not just missouri, best to avoid all cops

[Rage Against the McKee]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

[MeatSauce]

You wanna let me take a couple punches to your face in a head lock and see how you look?  Pro tip, if you put your hands on the officer in a violent physical action, there will be measure taken to ensure their safety, including physical force.  This scenario is yet another reason why we need body cams to sort out a mess instead of leaving us with this he said crap where a bunch of try hard bitches complain about police brutality assuming the cop is 100% in the wrong 100% of the time.

“I saw the guy get out of the car, walk toward the officer a little bit and stopped,” the witness said. “There was a little distance between them, and I saw the officer rush him.”

The police report shows Barger raised his hands after the officer pointed his gun at him, but Barger and the witness both said the officer charged toward him and placed him in a headlock.

“By the time he threw me on the ground and hit me a couple times with his elbow, at that point, I was like, ‘This isn’t a police officer — this is just some guy here to kill me,’” Barger said.

The witness said Barger screamed for help as the officer repeatedly punched him.

“They were on the ground for a good two or three minutes, and the guy was screaming, ‘Somebody help me, somebody help me, I don’t know why you’re doing this,’” the witness said.

 
what are we missing edn?

[ednksu]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

[ednksu]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

You don't think pushing someone while they try to arrest you is an escalation?  /reality

[Rage Against the McKee]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

You don't think pushing someone while they try to arrest you is an escalation?  /reality

No, I really don't, and even if I did, the witness testimony and police report say the victim had his hands up. I do wish there were body cam footage so you could take us frame by frame on why this guy deserved to have his ass kicked, though.

[CNS]

What level of cop brutality is acceptable, without undue cause, before a citizen can fight back?  This doesn't necessarily fit this specific instance, but honest question. I mean, if I haven't done anything and a cop starts to pummel me for seemingly no reason, there should be a line were, when crossed, I can defend myself.  Right?

The goal for all arrests should be minimal required physical force. 

The cops who don't want body cams are the cops that enjoy punching a few faces, for no real reason, every now and again.  These ppl shouldn't be cops.  The talking point about it being such a minority of the police force doesn't explain why this is in the news all but daily and basically all across the country.   The unwillingness by ppl to admit that there is a problem is a big deal. 

[ednksu]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

You don't think pushing someone while they try to arrest you is an escalation?  /reality

No, I really don't, and even if I did, the witness testimony and police report say the victim had his hands up. I do wish there were body cam footage so you could take us frame by frame on why this guy deserved to have his ass kicked, though.

I don't see how the witness adds to or refutes one story.  It works in both cases. 
And its funny the person being the most neutral here is being attacked the most. A bunch of try hards in here working their ass off to make a cop look bad when I'm saying the story could look differently with more info.  That info is critical to determine real truth and not try hard narratives.

[Dugout DickStone]

Is try hard a new go to insult?

[Rage Against the McKee]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

You don't think pushing someone while they try to arrest you is an escalation?  /reality

No, I really don't, and even if I did, the witness testimony and police report say the victim had his hands up. I do wish there were body cam footage so you could take us frame by frame on why this guy deserved to have his ass kicked, though.

I don't see how the witness adds to or refutes one story.  It works in both cases. 
And its funny the person being the most neutral here is being attacked the most. A bunch of try hards in here working their ass off to make a cop look bad when I'm saying the story could look differently with more info.  That info is critical to determine real truth and not try hard narratives.

You have to work with the info that you have. You can't just ignore the witness testimony and the guy's bashed in face when it's the best evidence you have. If this guy was not a cop, he'd be in jail with the same evidence.

[ednksu]

What level of cop brutality is acceptable, without undue cause, before a citizen can fight back?  This doesn't necessarily fit this specific instance, but honest question. I mean, if I haven't done anything and a cop starts to pummel me for seemingly no reason, there should be a line were, when crossed, I can defend myself.  Right?

The goal for all arrests should be minimal required physical force. 

The cops who don't want body cams are the cops that enjoy punching a few faces, for no real reason, every now and again.  These ppl shouldn't be cops.  The talking point about it being such a minority of the police force doesn't explain why this is in the news all but daily and basically all across the country.   The unwillingness by ppl to admit that there is a problem is a big deal.

I agree with a lot of this post, even though I know you're coming from another anti cop direction. 
And yes you can legally resist an illegal arrest.  But that isn't what was happening here. If we have a legal arrest with undo use of force the place to remedy that is in the courts and through civil actions.

And the media is all over this because it's getting headlines.  The scary thing is to think about all the people who have been killed in illegitimate police actions when you have bullshit narratives constructed around instances like Mike Brown where the cop was eventually exonerated by all investigations.  We should be talking about Tamir Rice. 

[ednksu]

Never been in a fight?  I mean just normal everyday response tells you that is a rough ridin' absurd.  If someone goes at your face you act with force to end the threat.

I'd like to see a photo of the officer. The police are saying he got his glasses knocked off, but they probably just fell off when he was kicking the crap out of this guy for stepping out of his vehicle.

