Author Topic: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On  (Read 54356 times)

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Offline DQ12

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #300 on: November 22, 2017, 09:11:08 AM »
By the way. You cord cutters are the ones driving this.

Explain to me your reasoning here.
he's upset that cord cutters aren't subsidizing his internet by paying for cable


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Offline IPA4Me

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #301 on: November 22, 2017, 09:22:56 AM »
Providers are losing revenue. Now, they recapture that revenue with "internet" bundles. In the long run, we all lose. Providers will get back their lost revenue and more.

Offline Gooch

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #302 on: November 22, 2017, 09:40:15 AM »
Providers are losing revenue. Now, they recapture that revenue with "internet" bundles. In the long run, we all lose. Providers will get back their lost revenue and more.
Correct

Offline sonofdaxjones

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #303 on: November 22, 2017, 09:49:20 AM »
Local governments with their hand in the cookie jar all over the place. 

Franchise fees, right away fees, pole attachment fees, IRU’s. 

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #304 on: November 22, 2017, 10:01:07 AM »
The internet is a failed experiment, it's time to move on.
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #305 on: November 22, 2017, 10:05:44 AM »
The paid VPN services industry is going to explode because of this.  I will never paid for “internet bundles” as a part of my internet.  That’s absolute bullshit and I will not do it.  Nobody “owns” the internet.

Offline DQ12

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #306 on: November 22, 2017, 10:44:14 AM »
is there not a way to keep "net neutrality" AND reduce the cost of entry for small time ISPs?  i know very little about the actual underlying policy here.


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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #307 on: November 22, 2017, 11:11:23 AM »
I thought net neutrality was a check on ISPs and how they provide content. I don’t see why it would affect new ISP entrants. It affects how content is provided to consumers.

Trump is worried about AT&T buying Time Warner, but if net neutrality goes away, the potential impact to consumers is WAAAAY worse.

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #308 on: November 22, 2017, 11:25:04 AM »
I thought net neutrality was a check on ISPs and how they provide content. I don’t see why it would affect new ISP entrants. It affects how content is provided to consumers.

Trump is worried about AT&T buying Time Warner, but if net neutrality goes away, the potential impact to consumers is WAAAAY worse.
a lot of the supporting arguments i've read is that the current regulations make it next to impossible for new ISPs to enter the market.


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Offline 8manpick

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #309 on: November 22, 2017, 11:26:32 AM »
Enforcing Antitrust laws seems like a good way to make it easier for new/small ISPs, but I don't really know
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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #310 on: November 22, 2017, 11:28:14 AM »
I haven’t read much on it, but if so I guess that would be because you cannot have a provider who just offers Netflix for example. Still, I would think the infrastructure is what really keeps out new ISPs.

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #311 on: November 22, 2017, 11:48:22 AM »
The impact on new ISPs was given exactly zero consideration in this decision.

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #312 on: November 22, 2017, 11:51:00 AM »
The impact on new ISPs was given exactly zero consideration in this decision.
Quote
By exploring ways to reduce needless red tape, the Commission hopes that these proposals will spur broadband deployment throughout the country, bringing better, faster Internet service to more Americans and boosting competition and choice in the broadband marketplace.
https://www.fcc.gov/restoring-internet-freedom
 :dunno:


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Offline cfbandyman

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #313 on: November 22, 2017, 12:13:11 PM »
Providers are losing revenue. Now, they recapture that revenue with "internet" bundles. In the long run, we all lose. Providers will get back their lost revenue and more.

Fleece the people even more, not like they already don't everything else.

I hate everything about it.
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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #314 on: November 22, 2017, 12:18:10 PM »
Cost is just a minor concern for net neutrality proponents. The bigger concern is ISPs being able to either throttle or completely remove content that customers have access to. You think people live in bubbles now? Just wait until they’re subscribing to TrumpNet.

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #315 on: November 22, 2017, 12:23:03 PM »
The impact on new ISPs was given exactly zero consideration in this decision.
Quote
By exploring ways to reduce needless red tape, the Commission hopes that these proposals will spur broadband deployment throughout the country, bringing better, faster Internet service to more Americans and boosting competition and choice in the broadband marketplace.
https://www.fcc.gov/restoring-internet-freedom
 :dunno:

 Yep, that's what they say!

