Author Topic: Israel - Hamas peace process  (Read 63384 times)

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Offline wetwillie

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #50 on: July 21, 2014, 08:02:39 PM »
Man the native american bit was just icing on the cake
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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #51 on: July 21, 2014, 08:06:46 PM »
Totally reasonable.  Totally sane.

Also today Rosenbaum wrote this (WSJ is paywall protected, but has been excerpted on twitter):


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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #52 on: July 21, 2014, 08:07:35 PM »
GREENHOUSES

Offline michigancat

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #53 on: July 21, 2014, 08:29:47 PM »
He seems like a very bad person.

Offline Spracne

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #54 on: July 21, 2014, 08:53:12 PM »
Rosenbaum, huh? Welp, big gulps, eh?

Offline sys

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #55 on: July 21, 2014, 09:18:33 PM »
Yep.  The isreali-palestinian conflict.  An open-shut case if there ever was one.

other than mispelling israeli, this was a great post that did a great job of making about 95% of the previous posts look like crap.
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Offline Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #56 on: July 21, 2014, 09:42:08 PM »

My history is a little hazy, but didn't the Israelis voluntary evict themselves from Gaza about a decade ago? I think they made all the settlers leave, left thousands of greenhouses in place for the palestinians, and gave them millions in aid? And then the palestinians tore down the greenhouses, built a massive tunnel network, and started firing rockets at Israel? That happened, right?

Yep sounds like you have a solid grasp on all he ins and outs of life in Gaza.  Greenhouses and millions in aid for all.

Wait, are you denying the Palestinians destroyed what was beautiful Gaza in about 3 months?
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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #57 on: July 21, 2014, 09:50:50 PM »
I understand the sitch is complicated, but how anyone could sympathize with the Palestinians over the Jews is the only insane thing in this thread. 2000+ years of persecution and slaughter compared with centuries of agitation, intolerance and waste.
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Offline Cire

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #58 on: July 21, 2014, 09:51:52 PM »
Israel hating is pretty hipster these days

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #59 on: July 21, 2014, 09:57:04 PM »
I understand the sitch is complicated, but how anyone could sympathize with the Palestinians over the Jews is the only insane thing in this thread. 2000+ years of persecution and slaughter compared with centuries of agitation, intolerance and waste.

I absolutely sympathize with Jews and with Israel.  I have family that lives there.  I just think their current political and military strategic thinking is disastrous for Israel's future as a Western democracy and a Jewish state.

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #60 on: July 21, 2014, 10:04:50 PM »
Never understood what the Palestinians beef with Israel is.

This should sum it up...

http://youtu.be/8EDW88CBo-8

well that seems a little biased

Yeah, Dennis Prager might not be the most unbiased source.

Quote
On November 28, 2006, Dennis Prager wrote that Keith Ellison, the first Muslim elected to Congress, should not be allowed to take his Congressional oath using a Koran because "the act undermines American civilization."

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #61 on: July 21, 2014, 10:08:34 PM »
I understand the sitch is complicated, but how anyone could sympathize with the Palestinians over the Jews is the only insane thing in this thread. 2000+ years of persecution and slaughter compared with centuries of agitation, intolerance and waste.

I absolutely sympathize with Jews and with Israel.  I have family that lives there.  I just think their current political and military strategic thinking is disastrous for Israel's future as a Western democracy and a Jewish state.

Why do you think that? Skinny jeans?
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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #62 on: July 21, 2014, 10:12:41 PM »
I understand the sitch is complicated, but how anyone could sympathize with the Palestinians over the Jews is the only insane thing in this thread. 2000+ years of persecution and slaughter compared with centuries of agitation, intolerance and waste.

I absolutely sympathize with Jews and with Israel.  I have family that lives there.  I just think their current political and military strategic thinking is disastrous for Israel's future as a Western democracy and a Jewish state.

Why do you think that? Skinny jeans?

Yup.  Skinny jean kufiya cut off the oxygen supply to my brain.

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #63 on: July 21, 2014, 10:17:45 PM »
Please explain why what Israel is doing now is going to doom it as compared to what it did before?
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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #64 on: July 21, 2014, 10:23:14 PM »
Israel is never going to be able to negotiate an internationally recognized final status peace settlement without international support and they are needlessly squandering their international reputation with all the civilian casualties and Netanyahu's stupid rhetoric.  I also think that the longer the West Bank settlements grow enmeshed, the more complicated the negotiations for a land for peace swap become.  I also don't particularly like the way in which war and a siege mentality has permeated Israeli political culture and I think that makes it increasingly unlikely for the kinds of grand magnanimous and optimistic gestures that leaders like Peres, Rabin and Barak undertook.

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #65 on: July 21, 2014, 10:31:23 PM »
Did you know Israel is getting bombed? Did you know the Jews have been on the run for 2 centuries? Your rhetoric ignores the reality they've been living for hundreds of generations.




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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #66 on: July 21, 2014, 10:43:17 PM »
Did you know Israel is getting bombed? Did you know the Jews have been on the run for 2 centuries? Your rhetoric ignores the reality they've been living for hundreds of generations.

The rocket attacks are bad, no doubt about it.  They are also a huge improvement over the constant actual bombings during the second intifada.  The security wall has brought temporary peace, Iron Dome has brought some measure of relief, but it is ultimately a political problem that needs strategic political thinking.