See this post is the perfect example of a total failure to understand how to live in civil society.  Reciprocal damage to the cop isn't necessary for a cop to have a justified use of force.  It has to be reasonable and a proportional response to end the threat.  That much damage could easily be done with 3 punches to the face.  That could be done in the blink of an eye in a violent encounter with anyone. This type of attitude on display from you people also demands a cop be shot before they can return fire.  It's just absurd to live in your reality.

End what threat?

You don't think pushing someone while they try to arrest you is an escalation?  /reality

No, I really don't, and even if I did, the witness testimony and police report say the victim had his hands up. I do wish there were body cam footage so you could take us frame by frame on why this guy deserved to have his ass kicked, though.

I don't see how the witness adds to or refutes one story.  It works in both cases. 
And its funny the person being the most neutral here is being attacked the most. A bunch of try hards in here working their ass off to make a cop look bad when I'm saying the story could look differently with more info.  That info is critical to determine real truth and not try hard narratives.

You have to work with the info that you have. You can't just ignore the witness testimony and the guy's bashed in face when it's the best evidence you have. If this guy was not a cop, he'd be in jail with the same evidence.

The witness testimony can work in the cop's story too (or at least from the snip it given.)  The guys face isn't that bad in all reality, sorry thats the truth.  I've seen people jumped and sucker punched with much more damaged without a cop getting them in a headlock.  The reality is that damage could be done with 3 strikes to the face.

And no he wouldn't be in jail because the cop was effecting a legal arrest.  You can't strip away the facts you don't like for supposition.

[ednksu]

Is try hard a new go to insult?

just pointing out the obvious.  when people go through mental gymnastics to make a point instead of looking at facts without bias.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Is try hard a new go to insult?

just pointing out the obvious.  when people go through mental gymnastics to make a point instead of looking at facts without bias.

You are talking about yourself, right?

[star seed 7]

Is try hard a new go to insult?

just pointing out the obvious.  when people go through mental gymnastics to make a point instead of looking at facts without bias.

I always look at facts with 'bias present

[Mrs. Gooch]

What level of cop brutality is acceptable, without undue cause, before a citizen can fight back?  This doesn't necessarily fit this specific instance, but honest question. I mean, if I haven't done anything and a cop starts to pummel me for seemingly no reason, there should be a line were, when crossed, I can defend myself.  Right?

The goal for all arrests should be minimal required physical force. 

The cops who don't want body cams are the cops that enjoy punching a few faces, for no real reason, every now and again.  These ppl shouldn't be cops.  The talking point about it being such a minority of the police force doesn't explain why this is in the news all but daily and basically all across the country.   The unwillingness by ppl to admit that there is a problem is a big deal.

This.

If someone is pummeling you for no reason you should be able to defend yourself no matter who the person is.

[Rage Against the McKee]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

[Tobias]

I always look at facts with 'bias present

the statistics reflect this

[CNS]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

[Rage Against the McKee]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

What level of cop brutality is acceptable, without undue cause, before a citizen can fight back?  This doesn't necessarily fit this specific instance, but honest question. I mean, if I haven't done anything and a cop starts to pummel me for seemingly no reason, there should be a line were, when crossed, I can defend myself.  Right?

The goal for all arrests should be minimal required physical force. 

The cops who don't want body cams are the cops that enjoy punching a few faces, for no real reason, every now and again.  These ppl shouldn't be cops.  The talking point about it being such a minority of the police force doesn't explain why this is in the news all but daily and basically all across the country.   The unwillingness by ppl to admit that there is a problem is a big deal.

This.

If someone is pummeling you for no reason you should be able to defend yourself no matter who the person is.

example of gymnastics
*no reason* 

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

[ednksu]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

You should be able to. Unfortunately, if you are being pummeled by a cop, you are probably going to get charged with assault.

Yep, just take your ass whipping and stfu, I guess.  I mean, there are cases of ppl doing this who lost a pregnancy thanks to dumbass cops.  I would imagine there are quite a few cases of ppl not resisting to their great detriment. 

It is all so mumped up.  Especially when we could resolve a bunch of this with training, better hiring practices, and especially, getting rid of the dumbasses who are problems, rather than just passing them on to the next cop shop.  Other than a very few cases, all that ever happens is someone in the dept saying they are investigating alleged abuse of force, yada, yada, then nothing. 

Cops don't bear the full responsibility of what is going on right now, but they certainly have a large share of it.

As long as people like edn exist, who are willing to overlook all evidence and fabricate facts to support the officer in all but the most extreme cases, nothing will ever change.

Yeah as the one person here who consistently questions all the evidence instead of making up bullshit to fit a narrative, clearly I'm the issue. 

Yes, you question the evidence and then make up things that didn't happen to support the officer, like how you claimed the officer was shoved in this most recent post, and how you justified the 2 hospital security guards shooting the mentally disturbed patient in the chest.

I guess his classes just flew off his face /more reasonable than a suspect in an arrest knocking them off //facts that don't fit the narrative are useless

And the other thread is yet another example of try hards making up crap to fit the narrative instead of looking at the facts.  Show me one thing I made up.  I'll wait.

You made up a scenario where the hospital staff turned on their security guards and wrote a letter condemning them, and used that as evidence that the guards did nothing wrong.