The Big Train

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #316 on: November 22, 2017, 12:29:42 PM »
Cost is just a minor concern for net neutrality proponents. The bigger concern is ISPs being able to either throttle or completely remove content that customers have access to. You think people live in bubbles now? Just wait until they’re subscribing to TrumpNet.

This.

I’m not really concerned with people being in their own bubbles, we have that now.  The censoring of content is what countries like China and North Korea do.  Granted that’s at government level but censoring for capital gain would eliminate any new internet company entrants.  It would create monopolies like we haven’t seen since Microsoft.

Offline cfbandyman

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #317 on: November 22, 2017, 12:30:20 PM »
Cost is just a minor concern for net neutrality proponents. The bigger concern is ISPs being able to either throttle or completely remove content that customers have access to. You think people live in bubbles now? Just wait until they’re subscribing to TrumpNet.

Costs will be though a more upfront and writ large in your face thing that everyone will bear.

You can bubble yourself pretty well regardless of paying for access to something.
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Offline DQ12

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #318 on: November 22, 2017, 12:34:38 PM »
Is there a reason these doomsday scenarios didn't happen prior to the current regs?


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Offline Dugout DickStone

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #319 on: November 22, 2017, 12:46:43 PM »
I like my internet completely unregulated and more than slightly scary.

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #320 on: November 22, 2017, 12:48:11 PM »
Is there a reason these doomsday scenarios didn't happen prior to the current regs?

the internet is only like 20 years old bruh
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Offline cfbandyman

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #321 on: November 22, 2017, 12:50:03 PM »
Is there a reason these doomsday scenarios didn't happen prior to the current regs?

I am going to venture that if we only hopped back 10-15 years ago the internet wasn't as ubiquitous of an item compared to the sales and money and traffic it has now. I am just guessing that a provider like Time Warner sat there and was like "yeah, we make all our $$ on cable, internet is a nice bump" and when people didn't want cable anymore and you could stream shows, movies, etc over the internet, the ball game changed. I mean, you have to remember something like Netflix was a mailing DVD service at first, and it was that not because they loved DVDs but because it was incapable of providing streaming service with 2007 internet for most people.

Basically, you couldn't do on the internet then what you can now, so tiering it would've been more of a why bother, rather than a why not. I hope you get that 125kB email 0.5 seconds faster.
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The Big Train

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #322 on: November 22, 2017, 12:51:01 PM »
Is there a reason these doomsday scenarios didn't happen prior to the current regs?

the internet is only like 20 years old bruh

Actually the public internet is about 28 and a half years old.  The internet itself is about 48 years old.

Offline DQ12

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #323 on: November 22, 2017, 12:53:46 PM »
was the internet really that different in 2015 when Title II was enacted?  i'm more than willing to join in the outrage here, i'm just not sure what we're outraged about.


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The Big Train

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Re: Hopefully An Issue We Can Get Some Bi-Partisan Agreement On
« Reply #324 on: November 22, 2017, 12:56:00 PM »
Is there a reason these doomsday scenarios didn't happen prior to the current regs?

I am going to venture that if we only hopped back 10-15 years ago the internet wasn't as ubiquitous of an item compared to the sales and money and traffic it has now. I am just guessing that a provider like Time Warner sat there and was like "yeah, we make all our $$ on cable, internet is a nice bump" and when people didn't want cable anymore and you could stream shows, movies, etc over the internet, the ball game changed. I mean, you have to remember something like Netflix was a mailing DVD service at first, and it was that not because they loved DVDs but because it was incapable of providing streaming service with 2007 internet for most people.

Basically, you couldn't do on the internet then what you can now, so tiering it would've been more of a why bother, rather than a why not. I hope you get that 125kB email 0.5 seconds faster.

Here are some hard statistics that support this point.  The amount of data and potential market if they undo net neutrality is staggering.

https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/solutions/collateral/service-provider/visual-networking-index-vni/vni-hyperconnectivity-wp.html