Israel is not weak and Jews can make their home in the US or Israel and enjoy an incredibly free and open expression of their faith (voted most popular religious group by Pew poll respondents in 2014!).  There is no doubt that there are parts of Europe where you cannot say the same thing and anti-Semitism should absolutely be called out.  But I think it is counter productive to claim that Jewish people are currently "on the run" if that is what you are doing.

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #67 on: July 21, 2014, 11:00:17 PM »
Okay.
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Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #68 on: July 21, 2014, 11:27:22 PM »
Did you know Israel is getting bombed? Did you know the Jews have been on the run for 2 centuries? Your rhetoric ignores the reality they've been living for hundreds of generations.

The rocket attacks are bad, no doubt about it.  They are also a huge improvement over the constant actual bombings during the second intifada.  The security wall has brought temporary peace, Iron Dome has brought some measure of relief, but it is ultimately a political problem that needs strategic political thinking.

Israel is not weak and Jews can make their home in the US or Israel and enjoy an incredibly free and open expression of their faith (voted most popular religious group by Pew poll respondents in 2014!).  There is no doubt that there are parts of Europe where you cannot say the same thing and anti-Semitism should absolutely be called out.  But I think it is counter productive to claim that Jewish people are currently "on the run" if that is what you are doing.

Says the guy who's not having rockets fired at his house. I guess that helps you be objective though.
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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #69 on: July 21, 2014, 11:54:54 PM »
Did you know Israel is getting bombed? Did you know the Jews have been on the run for 2 centuries? Your rhetoric ignores the reality they've been living for hundreds of generations.

The rocket attacks are bad, no doubt about it.  They are also a huge improvement over the constant actual bombings during the second intifada.  The security wall has brought temporary peace, Iron Dome has brought some measure of relief, but it is ultimately a political problem that needs strategic political thinking.

Israel is not weak and Jews can make their home in the US or Israel and enjoy an incredibly free and open expression of their faith (voted most popular religious group by Pew poll respondents in 2014!).  There is no doubt that there are parts of Europe where you cannot say the same thing and anti-Semitism should absolutely be called out.  But I think it is counter productive to claim that Jewish people are currently "on the run" if that is what you are doing.

Says the guy who's not having rockets fired at his house. I guess that helps you be objective though.

I have not ever had a rocket fired at my house.  I also have never played professional baseball or had a #1 hit single but I still have opinions about those things too. 

I absolutely want Israel to win.  But I don't think the military objectives of this incursion can be achieved even on the terms that have been presented.  Just as Cast Lead has not led to enduring peace.  "Mowing the lawn" is failed strategic thinking.  I think that the way things have gone so far again highlight the difficulty of achieving a beneficial political solution with these tactics.

Hamas is temporarily weakened militarily, the population either rallies back around Hamas or other more extreme actors, the total blockade of Gaza continues to justify whatever gains are made and the cycle continues.

Offline DQ12

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #70 on: July 22, 2014, 12:00:43 AM »
Yep.  The isreali-palestinian conflict.  An open-shut case if there ever was one.

other than mispelling israeli, this was a great post that did a great job of making about 95% of the previous posts look like crap.
other than misspelling "mispelling," this too was a great post.


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Offline EllRobersonisInnocent

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #71 on: July 22, 2014, 12:07:36 AM »
lol

Offline sys

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #72 on: July 22, 2014, 01:10:47 AM »
Yep.  The isreali-palestinian conflict.  An open-shut case if there ever was one.

other than mispelling israeli, this was a great post that did a great job of making about 95% of the previous posts look like crap.
other than misspelling "mispelling," this too was a great post.

 :Ugh:
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

Offline felix rex

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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #73 on: July 22, 2014, 01:12:11 AM »
I have enjoyed this thread
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Re: Israel - Hamas peace process
« Reply #74 on: July 22, 2014, 06:55:23 AM »
Did you know Israel is getting bombed? Did you know the Jews have been on the run for 2 centuries? Your rhetoric ignores the reality they've been living for hundreds of generations.

The rocket attacks are bad, no doubt about it.  They are also a huge improvement over the constant actual bombings during the second intifada.  The security wall has brought temporary peace, Iron Dome has brought some measure of relief, but it is ultimately a political problem that needs strategic political thinking.

Israel is not weak and Jews can make their home in the US or Israel and enjoy an incredibly free and open expression of their faith (voted most popular religious group by Pew poll respondents in 2014!).  There is no doubt that there are parts of Europe where you cannot say the same thing and anti-Semitism should absolutely be called out.  But I think it is counter productive to claim that Jewish people are currently "on the run" if that is what you are doing.

Says the guy who's not having rockets fired at his house. I guess that helps you be objective though.

I have not ever had a rocket fired at my house.  I also have never played professional baseball or had a #1 hit single but I still have opinions about those things too. 

:lol: Nice. I'd love to see a video of you going door to door in a settlement near Gaza (between rocket launches) telling Israelis that they need to be more strategic!

Sounds like the Israelis need to focus on stopping the palestinians from getting weapons instead of stifling commerce with blockades, inspections, etc. Evidently, the rockets are being grown organically in the converted greenhouses. Who knew?

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