the middle of last year, enough time has gone by to be in a new budget. 

Get the body cams and make wearing them required.  those who don't, fired.

Also note my position in the past that any tampering with them is a crime, especially when interacting with the public.  I'd probably be pro felony if a cop turns it off and there is an issue of misconduct.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Because there was a violent interaction between them?  You don't get to physical resist a legal arrest.

You shouldn't get to use force on a legal arrest until there has already been resistance.

Once again you're making stuff up to fit your narrative.  We don't have reliable information on what occurred (assuming you don't believe the police's account).  Once again, just try and stick to some of the facts instead of going totally off reservation.

I am going off of the witness testimony. You are going off of a scenario that played through your head.

LOL I mean this is just comical how you are bending the story to fit your needs.

The hospital medical staff totally failed to managed the situation.  The situation got out of hand and they required physical force to attempt to regain control of the situation.  As the situation escalated it became more violent because of the patient's actions.  You can choose to ignore that all you want, it doesn't make it less true. Once the security staff is there, it's not the scenario you want it to be.  And lots of security staff have weapons, lots of place hire off duty cops because its easier with liability issues to employ them.  Those are facts that are widely known, but are only a reasonable supposition here. Now back to you making up "facts" again: we have no idea what the hospital's policies are, or where they broke down from that article.  We have some info about the family attempting to warn the staff, but we don't know where that went or how it was sent to staff.  It's sad the family wasn't there to get the patient involuntarily committed. 

Also you show your bias once again when you ignore the fact they went through 3 levels of force elevation, a series of facts that you do not dispute, and continue to ignore because you know that alone destroys your entire position. 

Going through the 3 levels of force elevation is part of the hospital failing to properly subdue their patient. If you work in a hospital around mentally ill people, you should expect to take a punch or a kick to the face at some point. That is just part of the job. The man isn't mentally sound, and he doesn't deserve to die because you were bad enough at your job to let that happen. You shouldn't taze or shoot him. There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him.

[ednksu]

Now you're at the point of lying through your teeth to make your point.  The staff felt the situation was out of control and called the security staff.  The medical staff doesn't have that kind of force protocol like you want them to have.  I'm sure the staff attempted to control the patient before calling security, because the article says so.  The security guards attempted to control him and it was elevated, which you kinda acknowledge now but still totally fail to recognize the implications of force protocols. It's clear you don't understand physiologically what is happening when a taser is totally ineffective if you think "There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him." I mean your posting has reached a level of naivety that is borderline delusional. 

I would encourage you to stop and look at the facts, go back and re-read stuff.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Now you're at the point of lying through your teeth to make your point.  The staff felt the situation was out of control and called the security staff.  The medical staff doesn't have that kind of force protocol like you want them to have.  I'm sure the staff attempted to control the patient before calling security, because the article says so.  The security guards attempted to control him and it was elevated, which you kinda acknowledge now but still totally fail to recognize the implications of force protocols. It's clear you don't understand physiologically what is happening when a taser is totally ineffective if you think "There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him." I mean your posting has reached a level of naivety that is borderline delusional. 

I would encourage you to stop and look at the facts, go back and re-read stuff.

I would encourage you to look at the statement from medical professionals condemning this hospital, and come up with a reason why deadly force is the answer to an unarmed patient having a mental breakdown.

[ednksu]

Now you're at the point of lying through your teeth to make your point.  The staff felt the situation was out of control and called the security staff.  The medical staff doesn't have that kind of force protocol like you want them to have.  I'm sure the staff attempted to control the patient before calling security, because the article says so.  The security guards attempted to control him and it was elevated, which you kinda acknowledge now but still totally fail to recognize the implications of force protocols. It's clear you don't understand physiologically what is happening when a taser is totally ineffective if you think "There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him." I mean your posting has reached a level of naivety that is borderline delusional. 

I would encourage you to stop and look at the facts, go back and re-read stuff.

I would encourage you to look at the statement from medical professionals condemning this hospital, and come up with a reason why deadly force is the answer to an unarmed patient having a mental breakdown.

And I would encourage you to look at how non sequitur it is since these "same" medical professionals totally failed at living up to their "own" charge in the letter.  If the medical staff has these great techniques, why weren't they deployed properly?  If these techniques prevent the used of escalating force why did they fail?  Or their techniques aren't as good as they hope they are and mental health professionals regularly rely on the police or security to help them.  Sometimes those situations go to a place where someone ends up shot because it's just a bad mumped up situation.  The reality is you don't know anyone who works in mental health, you have obviously never dealt with people with mental health issues, because you'd realize that sometimes on rare occasions, as much as things are done to prevent it, people get hurt or die because of circumstances outside of everyone's control. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

Now you're at the point of lying through your teeth to make your point.  The staff felt the situation was out of control and called the security staff.  The medical staff doesn't have that kind of force protocol like you want them to have.  I'm sure the staff attempted to control the patient before calling security, because the article says so.  The security guards attempted to control him and it was elevated, which you kinda acknowledge now but still totally fail to recognize the implications of force protocols. It's clear you don't understand physiologically what is happening when a taser is totally ineffective if you think "There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him." I mean your posting has reached a level of naivety that is borderline delusional. 

I would encourage you to stop and look at the facts, go back and re-read stuff.

I would encourage you to look at the statement from medical professionals condemning this hospital, and come up with a reason why deadly force is the answer to an unarmed patient having a mental breakdown.

And I would encourage you to look at how non sequitur it is since these "same" medical professionals totally failed at living up to their "own" charge in the letter.  If the medical staff has these great techniques, why weren't they deployed properly?  If these techniques prevent the used of escalating force why did they fail?  Or their techniques aren't as good as they hope they are and mental health professionals regularly rely on the police or security to help them.  Sometimes those situations go to a place where someone ends up shot because it's just a bad mumped up situation.  The reality is you don't know anyone who works in mental health, you have obviously never dealt with people with mental health issues, because you'd realize that sometimes on rare occasions, as much as things are done to prevent it, people get hurt or die because of circumstances outside of everyone's control.

They aren't the same professionals. This hospital is clearly incompetent. The family is suing and will probably be awarded millions of dollars. Hopefully the hospital stops employing cops and gets better. Police would probably get better, too, if there were ever held accountable for anything.

[ednksu]

Now you're at the point of lying through your teeth to make your point.  The staff felt the situation was out of control and called the security staff.  The medical staff doesn't have that kind of force protocol like you want them to have.  I'm sure the staff attempted to control the patient before calling security, because the article says so.  The security guards attempted to control him and it was elevated, which you kinda acknowledge now but still totally fail to recognize the implications of force protocols. It's clear you don't understand physiologically what is happening when a taser is totally ineffective if you think "There were plenty of people in that room to hold him down and restrain him." I mean your posting has reached a level of naivety that is borderline delusional. 

I would encourage you to stop and look at the facts, go back and re-read stuff.

I would encourage you to look at the statement from medical professionals condemning this hospital, and come up with a reason why deadly force is the answer to an unarmed patient having a mental breakdown.

And I would encourage you to look at how non sequitur it is since these "same" medical professionals totally failed at living up to their "own" charge in the letter.  If the medical staff has these great techniques, why weren't they deployed properly?  If these techniques prevent the used of escalating force why did they fail?  Or their techniques aren't as good as they hope they are and mental health professionals regularly rely on the police or security to help them.  Sometimes those situations go to a place where someone ends up shot because it's just a bad mumped up situation.  The reality is you don't know anyone who works in mental health, you have obviously never dealt with people with mental health issues, because you'd realize that sometimes on rare occasions, as much as things are done to prevent it, people get hurt or die because of circumstances outside of everyone's control.

They aren't the same professionals. This hospital is clearly incompetent. The family is suing and will probably be awarded millions of dollars. Hopefully the hospital stops employing cops and gets better. Police would probably get better, too, if there were ever held accountable for anything.

I would say the are incompetent because the warnings from family were not passed along properly and they failed to have adequate medical staff there.  The idea of discharging him is obscene. 

I would like to see people here realize that once a situation gets out of control it is possible to reach a point of no return of sorts.  Yes we'd all like to have every situation end without people getting seriously hurt, but sometimes the circumstances are beyond reasonable reproach. And that is why you need to be prepared before hand to limit those circumstances and also act quickly if you are given info about circumstances, example the family saying there is mental health issue to be aware of.   

[Rage Against the McKee]

The man admitted himself for a mental health issue. It's not simply a matter of the family's message not getting passed along. Hospitals should have trained staff to deal with these patients, or they should direct them to a different hospital that does. They should not use police officers who are going to treat them as if they are arresting a criminal.

[MakeItRain]

You wanna let me take a couple punches to your face in a head lock and see how you look?  Pro tip, if you put your hands on the officer in a violent physical action, there will be measure taken to ensure their safety, including physical force.  This scenario is yet another reason why we need body cams to sort out a mess instead of leaving us with this he said crap where a bunch of try hard bitches complain about police brutality assuming the cop is 100% in the wrong 100% of the time.

“I saw the guy get out of the car, walk toward the officer a little bit and stopped,” the witness said. “There was a little distance between them, and I saw the officer rush him.”

The police report shows Barger raised his hands after the officer pointed his gun at him, but Barger and the witness both said the officer charged toward him and placed him in a headlock.

“By the time he threw me on the ground and hit me a couple times with his elbow, at that point, I was like, ‘This isn’t a police officer — this is just some guy here to kill me,’” Barger said.

The witness said Barger screamed for help as the officer repeatedly punched him.

“They were on the ground for a good two or three minutes, and the guy was screaming, ‘Somebody help me, somebody help me, I don’t know why you’re doing this,’” the witness said.

 
what are we missing edn?

edn answers every post within seconds, but this one he's like

[SdK]

I can't tell if edn is a giant wuss ass or has an inferiority complex or he likes the taste of leather. All three?

[ednksu]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

Don't let facts get in the way of your bullshit MiR. 

[ednksu]

I can't tell if edn is a giant wuss ass or has an inferiority complex or he likes the taste of leather. All three?

so damn edgy


it's great being the most neutral, no bias, poster in the Pit.  really a fun time seeing how agenda drives people to ignore facts/logic/blatant issues with their own agenda. /sorry this isn't dunning it's questioning your beliefs